Petite Riders w/ Small Hips & Wide Horses

[mydogs]

I’m a fairly petite person at 5’ short and I have a fairly small waist/hips.

I’ve found that riding horses with wider barrels makes it more difficult for me to wrap my legs around them, keep my heels down, and it is harder for me to apply my leg without feeling the need/want to bring my heels up. But, when riding horses with a smaller barrel, I feel much more secure, balanced, and can apply my aids without much hesitation. I feel as though I can actually use my seat to control the horse.

Does anyone else have similar experiences?

Does anyone understand the biomechanics of why it is more difficult for a smaller person to the wider horses?

[Velvet]

It’s not necessarily size, it’s flexibility. And if you are narrow in the hips (not small, but narrow) that definitely adds to the issue. Some people have what I like to call bungee cords in their hips. They are usually the people who can do the splits as well. Most of us are not built that way. But, if you are narrow of hip and want to ride a wider horse, you need a sadde with a narrow twist. Yes, because the horse’s back is wide you will still feel stretched in the hips, but it is a lot less and it helps.

[gailbyrd]

[QUOTE=mydogs;8853199]
I’m a fairly petite person at 5’ short and I have a fairly small waist/hips.

I’ve found that riding horses with wider barrels makes it more difficult for me to wrap my legs around them, keep my heels down, and it is harder for me to apply my leg without feeling the need/want to bring my heels up. But, when riding horses with a smaller barrel, I feel much more secure, balanced, and can apply my aids without much hesitation. I feel as though I can actually use my seat to control the horse.

Does anyone else have similar experiences?

Does anyone understand the biomechanics of why it is more difficult for a smaller person to the wider horses?[/QUOTE]

While I’m 5’4", I have short thighs and narrow hips and find it VERY hard to ride wide barrel horses. I look like the kid on the Thelwell ponies (legs sticking straight out). Narrow twist saddles help some but only so much. I also notice my hips hurt after riding the wider horses, even with a narrow twist saddle. I’m afraid it’s all mechanics.

[Graymaresrule]

I have found on wider horses(Sophie that means you) I need to raise my stirrups.

[MysticOakRanch]

I am one of those narrow people - very narrow hips, not uber flexible, but I do a lot of stretching work to keep myself more flexible. But I can’t ride a super wide horse. Medium wide is fine, but once we get into the extra wide backs I get hip and back pain, or I ride in a chair seat. I find the back is a bigger issue then the barrel - I can handle a gradual widening, but I can comfortably ride a super-wide back. There are things you can do to make yourself more flexible, but if you are a narrow person, you can’t totally avoid your own build.

I had to sell one of my horses who was just a SUPER guy - best brain, great gaits, a dream horse in every way - because he grew up to be an extra-extra wide. The saddle fitter said it was the widest she’d ever fit that saddle - and my hips and back confirm that statement.

[Inclined]

As carolprudm says, shortening stirrups can make a big difference. This is what I’ve done on my draft cross gelding. He’s about 14.1, so I still have plenty of influence on him, even with my short legs and uncooperative hips. However, that did not work on a 16.3hh Shire/TB mare I used to ride. It was laughable! I looked (and felt) like a five year old. There was no sense of security, and as long as she behaved, I was fine. When she didn’t behave, it was another story.

As to the biomechanics, it helps to google a skeletal anatomy image of a woman’s pelvis/femur connection. Depending on the woman, the angle slants in more or less toward the knee. Putting a narrow-hipped woman on a wide-barreled horse can be a bit like trying to put a closepin on a tennis ball. The closepin can only open so far before the spring pops. Yes, some people are more flexible than others, but even with stretching, there are still limits to what some of us can do.

[Knubbsy]

[QUOTE=Inclined;8853348]

As to the biomechanics, it helps to google a skeletal anatomy image of a woman’s pelvis/femur connection. Depending on the woman, the angle slants in more or less toward the knee. Putting a narrow-hipped woman on a wide-barreled horse can be a bit like trying to put a closepin on a tennis ball. The closepin can only open so far before the spring pops. Yes, some people are more flexible than others, but even with stretching, there are still limits to what some of us can do. ;)[/QUOTE]

This. I have an “impressive” femur to pelvis angle according to one osteo- and not in a good way. Because of the angle that they meet, no matter how wide my hips are and despite the fact I have hypermobile joints, I need a narrow twist, and a wide tree is about as much as I can do and depending on the day, that can even be too much. What gailbyrd said about femur length also has an effect- as does where your knee rolls/blocks are.

