The top half of the arena seemed less than full but it was a jam up getting out of the parking lot–made me think there were more people then than I realized! (I loved Goutal’s horse…such classic form and style over fences…but there were alot of horses to like!)
[QUOTE=Darkwave;7225941]
Seems like WIHS is trying to go that direction with stuff like mutton busting and shetland steeplechase (you would NOT believe how excited my boyfriend is about the latter). I’m really hoping it works.[/QUOTE]
The Shetland Pony Grand National is awesome. I do hope it takes off in the US.
To touch on the vendors’ jacked up prices - $995 show coats? They were beautiful…but come on.
[QUOTE=Snowfox;7225910]
Because he has more money then ability and should be ripped off of his horses post haste. He is what is wrong with our sport.[/QUOTE]
Seriously? A sponsor of professional GP horses who has been enjoying himself riding in just the adults at the big shows for about two decades, supporting the industry, horse sales, and professional riders and trainers, while being a great sport about his average ability? Bad sportsmanship is what’s wrong with our sport, not people like him.
[QUOTE=CBoylen;7226004]
Seriously? A sponsor of professional GP horses who has been enjoying himself riding in just the adults at the big shows for about two decades, supporting the industry, horse sales, and professional riders and trainers, while being a great sport about his average ability? Bad sportsmanship is what’s wrong with our sport, not people like him.[/QUOTE]
Agreed. Jeese, Snowfox. Judgmental much? Here’s the thing about expensive upper level horses - they’re not easy. Money means nothing if you can’t put a course together. Sorry.
I cannot stand the money argument.
I just looked up a video of him and he seems to be a kind rider, regardless of his unorthodox position. In the video I watched, at least, he gave ample release and stayed out of his horse’s way over the jumps. A little wiggly in between, but by far not the worst I’ve ever seen!
[QUOTE=CBoylen;7226004]
Seriously? A sponsor of professional GP horses who has been enjoying himself riding in just the adults at the big shows for about two decades, supporting the industry, horse sales, and professional riders and trainers, while being a great sport about his average ability? Bad sportsmanship is what’s wrong with our sport, not people like him.[/QUOTE]
Well, I understand the point Snowfox is trying to make… It’s one thing to have an unorthodox position if you’re Richard Spooner, but the rider in question looked like he should be trotting crossrails for awhile, not competing in NAL Finals. I was left seriously wondering if there was some medical reason he couldn’t close his knee angle.
[QUOTE=Laurierace;7225286]
I attended my 24th consecutive Penn National Horse Show this week. Back when we lived in Harrisburg I attended every day either as a spectator or as a volunteer for a horse rescue. Once we moved to to Maryland I cut it down to a few times per show but still made the trek. The Penn National Horse show is DYING. The decline has been coming on for years but it really hit home last night.
The vendor spots used to be completely full, now they are maybe 1/4 full. Grand Prix night used to be so crowded you could hardly move through the hallways. Last night the halls were virtually deserted. So few people attended that the Kiwanis volunteer ushers didn’t even bother to show up. The vendors were in the process of packing up as the small crowd arrived so the crowd couldn’t shop if they wanted to. They were gone by the time the Grand Prix ended. Contrast that with the Pennsylvania horse expo that aside from a few clinicians is nothing but shopping, mostly for cheap crap, but shopping nonetheless and the place is so packed they have to bus people in from the parking lot of the community college. With the exception of last night when they jacked the the general admission up to $20 from $15 the price is exactly the same as the expo. The vendors that were there were clearly catering to the exhibitors with tons of disposable income as they made no effort whatsoever to keep their prices even remotely in line with Dover, Smartpak etc.
