Nope. Offers are contingent on inspection. I made an off on my farm and on inspection the well was contaminated and the septic wasn’t hooked up. We negotiated from there. In today’s hot market buyers are offering cash w no inspection but that’s due to the market and frankly many people can’t afford the risk.
I consider a horse purchase price the same, contingent on PPE. The buyer decides if the price still is acceptable. The Seller can then decide If PPE findings are worth a discount or not. I’ve seen sellers remove bone chips that turn up in a ppe then put the horse back on the market.
I’m a lot more comfortable w PPE findings on a horse who’s doing the job I want already.
Fair enough. Maybe my post wasn’t clear: you aren’t going around inspecting houses without ANY offer in, right? Which is what the poster I was responding to was saying: PPEing horses without a discussed offer in on the horse.
When house shopping, it was offer (pending inspection), inspection, renegotiation or walk away.
Sometimes a seller will do an inspection themselves and make it public to buyers, to try and make the sale less complicated.
But no one is scheduling a home inspection without a contract and earnest money in hand. The inspections allow a buyer to back out if there is something structurally wrong with the house, or something that threatens the health of the occupants. You don’t get to renegotiate the price - at least not to the extent you can walk away with your earnest money back. Edit: a seller may work with you on some stuff in good faith, but they are not obligated to unless it’s structural or health-related.
Actually, things would be a lot more clear cut if horse sales were treated like house sales.
Written contract, deposit, pre purchase and then money to the owner of the horse (not the trainer, not the coach - the actual person who owns the title to the horse). That sure would eliminate a lot of strife and BS, including the disreputable behaviour at the highest levels (aka the allegations against Lamaze).
My real estate agent is happy to shoot me DocuSign contracts all day long because the commission on one little bungalow is equal to many people’s annual salary.
No outside agent is going to ride herd on the sale of a horse for $10,000.
While involving a lawyer may be ideal, something is better than nothing …no outside agent required.
Given what I’m hearing about how people do horse sales, things could be substantially improved with a simple bill of sale:
I, Mouse, am purchasing Pretty Pookie from Scribbler. Pretty Pookie is a 2020 gelding, 16,2 and has competed to X. A pre-purchase examination was completed and is satisfactory. There are no vices or behavioural issues.
Mouse will pay $ for the purchase of Pretty Pookie, by cheque payable to Scribbler. This is the whole of the sale price. Upon payment, documentation transferring the ownership of Prety Pookie will be completed by Scribbler. Transportation will be arranged. No other warranties or representations have been made or are being relied upon.
If you are in the business of doing this, probably worth the $500 or so to have an equine lawyer draft a contract specific to your needs. If you are a one-off purchaser, you may still wish to consider buying a pre-fab contract from a lawyer or someone with experience in this. In Ontario, a number of equine specific options are available from an equine lawyer.
That area with the finding will now be excluded on the insurance policy. Also, now that you’re aware of an issue, you need to declare it as a finding when you renew, and it will no longer be covered for you, either. Sometimes a simple finding in a targeted area will result in a broader exclusion as well (sometimes all joints in one leg for a single finding). Failure to report a finding is insurance fraud. Sometimes it is best to channel your inner Elsa and “let it go!”
I always as for the seller tor represent that they are lawful owners of the horse with the legal right to sell such horse and there are no encumbrances.
Fair enough. Maybe my post wasn’t clear: you aren’t going around inspecting houses without ANY offer in, right?
Actually, pre-inspections were very common in my area for the past few years. In a multiple offer situation, having an inspection done before making an offer allows the buyer to make a more appealing offer by waiving that contingency, but still have peace of mind in the house they’re buying. In fact, just last month my in-laws listed their house and had at least one pre-inspection and multiple offers. I’m sure it will become less common as the market shifts to be more of a buyer’s market, but it’s not unheard of.
OK so not even trying to be argumentative but I did a home inspection on a house BEFORE we put in an offer. It’s so stupid to me to have an offer out there, assuming the horse or house is fine and as such the buyer has seen/heard you say you’re fine with paying “$X” so why then would they give an inch if they don’t have to? Your issues with the findings are only yours. The house/horse have both been fine, or else you wouldn’t have made the first offer.