[Training_Cupid]

I have the opposite problem. I am 5’2". I rode a big-barreled QH for 15 years. My new horse is a thoroughbred and I just can’t seem to keep my legs around him. I have the tendency to bring my heels up and shorten my leg so I can hit him at the roundest part of his barrel. I’ve been riding the thoroughbred for 2 years now and I’m still not used to it!

[artisticgold]

ohmigosh! You are talking about me…and I own mostly xtra wide horses. The worst I have is my incredible Lipizzaner pony mare, she is so talented, but we are struggling to find a saddle that fits her but works for me. It’s killing me, I actually get crippled if the saddle isn’t right. I have Annette Gavin coming on Friday to fit a custom Hastilow that she had made for me. I absolutely love my Hastilow Concept Elevation that I have to two of my rather regular wide geldings, and the Wolfgang Solo is another one I can ride in. An Albion Brentina was another saddle that was great for me, but not at all wide enough for my horses. It is a struggle…

[Rackonteur]

I am petite too (5’2") but not small of waist or narrow of hips! (BTW, “petite” is under 5’4", not just under size 6, in case anyone’s wondering – this is according to WWD and other fashion trade publications. )

I have the same problem with wide horses. I cannot get enough leg on them, and it isn’t comfortable for me either. Neither are dressage saddles with long flaps, although I have ridden in an Isabell and liked it. I was very comfortable riding a friend’s TBx in her very flat Stubben saddle.

I think my solution would be a narrower horse! I like a saddle that does not block me and hold me in.

[vali]

I found that finding a saddle with a narrow seat (not just twist) has helped a lot. The Albion SLK or platinum with the narrow seat option allows me to just drop my leg down, instead of trying to stretch out around a wider seat, and bridges the gap between me and my wide mare.

[RedHorses]

I had a wide horse I did the hunters with. I ended up having to use a monoflap jump saddle because once the bulk of the girth was added to his width plus saddle I literally could not close my leg on him enough to stay put when he jumped. He’d jump and I would slide back a couple of inches. When I got the monoflap it was almost magic the way I could stay with him over a fence.

The learning point being that as you get to the widest stretch, your muscles’ ability to counter that stretch diminishes. This may be part of why you feel less effective on wider horses.

I will note that while I kept my wide load through his lifetime, I DID deliberately look for narrower horses after him. :winkgrin:

[netg]

[QUOTE=Rackonteur;8854331]
I am petite too (5’2") but not small of waist or narrow of hips! (BTW, “petite” is under 5’4", not just under size 6, in case anyone’s wondering – this is according to WWD and other fashion trade publications. )

I have the same problem with wide horses. I cannot get enough leg on them, and it isn’t comfortable for me either. Neither are dressage saddles with long flaps, although I have ridden in an Isabell and liked it. I was very comfortable riding a friend’s TBx in her very flat Stubben saddle.

I think my solution would be a narrower horse! I like a saddle that does not block me and hold me in.[/QUOTE]

Petite is purely about height and not about size at all… And yes, the 5’4" and under mentioned is what defines it.

What actually makes a difference for riders is the direction of the hip socket. Those with narrow hips who get saddle bags tend to be comfortable in a wider twist, because most often that indicates hip sockets which point outward. Those of us who tend toward big butt/hips and no saddle bags tend to have hip sockets which point forward and need a narrower twist, typically shorter relative stirrups and have more trouble with “drape.” Of course fat deposits and bone structure don’t always line up, so that is not an absolute.

Ideally the widest part of the horse is aligned with your knee. My 16hh and narrow mare lines up almost perfectly for me. My 16.3 and wider gelding lines up almost as perfectly poorly as possible - his widest point hits the widest part of my calf. I have a saddle my fitter and trainer both referred to as a 2x4, and it helps me ride him more comfortably. When I rode more like a hunter rider on him I had no problems, but riding him correctly is quite challenging and he is very exhausting for me to ride because of the effort it takes to go with him and NOT grip when everything about our size pairing tells my body to grip. The more uphill and in front of my leg he is the easier it becomes to ride him, but then he just gives me an aerobic workout. :lol: My legs do fit more easily on him when he is really moving than when we are relaxed walking, though.