The farm show building is one of my top three places on earth and it saddens me to see the steady decline. As near as I can tell the amount of exhibitors is roughly the same but I don’t know if they can survive on exhibitor income alone.[/QUOTE]
I went for the Grand Prix for 13 years, last year being my last. After a few years of going for the GP I also went for Open Jumper speed day and Gambler Choicer eventually just going for the GC and GP. Back in 2000 when I first went for the GP the tickets we bought were only $25 a head, over the years the same tickets went up to $50 a head (we had the same seats for 13 years). Over the years the crowed started getting less and less to the point that it was a very small crowd last year, as it was this year. A few jumper riders stopped coming (Laura Kraut being one), which was sad to see. I venders jacked up their prices so high that only the rich can afford them. The whole thing pains me as Harrisburg has always been my favorite show. It’ll be a sad day if the show ends.
I guess they’re making spectators pay for the expensive footing that they couldn’t afford to put in. 
[QUOTE=Snowfox;7225910]
Because he has more money then ability and should be ripped off of his horses post haste. He is what is wrong with our sport.[/QUOTE]
So I decided to watch the video because this comment was so over the top and I actually had never watched him ride. While I acknowledge his position is definitely unorthodox, his release and ability to stay with his horse is commendable. His adorable horse didn’t look the least bit bothered to do his job (which looks to be suitably below his pay grade) and appeared happy and healthy.
As a generous benefactor of the big horses we love to watch, I’d say he is what’s right with this sport.
I should add…if someone could actually get his leg underneath him, he would actually ride just fine and it would probably be much less work that’s for sure.
[QUOTE=Sometimes;7226097]
So I decided to watch the video because this comment was so over the top and I actually had never watched him ride. While I acknowledge his position is definitely unorthodox, his release and ability to stay with his horse is commendable. His adorable horse didn’t look the least bit bothered to do his job (which looks to be suitably below his pay grade) and appeared happy and healthy.
As a generous benefactor of the big horses we love to watch, I’d say he is what’s right with this sport.
I should add…if someone could actually get his leg underneath him, he would actually ride just fine and it would probably be much less work that’s for sure.[/QUOTE]
Exactly. I think we need to remember that this is FOR FUN! He’s not hurting anyone, he’s not hurting his horse… good for him.
[QUOTE=harrisburgrules;7226116]
Exactly. I think we need to remember that this is FOR FUN! He’s not hurting anyone, he’s not hurting his horse… good for him.[/QUOTE]
I agree with this, but SO many people here spend so much time lamenting about how riders these days move up so quickly without any regard for the basics. Does that go out the window just because someone can buy nice horses and is an ambassador for the sport?
[QUOTE=Tha Ridge;7226131]
I agree with this, but SO many people here spend so much time lamenting about how riders these days move up so quickly without any regard for the basics. Does that go out the window just because someone can buy nice horses and is an ambassador for the sport?[/QUOTE]
I just think there’s a difference between moving up before mastering lower level skills and being sloppy, and moving up too soon and being dangerous/harmful to the horse. If you want to move up and be a mess, you aren’t going to win. Who is it honestly hurting if someone moves up without being QUITE ready? I dunno… I just see it as an individual choice I guess. Not hurting anyone
[QUOTE=harrisburgrules;7226150]
I just think there’s a difference between moving up before mastering lower level skills and being sloppy, and moving up too soon and being dangerous/harmful to the horse. If you want to move up and be a mess, you aren’t going to win. Who is it honestly hurting if someone moves up without being QUITE ready? I dunno… I just see it as an individual choice I guess. Not hurting anyone[/QUOTE]
I agree, but it just seems like you’re damned if you do and you’re damned if you don’t on these boards. :lol:
Some people blow apart a 16-year-old kid from average means on a Thoroughbred for her first (average) trip in the Medal Finals, but then want to give this guy a gold star and a pass just because he has money to buy nice horses to pack him around and is a (financial) supporter of the sport. Not saying that it’s the same people, but it’s just a strange dichotomy.
I think that what a lot of people forget is that this board is a collection of individual thoughts. It’s easy to say, “well, they ripped apart X and wanted to give a gold medal to Y!” but you have to remember that people who post on one thread with one opinion aren’t necessarily the same people who post on another with another opinion.