So for me, I only make an offer AFTER a PPE or inspection. And I only offer what I am willing to pay. I am totally fine with losing the horse/house to another buyer and if they don’t want to accept my price I have the options to offer more, or walk away.
And being naturally suspicious and cynical, I would not look favorably upon your request to have my house inspected before you had signed a contract to purchase my house. I would not trust that you weren’t working with the inspector to “discover” some serious problem that you could use to try and leverage a reduction in price or other financial concession.
I’ve never experienced a market where a buyer paying to have an inspection done prior to having some kind of contract signed is something that anyone does. I have seen instances of the seller having an inspection done when they put the house on the market, usually the seller has some reason to believe that a buyer’s inspection might reveal issues they would need to address.
Initial sales contracts on houses are typically contingent on findings of the home inspection and everyone understands that the offer is subject to negotiation based on the findings of the inspection so I don’t really understand the benefit to the buyer of paying for an inspection before making an offer.
Do you pay for the pre-offer home inspection yourself or ask the seller to pay for it? Have any sellers been reluctant to allow you to have a home inspection done without any kind of signed sales contract?
I take it you’ve been fortunate enough not be house shopping in the past 3 years? In many markets since COVID, you have to waive the inspection contingency for your offer to be competitive. So the only chance a buyer might have for any type of inspection is a pre-offer inspection. When I was house shopping (2021-2022) pre-offer inspections were more common than offers contingent on passing inspection.
Back to the topic, as both a buyer and seller I’ve been involved in negotiations before or after the PPE. Sometimes both, if you negotiate a price before and then something comes up and that gets taken into account. I think it can be somewhat dependent on specific circumstances.
They didn’t mind at all. Everyone was clear any other buyer could walk in and make an offer and I would be left out in the cold.
I used a home inspector that did a great job. and I made a non-offensive offer and bought the house.
No issues.
No issues with my horses bought this way either. I fully acknowledge if the buyer doesn’t want to work with me for my timeline/methods, I am happy to walk. I don’t force anyone to do it different. But if they can’t hear me out on why I am saying I want to do it my way, I am happy to walk also.
Life has balanced nicely with the “What will be, will be” mantra.
@Rel6 nope. Got our forever home in '15. These 2 houses were before Covid.
I’m not sure what you’re saying no to. I wasn’t replying to you, and I just said pre-offer inspections have become incredibly commonplace in the post-COVID housing market…not that they didn’t happen before.
Glad I purchased pre-COVID. Deck supports were not to code; negotiated and had the replacement taken off the purchase price. Have still spent literally 1/2 the purchase price (in 2017) on reno and found that a LOT of other things were not done to code, though but in this market and this area, house is worth 100k more than purchase price + reno now. Not that I’m moving and going through that again!
I’m not trying to be argumentative, but this makes no sense.
I last bought a house in 2018, so pre-COVID, but I live in an area where the market went absolutely nuts during COVID and I have a friend who is a realtor and two friends whose mothers are realtors, so I’m not entirely ignorant.
Yes, lots of houses sold here very quickly, often sight unseen. It was nuts. And buyers were so desperate that they waived all contingencies and made cash deals to get a signed contract. The object of waiving contingencies was to present the most desirable offer and get the deal done as quickly as possible. A seller who has two comparable offers, one with all contingencies waived and one that asks for a home inspection, is going to take the one with contingencies waived. If the buyer asks for an inspection to be done before making an offer, that adds time and negates the whole reason people were waiving inspections - while you’re waiting for your pre-sale inspection to be done, someone else can come in, make an offer, and get a signed contract before you get the inspection done.
I simply don’t understand how the buyer requiring (and paying for) a pre-offer inspection offers any increased benefit to the buyer over the traditional approach. In fact, it’s more likely to be a detriment to the buyer. It makes no sense.
House goes on market 1/1. Offers due 1/12. Interested buyer wants to do pre-offer inspection - seller says okay and they block out time prior to offers being due. No red flags, so buyer submits an offer on 1/12 without an inspection contingency. The benefit is that the buyer has some peace of mind on the house and their offer is still competitive because there is no inspection contingency. Sellers aren’t waiting for pre-offer inspections to be done.
This is off-topic though, and is very easy to google.
but in this market and this area, house is worth 100k more than purchase price + reno now. Not that I’m moving and going through that again!