I have found horses who are much larger can also be comfortable - because my leg is still going outward at my feet, so it doesn’t encourage pinching in the same way!

[Twigster]

@netg;8857454

Those of us who tend toward big butt/hips and no saddle bags tend to have hip sockets which point forward and need a narrower twist, typically shorter relative stirrups and have more trouble with “drape.” Of course fat deposits and bone structure don’t always line up, so that is not an absolute.

Can you maybe expand on this a little bit? This is very much me, and I’m wondering if you’ve got any tips/insights/wisdom to share about helping those of us similarly conformed who struggle getting the hip to let go and drape.

Also, if there are particular saddle brands you love/hate that are shortie friendly and I’ll be hunting again soon as my current fave doesn’t fit my horse for squat.

[jaybird660]

There are a lot of good suggestions above. We see that quite often. Shortening the stirrups so the legs can bend forward a bit does offer some relief. The challenge is that for a round horse to have shoulder freedom, they often need a tree that is laterally more open and that generally makes the twist wider. A monoflap on a hoop tree is another way to minimize the width.

[Cat_Tap]

I am also 5’4’ riding a large clyde x. When I first get on I literally have to sit in a chair seat while walking. It is agony to line up heel, hip, shoulder. I also can’t tuck my rear end under and have an arch in my back. Once I start trotting, especially the rising trot the pain goes away. I guess as I warm up my hips loosen up.

I didn’t have this problem when riding him in his previous saddle which was a Passier. Unfortunately this saddle was bad for the horse and he is much happier in his new saddle which is a shorter, flatter saddle, a Kent & Masters.

Of course I also put it down to the fact that I haven’t ridden much in the past year but am getting back into it big time and hope I will loosen up in time.

[netg]

[QUOTE=Twigster;8858099]
Can you maybe expand on this a little bit? This is very much me, and I’m wondering if you’ve got any tips/insights/wisdom to share about helping those of us similarly conformed who struggle getting the hip to let go and drape.

Also, if there are particular saddle brands you love/hate that are shortie friendly and I’ll be hunting again soon as my current fave doesn’t fit my horse for squat.[/QUOTE]

So I’m no expert on human anatomy and I know many board members could give you more info on that, but the first two images which show what I’m talking about from a google search (and I didn’t look to see if they were male or female pelvises, even):
This one, you don’t even see the hip sockets really because they point sideways. This would likely be someone who needed a wider twist saddle and could comfortable ride wide horses.
http://humananatomy.co/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/human-pelvis-the-pelvis-bones-inominate-thinglink.jpeg

This one, the hip sockets are pointing right at you. Yes, it is at a different angle and the top part helps you get an idea of how rotated it is in comparison, but the hip socket direction is the key for the discussion. It’s amazing how different pelvis shapes can be when taken at the same exact angle, though, and I highly recommend a google search. I scoff at anyone who tries to claim the same exact solutions for everyone apply because of those differences.
http://www.skullsunlimited.com/userfiles/image/variants_large_8709.jpg

As a kid, my hips used to pop out regularly. Super painful, and it’s because I stretched all the soft tissue and the hip socket was getting pulled on, too. I could ride wide horses, but I don’t recommend doing that to yourself now looking back. I had a biomechanics lesson on Friday with a pilates instructor and she immediately saw the tightness in my left hip issues. She recommended I do more release work - using a foam roller on my hips, which I already do and which is painful… I do a lot of hip opening yoga exercises, and there are pilates bridges which help to strengthen the correct muscles. While in the saddle, she had me really make sure my thigh was rotated in, because that allowed more freedom to move with my horse more easily. That’s one where playing will help you find what feels easiest - for some people, pointing toes out more than ideal actually frees up the hips. I basically get my thighs where they best let me follow in my hips, then bend my knees to get my feet lined up under me - more bend on my wider horse, less on my narrower horse who allows my thighs to hang better.

As far as saddle brands, I go more with available fitters I like than brand since we don’t have a local fitter and it’s basically brand reps who travel here. I have two Customs and two Dresches. Customs can get VERY narrow, depending on the tree, and I have the narrowest my fitter had on her truck for my wider horse. My Dresch young horse is the widest twist of my saddles, but it’s a much more generic type to fit more horses, but since young horses I want to buy are more likely to be narrower that’s ok.