Peter Campbell - anyone do a clinic with him?

[Pocket_Pony]

I’ve been invited by some friends to go to a Peter Campbell clinic in the fall. I did the BB clinic an April and it was amazing. Then I just did a different clinic a couple weekends ago and it was not so amazing. I don’t want to waste my money going to something that doesn’t click with me or my horse - any comments on Peter’s style of teaching or his clinics?

What I loved about BB was how he described things very well - both the process of timing and feel and the purpose behind a movement. Then he put it back together again so I could understand the whys and hows of something. He was gentle with the horses and I liked his energy.

What I didn’t like about my last clinic was how the clinician’s energy got very aggressive and confrontational with the horses and how he didn’t make a lot of what he was doing very understandable. He “talked” about timing but didn’t actually show how to break it down and when to make x movement to affect your horse to make y movement.

So…any feedback?

[monstrpony]

From what I’ve heard, Peter Campbell knows his stuff, but is nowhere the teacher that Buck is. And he can be a little on the snarky side. This is second hand, but from a very reliable source. Maybe this would be a good one to audit.

[kewpalace]

I audited one of his clinics, a clinic that a friend of mine rode in. Yea, I’m not likely to do it again. He was “OK” teaching stylewise, although I got alot more of of the Buck clinic I audited. What grated me was his attitude. After the clinic was done for the 1st day, he made a BIG deal out of helping someone “on his own time” since the clinic was done for the day. He a point of saying that a few times. His assistant, who was not that near to where PC was, was talking with a clinic participant and PC laid into him that if he already knew everything, then he could go on talking rather than watch what PC was doing.

But the thing that really got me was: my friend & I were watching what was going on in the arena with Peter instructing the clinic participant (on his own time, mind you) and she said,“I think he’s trying to get her to do this”. I told her to go up and ask him - after all she was a paying clinic participant. So she did. She came back with a little dazed look; I asked her what he said. She said he said,“I could explain it to you but you wouldn’t understand.” :eek::no: How RUDE! Even if that were true (which I highly doubt), as a teacher he should have made an attempt at some explainantion. I went back the next day, but was pretty soured on the experience.

I know alot of people who are very adoring of him. But if he helps them, them more power to them. Yea, for me I’d pass on him.

[kewpalace]

[QUOTE=monstrpony;7073120]
he can be a little on the snarky side.[/QUOTE]I guess that’s what we got … yea, I’d not go see him again.

[QUOTE=Pocket Pony;7073096]What I didn’t like about my last clinic was … He “talked” about timing but didn’t actually show how to break it down and when to make x movement to affect your horse to make y movement.[/QUOTE]That’s what I thought of Peter Campbell too. I never really saw him demonstrate much, only tell people how to do things. I don’t think I ever saw him get his horse out of a walk.

[Fillabeana]

I’ve never been in person. All I’ve seen is some Eclectic Horseman magazine Horseman’s Gazette videos of Peter working an unhalter-broke filly.
He did a decent job, and ended up with the filly in a good place. But my opinion is that he doesn’t have anything like the chops that Buck does.

Mind you, though- there are only a VERY few clinicians out there who are truly getting their horses on a feel, and mentally in a good place. Peter did manage that with his filly in the video I saw.

Way too many of them learn the ‘tricks’, the ‘exercises’, and use them in a way that was never intended by the Dorrance brothers or Ray Hunt. They use the ‘exercises’ to get the horse to understand he has no other choice. Sort of like how Elizabeth Smart’s captor told her enough threatening lies that she just walked down the road with him, instead of calling the police/her family.
If you have the timing and aggression to do it, you can get a horse really compliant, but he will be fleeing your cues, trying like he!! to stay out of your way, so you don’t beat him up.

So, that Peter Campbell has the ability and the intention of getting a horse good mentally, and on a feel, is no small feat. But really, I’d audit just about anyone’s clinic before I rode in it.

Here is Tom Moates’ story about finding out that most of the ‘NH’ is not really about having that equality, that partnership, with your horse but a way for handsome (?) cowboy marketers to get $$ out of novice horse owners:
http://www.harrywhitney.com/sg_userfiles/Deconstruction.pdf

I’d ride with Bryan Neubert again in a heartbeat, and probably also his ‘kids’ Luke, Jim or Kate. I’d like to ride with Martin Black, Joe Wolter, Buster McLaury, Harry Whitney, Tom Curtin, Lee Smith.
I know they are the real deal.
But just about anybody else, I’d go watch first before paying money for the privilege of having somebody tell me to do something with my horse that I am not willing to subject him to!

[Pocket_Pony]

Thanks, everyone!

Bryan Neubert has a clinic coming up not too far from me that I might like to check out. I have a friend who has been to many BB clinics and she said that Bryan is someone of a similar approach and someone she would ride with (she said there aren’t many out there and most are a waste of time/money). He also does home clinics at his ranch, which sound interesting.

I agree about most of the NH stuff being marketed to novice owners and women, too. I’ll give that article a read. Our local NH guy here has lots of people wrapped around his finger, but I found him so aggressive and overbearing with the horses that I only saw him a couple times before he completely turned me off.