For what it’s worth, I posted on both threads. You can see my opinions, and they don’t conflict.
[QUOTE=Tha Ridge;7226164]
I agree, but it just seems like you’re damned if you do and you’re damned if you don’t on these boards. :lol:
Some people blow apart a 16-year-old kid from average means on a Thoroughbred for her first (average) trip in the Medal Finals, but then want to give this guy a gold star and a pass just because he has money to buy nice horses to pack him around and is a (financial) supporter of the sport. Not saying that it’s the same people, but it’s just a strange dichotomy.[/QUOTE]
Hahaha yes, very strange indeed! I am always tempted to give people the following lesson:
- You are not better than everyone else. Let’s see you get on that horse.
- You do not know more than everyone else.
- This is for fun. Not life or death. We aren’t saving lives here.
But I guess things would be much less interesting that way ha
[QUOTE=Tha Ridge;7226164]
I agree, but it just seems like you’re damned if you do and you’re damned if you don’t on these boards. :lol:
Some people blow apart a 16-year-old kid from average means on a Thoroughbred for her first (average) trip in the Medal Finals, but then want to give this guy a gold star and a pass just because he has money to buy nice horses to pack him around and is a (financial) supporter of the sport. Not saying that it’s the same people, but it’s just a strange dichotomy.[/QUOTE]
My posts on both are consistent, but I wasn’t handing out gold stars. They both are enjoying the sport, enjoying their horse and each looks happy to do its job. OK by me. They guy could definitely have a better position, but he is not what is wrong with our sport.
I am well aquatinted with Ahmed Alali. He’s a perfectly fine person, and I appreciate the money he puts into the sport but that does not give him a pass on riding above his ability. He regularly catches his horses mouths and bangs around on their backs.
I happened to see the person in question ride a few weeks ago when his horse was having an off day and misbehaving. It was nice to see him pat the horse, try again, and come out with a huge smile. He is not a dangerous rider, and he clearly really enjoys his lovely horses.
I also heard his name announced as sponsor for the Pony Jumpers, which I’m sure is a division which is hard to find sponsors for due to lack of interest. Keep on keepin on, Mr. Alali.
[QUOTE=Tha Ridge;7226131]
I agree with this, but SO many people here spend so much time lamenting about how riders these days move up so quickly without any regard for the basics. Does that go out the window just because someone can buy nice horses and is an ambassador for the sport?[/QUOTE]
Wait wait wait WHAAAAAT? Who is ever lamenting that anyone these days moves up too quickly? One of the most repeated complaints (and let’s face it, there are many) on this forum is that people don’t move past the 2’6 or 3’ division EVER.
Someone on this very thread was complaining up a storm that a certain very successful amateur is still riding in the amateur division, even though there isn’t a shred of evidence to suggest she does’t belong there.
Interesting. I had never heard of or seen Ahmet Alali before, so I just did a You Tube search and looked at his round on Crusader. LOVELY horse, beautifully conditioned, turned out and trained. The rider’s position is not terribly functional, he can’t really get out of the tack in two point, and sitting the canter correctly isn’t an option either. He does frequently come back in the tack and pick his hands up too early, but his horse seems to have learned to adjust and cope.
Most interesting to me is the rider’s eye - everytime he made an adjustment in front of a fence, he was dead right. (ETA - Just watched his round on the bay, Fenway, where he was dead wrong to the liverpool, the horse added and had a rail in front. Okay, that was a big miss and his nice horse saved his butt.) I have never seen this combination of poor position and a good eye for distance. Also, he has the ability to ride a very precise and correct track, something a lot of ammies struggle with. Again, I don’t how you develop that ability without a correct foundation, but he’s managed.
Ehhhhh. Would I like to see him combine his obvious talents with some correct basics? Sure. Is saying he’s “what’s wrong with the business” a gross overstatement? You betcha. Are there worse examples of bad or even abusive riding? YUP.
