PETA panties are wadded *originally re: docked tails on horses, train sidetracked & is now discussing dogs šŸ˜Ž

It seems the UK has it figured out. So, it looks like there isnā€™t a valid reason to continue this practice. We need to follow suit unless we want to look barbaric.

Same goes with ear cropping in dogs. No valid reason exists to do this. Hubby and I were interested in a Doberman but not one single credible breeder we contacted would sell us a pup that didnā€™t have a docked tail and the ears cropped. What the actual fire truck?

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The bumstrap is Breeching & serves to prevent the cart/carriage from running into the horse.
It is attached snugly, but loose enough to slide a hand beneath & held to the shafts with holdback straps that are wrapped tightly & limit the motion of the breeching, but it does move.
Strapping a tail to breeching would mean every movement of the breeching would be transmitted to the tail - like having someone pulling on your ponytail with every step.
Some styles of harness do not require breeching & are held to the shafts differently.

@endlessclimb That Clyde could have been docked, looked like it to me.

As to ā€œno 3rd gearā€:
Iā€™m assuming this horse was not trained specifically as a riding horse. Most hitch horses get used in all sorts of configurations - single to cart, team, tandem, unicorn, & the larger 4, 6 & 8 (or more) hitches - as well as being shown U/S.
Hitch horses do not canter in harness.
The exception is the Wheelers (closest to the Driver) in a hitch of 4 or more. They may take a single canter stride to get the wagon moving. Hitch wagons are heavy & Wheelers are the Muscle.

Like I said, doesnā€™t have to be tight, could have plenty of slack and would still work to physically make it impossible for the reins to go under. You could put a quick loop or two of a braid so the hair would hold it, then a piece of baling twine from the braid to the bum strap. Voila.

:woman_shrugging: Maybe.
Hitch Drivers, please chime in.

I wouldnā€™t do that. The breeching is the brakes for a cart. I wouldnā€™t do anything that could have any effect on its action. If I had a problem with a tail going over the line, I would braid it so it couldnā€™t.

Rebecca

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It is a reasonable question. But, the breeching moves a lot, as it is somewhat loose and is connected all the way up to the collar, so as a horse moves a shoulder forward the breeching does shift side to side. I think even a loose tie to the tail would quickly become an extreme irritant. Tails are remarkably sensitive, after all. And the tie would have to be pretty tight in order to stop the entire tail boneā€™s movement.
That being said. I agree completely there is little modern reason for docking show hitch horses. I really struggle to see how properly handled lines can get caught by a tail when being driven in a cart/hitch arrangement. As for the tail getting tangled and pinched in the traces (very likely if left loose and a very painful injury) we should be able to take the time in this day and age to braid them up, seeing as we arenā€™t trying to make the daily delivery schedule.
Tails, in my experience, catch lines when driven from low equipment (plows, cutters, and the like). That is something that can usually be dealt with if only because you arenā€™t going that fast. If the horse is trained well!!

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Was this meant for me in regards to my comment on the dressage video? If so, that horse is not docked :slight_smile: You can see the shaved tail bone sticking out from the short hair in this screenshot:

image

ETA a video that shows a close up of a natural tail all shaved up and being done up for competition: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3ZRM2CsfXY and an image from the video showing it in all its grossness (I have a thing about shaved tails even though I did my fair share of clipping even grosser cow tails! Cows are definitely worse though, they are much bonier than horse tails)

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That looks SO weird. Good eye. I think I would prefer either a mud knot braid or completely shaved rather than that look!

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The shaved tail looksā€¦inappropriate. What is the purpose?

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Yes, I was posting back to you.
But I have to agree with @B_and_B :stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes:

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To sort of keep the original look of a docked tail for showing? I dunno. Not a fan of the look.

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I was recently talking to my vet about tail docking and ear cropping. She said that while she doesnā€™t think itā€™s right, she does it when owners insist because she has seen enough nightmares when sketchy people have done it themselves. While itā€™s true that if it were illegal, you could fine anybody with a docked or cropped dog, but the reality is that the type of jerk who would do it illegally isnā€™t generally worried about getting caught.

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The main benefit to having a docked tail in dogs is not having to worry about shutting the door on the poor pups tail. Iā€™ve never actually done that but I always worry about it. My cat lost part of her tail in the chimney and my Manx cat was a stumpy. Neither seemed hindered by their missing tail.

I guess I donā€™t think cutting the tail is that cruel, except for the fly issue.

Love the dressage Clydesdale. Definitely not something you see every dayā€¦ And that canter!

As with anything new, it will be hard to get people to accept an undocked tailā€¦ Any major change in the way things are done is likely to ruffle some feathers. People can be very resistant to change.

After dealing with the Saddlebred farm, I thought the constant stalling, and use of tail sets was a far more horrendous sinā€¦ And the use of pads and special shoeing. I still want them to do away with Big Lick for walking horsesā€¦ There are bigger welfare issues then docking tails.

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Hell, what if the dog cuts his paw on a piece of glass?
Better amputate all 4 feet as a preventative.

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Wellā€¦
How many who declaw cats understand itā€™s an amputation?

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Genuinely curious - how do you feel about early dewclaw removal on dogs?

Thanks, I hate it. :sweat_smile: That is justā€¦strange looking.

It takes all of 5 minutes to explain that to a client (with diagrams, even!).
Iā€™m all in favor of prohibitions on routine declaws, and have been since before I went to vet school.
(When I worked at Angell as a tech, I vividly recall a surgeon flipping out on an unaware cat owner who wanted to have her cat declawed when it was spayed. He did apologize profusely afterwards.)

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Personally, unlikely to be necessary on most dogs.

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As long as they arenā€™t mostly detached and flopping away from the limb. Iā€™ve seen some in adult dogs that are just waiting to get caught on something and torn off. I think thatā€™s worse than early removal!

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