I think what a lot of people could benefit from is just good ole’ riding lessons. There are no shortcuts to becoming a good rider, and the education never ends. Yet it seems that so many people want a “simpler way” of getting there, when really what they need is supervised time in the saddle with quality instruction. I saw this at the last clinic I did (the one I wasn’t thrilled with). I think I was probably the only person there who grew up riding as a kid and who has taken lessons my whole life. That’s not to say that I’m some great rider, because I’ve still got lots to learn, but I know the basics of good form and function, of equitation, of how to sit properly and in balance, etc. I wished that the clinician spent 15 minutes with each person, giving a bit of individual help like “put your stirrups up two holes” or “get rid of that curb bit and put a snaffle on your horse” or “you should have your saddle checked out because it doesn’t fit either of you” or “if you are afraid of your horse spooking and bolting why are you sitting there with your feet out of the stirrups and your legs up on the horse’s shoulder with the reins draped around the saddle horn so you can rest and chat while I’m instructing?” Things like that. Either he didn’t know or he didn’t care but I felt for the riders who were there for help and mostly they got the sales pitch of “come to my farm and I’ll help you.”

Anyway, rant over. Thanks for the info on Peter and I’ll read that story by Tom Moates.

[downen]

Peter Campbell… isn’t he that smarmy guy on Mad Men? :lol:

[Pocket_Pony]

I know, I giggle at the name! :lol:

[kewpalace]

@Pocket Pony;7074461

Bryan Neubert has a clinic coming up not too far from me that I might like to check out. I have a friend who has been to many BB clinics and she said that Bryan is someone of a similar approach and someone she would ride with (she said there aren’t many out there and most are a waste of time/money).

I would also ride with Bryan Neubert in a heartbeat. I have liked what I’ve read from him & have heard nothing but good things about him from various sources, including some very good horsemen. Be sure to tell us all about it if you go. :yes:

[QUOTE=Pocket Pony;7074461]I think what a lot of people could benefit from is just good ole’ riding lessons. There are no shortcuts to becoming a good rider, and the education never ends. Yet it seems that so many people want a “simpler way” of getting there, when really what they need is supervised time in the saddle with quality instruction. I saw this at the last clinic I did (the one I wasn’t thrilled with).[/QUOTE]I see this alot, also, and totally agree with you. I have found alot of people are not wiling to open themselves up to criticism and recognize that there is always something for them to learn, so would not be receptive to any instrutor/clinician trying to help them out in ways they did not come to clinic for. They are also the ones who get the least out of clinics and usually grumble about how bad it was. Most good clinicians recognize until a person is genuinely open to learning & improving any suggestions will likely fall on deaf ears. And yea, those are also the people least likely to put in any work to improve and will badmouth a method that doesn’t work in a few half hearted tries. Seen that quite a few times …

[crosscreeksh]

Peter Campbell held a clinic at our training center in NC some years ago. I had nothing to do with the clinic or details, but was only the host. I found him to be extremely rude and unpleasant from a morning greeting and offer of a cup of coffee I had made to watching how he treated his assistants and paying customers!! He would not have been welcomed back!! Just my experience.

[katarine]

keep an eye out for Jon Ensign, too.
http://www.jonensign.com/calendar.php

[monstrpony]

Ditto the riding lessons. I have one friend who has studied a lot of so-called NH type work and can talk up a storm, but she never learned how to sit on a horse and that keeps getting in her way. Lots of folks who go to so-called NH clinics needed to learn how to ride before getting involved with the kind of horses that they end up bringing. Meanwhile, my horsemanship guru always says he enjoys having a clinic group where he doesn’t have to worry about just keeping people alive, as is the case when people are so mis-matched with their horses and/or just can’t stay balanced on top of them.

[Fillabeana]

Our local NH guy here has lots of people wrapped around his finger, but I found him so aggressive and overbearing with the horses that I only saw him a couple times before he completely turned me off.

Yeah, aggressive and overbearing are a big red flag.

Sometimes, we don’t really understand what we are seeing when, say, Buck gets not firm but FIRM and some dust flies. The easy answer to the question of whether someone having a come-to-Jesus-moment with a horse, is being appropriate or not, is whether the horse has found the peace of Jesus when it’s all done. I don’t mean whether the horse is physically doing what the handler asked- but rather whether the horse is at peace, happy with his handler.

I haven’t seen any horses that Buck straightened out (sometimes in a rather Western way) that didn’t want to follow Buck to the ends of the earth when he was done making his point with the horse.

You can see it in the horse’s face, good or bad.

[pmatt]

Peter Campbell clinic

Saw your question about Peter, I know that it is probably to late for this year but maybe some thought for next year. I have been lucky enough to ride and do some extended training with a number of clinicians. Some are great guys, some great trainers, some great teachers, but I must say I think that Peter is the best horseman. Maybe Buck is easier to get along with, or Bryan is super kind,or some folks think Chris Cox or Clinton is the answer. I say look at the horses they ride and work with, the horse will never lie. Peter does a clinic in Michigan and he uses our horses to ride, within just a few moments those horses look like his finished bridle horses-how can that be? At a clinic in Ohio CANTER ( a race horse rescue) brought 2 horses, the one had been at the rescue for years- too unsafe to adopt. Peter worked with that horse for 20 minutes, taught the clinic on it and then adopted it- how was he able to do that? I love Peter’s teaching style, it is direct, and he will let you work at it but that is how he learned from Tom. Thanks for your time , best of luck with your adventure!!!