Opinions! Curious on others thoughts on the best riders

[Bellebelle]

So, I has a pretty heated debate with someone about eventers, dressage riders, and jumpers. I personally think, and this is in no way shape or form a diss at dressage riders or any other discipline, but I think eventers are the best riders of the english discipline. I also know a lot of jumpers at least used to be eventers (can’t remember who though). Now, I’m a jumper myself but watching eventers just ride my own discipline and besides that doing pretty high level dressage (not grand prix) AND cross country leaves me stunned.

I would love to hear others thoughts on this! Its free range, but I promise i didn’t mean to offend anyone.

[mmeqcenter]

Hot topic, indeed.

I think there are great and poor riders in all disciplines, and it is absurd to say that one discipline’s riders are “best overall.”

Most upper level jumpers do quite a lot of dressage work at home, they just don’t compete in dressage.
Plenty are perfectly capable of running XC, they just don’t want to.
Eventers can cry all they want about the “hunter-lay” (overdone two point, chest close to or touching the neck), but IMO the “eventer-stand” (behind the motion, riding every single fence in SJ and XC like a drop) is just as awful, if not worse.

[Bellebelle]

I do agree on most of your points! I 100% agree that if any riders wants to actually ride you need to know dressage and both exaggerated types of positioning , like excessive two pointing or hunterlay and/or excessive eventer stand can be awful and even hurtful/annoying to the horse but I don’t know. I just thought that since eventers do everything to a pretty advanced level they seem pretty well rounded but I do agree there is good or bad in every discipline.

But I do think your take on it shows a lot of points I hadn’t considered!

[mmeqcenter]

It’s a big leap to assume that, just because someone doesn’t compete in another or multiple disciplines, they’re not “well rounded” and don’t actively ride other disciplines. For example, I know someone that competes dressage, but has a blast cutting cows a couple times a year just for the heck of it.

A USEA Advanced dressage test is roughly equivalent to USDF Third Level. Not that it’s not an admirable goal even for a rider only doing dressage, but, as far as “advanced levels” go, Third is not considered upper level. “Pure” dressage continues on to Fourth, I1, I2, PSG, and Grand Prix.
Jump heights at Advanced are ~3’11’ (or at least were, IDK how much it’s changed with the change of 4* to 5*). Definitely, no small feat especially with solid fences, but in comparison, SJ goes to 5’3’’, six-bar competitions even higher. The difference in riding a <4’ course and a 5’3’’ course is pretty considerable, both for the horse and the rider.
XC is just a completely different ballgame, especially these days. You could certainly argue that, due to XC, eventers are likely among the most physically fit group of riders in general, but that doesn’t directly correlate to them being “the best riders.”

[Bellebelle]

Yeah, I’m not 100% familiar with USDF dressage levels as much (I’m a mexican rider), but from what you’ve explained I can see why third level isn’t advanced.

I know that its not exactly gran prix but I simply thought that since eventers do three different ‘sports’ or ‘disciplines’ and are expected to be good at all three, good enough to compete, they can be considered some of the more well rounded disciplines. Of course there are exceptions or people who out of their competing discipline they do other, like I personally do cow cutting (not sure if thats how you say it in english) and XC on the side but not competitively, but as a general rule all eventers have to do three different disciplines. But its simply my point of view I can totally get where you’re coming from though.

[Dutchmare433]

@Bellebelle

Yeah, I’m not 100% familiar with USDF dressage levels as much (I’m a mexican rider), but from what you’ve explained I can see why third level isn’t advanced.

I know that its not exactly gran prix but I simply thought that since eventers do three different ‘sports’ or ‘disciplines’ and are expected to be good at all three, good enough to compete, they can be considered some of the more well rounded disciplines. Of course there are exceptions or people who out of their competing discipline they do other, like I personally do cow cutting (not sure if thats how you say it in english) and XC on the side but not competitively, but as a general rule all eventers have to do three different disciplines. But its simply my point of view I can totally get where you’re coming from though.

I’m not sure you’ll get exactly the replies you want on the Dressage Forum re: this question.

FWIW Mexico (and Canada, South and Central America, and the Island Nations) uses the USDF dressage tests. Training through 4th level. The FEI tests (PSG-GP) are used world wide.

[Bellebelle]

I had no idea! Wow, I should probably get to reading more on dressage official rules and tests then. Thank you very much!

[xQHDQ]

It also depends on what you mean by “best.” I would contend that eventers are the bravest, but best? Don’t know.

[Nous]

Oh I don’t know, I’ve seen the occasional dressage rider sitting out a rodeo from a candidate dressage horse, and they’re brave enough to get on a second time!

[Willesdon]

“Best” isn’t perhaps the right word. There are bad, poor, ok, good, really good and truly amazing riders in all disciplines. It doesn’t really matter in which one but sometimes - rarely - one sees a combination of horse and rider that take your breath and hold your eye because they are just so beautiful together.

In show jumping, the top riders keep their horses balanced and forward whilst jumping 1.40 upwards, often in a tight space. Moreover, the top horsemen keep their horses sound and sane over months of long journeys, varied going and intense competition. They also have an ability to find and bring on youngsters, right up to the highest level.

In eventing, preparing a horse for top level competition at 4* and 5* involves years of training and development, with the necessary horsemanship to build fitness and stamina whilst carefully educating the horse in three disciplines. There are few eventing riders who have the unique skills to ride at speed for 11 minutes over 40 obstacles when each fence presents a different set of challenges. They have to have precision and control combined with an exuberant courage. Which is why there are few riders or horses able to compete at 5*. Best rider here might be the most effective one. I’ve seen some beautiful riders who never win a thing.

Dressage places perhaps the most emphasis on “best rider” since the horse mirrors the rider so clearly. But even the horse dancing to invisible aids before an adoring crowd of thousands has years of training and, ideally, a varied training regime carefully designed by someone with the interests of the horse in mind. Sometimes that horsemanship is combined with great riding as evidenced at the highest level. It is a different journey but the essentials of riding remain the same.

[supershorty628]

@Dutchmare433

I’m not sure you’ll get exactly the replies you want on the Dressage Forum re: this question.

They didn’t get the answers they wanted on the H/J forum, so decided they’d cross-post it to dressage & eventing too since H/J was unwilling to take the bait.

[alibi_18]

@supershorty628

They didn’t get the answers they wanted on the H/J forum, so decided they’d cross-post it to dressage & eventing too since H/J was unwilling to take the bait.

So we, dressage riders, are the best!!!