OTTBs and “footsore” - normal or not?

[fivestrideline]

This is triggered by my endless browsing of sale ads and resellers - particularly one that churns out a ton of OTTBs from the track and other homes. It is also triggered a bit by a few other threads on shopping.

In the past as a WS, we used to get tons of OTTBs from the track - some in better shape than others. It was expected that they would be tight and inflexible, and often pretty footsore if they showed up without shoes. This wasn’t a cause for alarm, but it was also years ago and we tended to ride through stuff that I would probably have the vet out for now.

Anyways, as a buyer the general advice is to walk away from anything that is off in the trial. I agree with this generally, but as I’ve been scrolling I’ve noticed a theme from resellers of basically shrugging off footsoreness as a fact of life with OTTBs. Even the ones that don’t resolve immediately with shoes.

Similarly, we’ve pulled shoes on some for various reasons and had to resort to boots because the horse was crippled without protection. No other contributing problems, though the bruising on the hooves took a while to grow out.

So I guess I’m wondering if this is a very common ailment for people who deal with fresh OTTBs. I am looking for sound for myself, but I do wonder how much the shrugging off of clearly sore horses is a sale tactic (ie he’s a TB, of course he’s got bad feet!), or just one of the many things that make OTTBs “projects”.

[JB]

@fivestrideline

I’ve noticed a theme from resellers of basically shrugging off footsoreness as a fact of life with OTTBs. Even the ones that don’t resolve immediately with shoes.

@fivestrideline

I do wonder how much the shrugging off of clearly sore horses is a sale tactic (ie he’s a TB, of course he’s got bad feet!), or just one of the many things that make OTTBs “projects”.

Any horse whose feet aren’t healthy to start with, are almost guaranteed to be sore when shoes come off AND the footing isn’t suitable for the state the feet are in.

It just happens that OTs so so very often have poor feet, whether it’s that damned LTLH that “helps them take a bigger stride”, or the actual genetics of poorly bred (from a hoof perspective) horses, or simply the fact that their feet have never been on anything but great footing for training and racing.

But there are LOTS of TBs with excellent feet also coming OT. A LOTS of them get properly transitioned out of shoes by first fixing the trim so the feet are healthier, improving their diet (because high starch diets are not hoof-friendly), and doing all the right things.

It’s just more complicated than it seems on the surface. IMHO I think any foot sore horse should get a baseline set of xrays to see sole depth, HPA, etc.

[fivestrideline]

@JB

It’s just more complicated than it seems on the surface. IMHO I think any foot sore horse should get a baseline set of xrays to see sole depth, HPA, etc.

Mine get these as a matter of course - cheaper than “guessing” with the farrier.

I wish more resellers took the time to really take care of the horses’ feet. One near me just keeps them in regular shoes all around, which to me is at least better than pulling shoes and hoping for the best.

[JB]

I wish more OWNERS would take the time to really care for the feet

I get it that too many simply don’t have the quality of farriers/trimmers that others do, and that alone makes it incredibly difficult. Sometimes shoes are the only thing that keeps a horse servicably sound because nobody can trim well enough to get the horse out of shoes.

But others just blindly go about their uneducated days with feet that are just so, so bad

[fivestrideline]

Trust me… it hurts to see. And I see ouchy horses all over the trails here - with owners happily proclaiming that their horses have “never taken a lame step!!”. Just because it isn’t head bobbing doesn’t make it sound.

[WNT]

Yeah, when they’re sore in multiple feet, they don’t obviously favor one so they don’t look gimpy as they would otherwise but they’re still lame.

Regarding the original question, it shouldn’t be “normal” but it seems to be “it is what it is” with a lot of OTTBs. I bought one with a gnarly quarter crack and classic long toe-underrun heel but had my farrier and vet evaluate him before purchase. The underlying structure was good and he was sound barefoot on soft footing. I took the risk and it worked out with time and proper management, he had completely different feet within a year.

[JB]

@fivestrideline

Just because it isn’t head bobbing doesn’t make it sound

this is the real root of the problem, way too many people don’t understand “not sound”. They think it’s about head or hip bobbing, end of story.

[fivestrideline]

@WNT

Regarding the original question, it shouldn’t be “normal” but it seems to be “it is what it is” with a lot of OTTBs. I bought one with a gnarly quarter crack and classic long toe-underrun heel but had my farrier and vet evaluate him before purchase. The underlying structure was good and he was sound barefoot on soft footing.

Yeah I see a lot like this. To me, if it’s sound on grass or soft footing I’m more inclined to take a chance. It’s the ones I see that are deemed as “quiet” and seem… off even in soft footing or on a circle that make me go hmmmmm.

I guess it comes down to risk tolerance but I do see a ton of crappy feet and NQR-but-not-head-bobbing horses freshly restarted. It was some of the more prolific sale barns brushing off the footiness that surprised me - I wouldn’t advertise a horse that’s not sound, but I also don’t handle the volume of OTTBs some of these places do so my experience is different. I expect that getting them straight from the race trainer gets you a lottery of soundness (that was my experience!) but to advertise some restarts despite the tenderness? Hence the topic - I’m wondering if I’m being naive about it.

[Scribbler]

@fivestrideline

@WNT

Regarding the original question, it shouldn’t be “normal” but it seems to be “it is what it is” with a lot of OTTBs. I bought one with a gnarly quarter crack and classic long toe-underrun heel but had my farrier and vet evaluate him before purchase. The underlying structure was good and he was sound barefoot on soft footing.

Yeah I see a lot like this. To me, if it’s sound on grass or soft footing I’m more inclined to take a chance. It’s the ones I see that are deemed as “quiet” and seem… off even in soft footing or on a circle that make me go hmmmmm.

I guess it comes down to risk tolerance but I do see a ton of crappy feet and NQR-but-not-head-bobbing horses freshly restarted. It was some of the more prolific sale barns brushing off the footiness that surprised me - I wouldn’t advertise a horse that’s not sound, but I also don’t handle the volume of OTTBs some of these places do so my experience is different. I expect that getting them straight from the race trainer gets you a lottery of soundness (that was my experience!) but to advertise some restarts despite the tenderness? Hence the topic - I’m wondering if I’m being naive about it.

I can’t quite understand why an experienced OTTB flipper wouldn’t do the minimum to get a horse looking serviceably sound for sale. Like a trim and shoes. I’m a barefoot person these days, and I have learned through experience that most barefoot horses need boots at least some of the time, at least on front, especially if they live on soft footing and trail ride on gravel or rocks. Ironically I see more trail riders wanting to go barefoot and more arena riders wanting 4 shoes all around, go figure.

But if you aren’t doing a proper barefoot rehab or letdown, I see no value in leaving an OTTB barefoot and ouchy during reschooling and sales.

I would also say that a horse that is ouchy in an arena has way more going on than just “needs shoes.” I pop Scoot boots on my mare for big trail rides but she needs nothing for the arena. If she’s off she’s brewing an abscess!

So I wonder if resellers leave their horses barefoot so there’s a plausible excuse for being foot sore. Because if he is footsore in a nice arena barefoot he is likely going to still be off in shoes. I certainly see enough horses off in shoes!

[luvmyhackney]

I live across the street from a decent sized TB training/breeding farm. Literally can see 12-13 yearlings from my porch. They are all sound, barefoot, and have decent feet. The other side is all mares, 12-15 mares in the field and all are barefoot, I’ve only seen one or two that was a bit off, but looked more stifle related vs feet.

I really think its the track farriers more than the horses having crappy feet.

[NancyM]

Horses coming off the track and offered for sale may well be foot sore AND body sore. They are horses at the end of their racing career, and have often been asked to work HARD, in an attempt to earn just a bit more money before they are being sold. They run FAST, the track surface may or may not be ideal. They may be entered back too quickly from their previous race, if the meet is ending, or if the owner is “pulling the plug” by a certain date. It may not be an “ideal” time in this horse’s life. These are not riding horses, who have been making a living trotting around a riding ring for fun.

Horses at the track and racing regularly are usually reshod every four to five weeks. The shoes wear out quicker than the feet grow. The aluminium shoes can spread easily, or come loose. This can be the source of bruising and soreness in the feet, they simply don’t have enough horn that grows between shoeings to protect the feet from the concussion at high speed.

It is safest to presume that the horse may have some bruising in his feet (whether that is due to poor shoeing or not). Presume that he is muscle sore. He may have some heat or soreness in joints. He has been asked to participate in the MOST demanding equine discipline for some period of time. He may have had connections (owners or trainers) who were not overly concerned with the horse’s long term best interests. If you like the horse, have been watching him for a while, you may have been able to see him in a fresher state. But he was likely not for sale at that point.

This is why it is important to get to know the horsemen at the track. Know who you are buying a horse from. Who to trust (a bit), and who to avoid. Who to talk to about the horse, to gain any inside info. There are people that you would probably not want to buy a cast off from, unless you consider yourself a “rescue”.

Keep in mind that big, sound geldings are less likely to be in your price range, since the chuckwagon guys will pay more for those than you will. Mares are more affordable, because the chucks don’t want those. They also aren’t so keen to buy the smaller geldings, or the slow ones. Or the lame ones. The chuckwagon guys have a GOOD relationship with trainers, they are often return customers. They will get first pick of the ones they might be interested in. Not you. They buy the horse, take him home to the ranch and turn him out for a few months to recover from whatever soreness the horse may be experiencing. Not a bad idea.

Just because a horse has a race career ending injury doesn’t mean that he wouldn’t be a good candidate for you. Know what injuries you can accept and which you can’t. And yes, he may need some R and R before you start your retraining regime. And that’s OK. That’s why this is still an affordable place to go shopping for your next mount.

[Scribbler]

Someone from our barn was out horse shopping in Alberta and said there were horses who started as OTTB, went to chuck wagon, and were now getting rehabbed/ reschooled for a third career as a riding horse at age 10 or 12. They talked to someone who was trying to start up a rehoming organization for ex chuckwagon horses.

I must say from what I’ve seen on TV and IRL, the chuckwagon horses are good looking horses.

[dmveventer]

@fivestrideline

I guess it comes down to risk tolerance

This is exactly it. There’s more risk involved for fresh OTTBs than there is with horses farther along in their careers, even just by a few months. It takes an experienced eye and some luck to tell which ones just need some time to adjust to their new life and which ones have bigger problems. It’s not unusual for resellers to try to keep the horses moving so they get off the barn’s payroll, if they think it’s just normal soreness I don’t really see an issue with that as long as they’re up front about it. The good ones will be candid about the potential risks and you can decide what you’re comfortable with, but they can’t make any promises.