Prices for Field/Fox hunters--how regional?

[pintopiaffe]

I have wandered in from dressage land, as I know you all will be able to help.

I actually happen to have two different students in two very different geographical areas who are looking to place horses.

Both are part-draft, common/proven crossbreeds with papers. Both are good size, good feet, good minds, good jumps. Both are well started with good to excellent flatwork, & have trail experience and are happy to lead, follow or stay with the crowd.

But the suggestions for ‘starting price’ are all over the map.

If you were advertising the same horse in a rural area with no foxhunting to speak of, but near areas that do… How would you price such a horse?

Some folks are telling them as low as a thousand or two… saying anything over five won’t sell. Others are saying to start around $7,500 and be willing to negotiate. Yet another ‘trainer’ has told one client to price the horse where she would if he were being sold a dressage prospect, and that the savvy foxhunter will see potential and pay that price…

I am just completely in the dark here, Most Especially because of this economy.

I see a DraftX down in the MA/Southern NH area going for a LOT more than one up here.

Is the fact that they have only done hunter paces & trail rides the problem? Is it geography?

These are big, sound, sane horses who would be well suited to the job. They don’t want to price themselves out of the market, but don’t want to be robbed either. I see both of these horses going in the $7,500 range (within reason) with their gaits and dressage potential…

I told my students that I “know people who know.” Hence, I come, begging your indulgences. :yes:

[smartchance]

I understand your dilemma… I live in one of those areas too! The foxhunters are 4 hours or so south of me, but the horses are insanely priced down there!

First off… I think if you advertise in areas that there are foxhunters, you have a good chance of them driving to purchase the horse. Therefore, a good chance at getting more for them than if you try for only a local sale.

That being said- to a foxhunter- experience is key and potential is a risk. It’s not that they don’t want to work with a greener horse, but there is a lot more to foxhunting than just trail riding. How do they act in a close pack of cantering horses? How will they react to the dogs? Will they step on the dogs? Depending on the hunt club they still carry and even fire off firearms. A safe foxhunter is worth his weight in gold.

From the dressage perspective… I think potential has a lot to do with value. When I’m evaluating a dressage prospect I want a horse sensitive enough to move off of the aids, but not so sensitive they explode after 20 minutes or hard thinking work under saddle. I’ve experienced a lot of good moving horses than couldn’t take the physical demands.

I would try to get the horses to a few hunts and see how it goes. Get video if you can out on the field. Then market to the higher paying crowd.

You won’t get it if you don’t ask for it. Believe me, people will tell you if they aren’t worth it. lol

[jawa]

Experience, actually in the field, is what makes a fox hunter!!! Some horses take to fox hunting the first day, but most require a season (sometimes more) to understand their job. Galloping in a group can be tough, but standing at checks (pauses in the activity) can actually unnerve more horses than the moving. Standing still at checks is really important, as this is when the field master listens for the hounds to know which direction they are headed. One horse fidgeting around can really disrupt this process. Reversing field is hard, especially on tight trails, because it seems that the group is leaving your horse, and he wants to be sure to be with the herd. Keeping a safe following distance. Being ok with other horses passing you, whether they be staff or someone faster than you (purposefully or not). Horses that know hounds ALWAYS have the right of way. And you can never be sure that one won’t pop out of the woods behind, in front, or beside you. Having a horse that will allow you to hold them up just before a jump because the person in front of you fell off, even though the rest of the field has galloped off on a run. A horse that will jump anything, even if the horse in front of you just refused. A horse that has a fifth leg!!! The conditions out hunting are not neat and tidy. Many times it is muddy and sometimes can be deep. Being able to back your horse off the path to allow the hunt to move through/ahead, even if it seems impossibly tight.

Some of these things can be worked on prior to actually hunting, but some can only be tested in the field.

[TimelyImpulse]

Here in VA, a horse like you’ve described would probably range from $1000 to $3000. If it were a PROVEN field hunter, not a prospect, then could be up to $25K (or more). Jawa’s post provides exactly the info you need to take into consideration when marketing a horse as a field hunter. But the key is the experience in the field, with hounds and hunting, not just hunter paces. Hunter paces are great for seeing how a horse might handle varied terrain, but it’s usually a group of 2-4. It’s good the horse has some experience doing paces, but it is NOT the same as being in the field.

Check out www.virginiaequestrian.com, go to horses for sale and do a keyword search on “fox”. You’ll see examples there.

[lesson_junkie]

pintopiaffe-jawa is right on-unless the horse has actually hunted, it’s hard to know exactly how they will take to it. The most quiet, gentle guy can light up like Chinese New Year. Sometimes hunting is the only job a hot horse can do. Until they go hunting, you can guess, but you can’t know for sure.

In our hunt, the horses are pretty modestly attained. We have the occasional show horse out with us, but we usually have a pretty motly collection of useful good sports-I’m sure nothing cost more than 8-10K, even as a proven hunter. Without creds, you are looking at 2500 at best.

Do you have any way for these guys to get out and see if they might like it?

[jawa]

Cubbing (early season) can be a good time to take out a green horse, if the Master and Huntsman are agreeable.

The pace is usually slower as the young hounds are just learning and all hounds are still working on fitness. Its usually still fairly hot, so scenting can be an issue that slows the hunting down. The runs aren’t as long or as fast (of course there is always the exception).

Some hunts don’t want green horses, green riders (to hunting anyway) and young (learning) hounds out together, some don’t mind so much. The only way to know is to ask your local hunt secretary.

Some hunts only allow members during cubbing season, no capping (visitors). Again, the only way to know is to ask.

[Jaegermonster]

Around here they would be $1-5000 depending on how attractive they are and how cute they jump. The clunkier drafty types go for less.

As far as being foxhunters, if they have only done paces and trail rides then they are not foxhunters. They are trail horses that jump.

There have been other threads before on the “field hunter prospect” thing, and FWIW here is my humble opinion on that:
Generally when I see something advertised as a “field hunter prospect”, it is some piece of crap that is not suited for anything else. Show Hunters think if it’s a crappy mover they should market it as such, eventers think if it doesn’t jump well enough, well let’s sell it to the foxhunters, and whatever. And usually people who market them that way have not hunted themselves, they just can’t find any other category to stick the horse in.

Obviously the above does not apply to places that deal extensively in field hunters, like Rosemarie and others. Their reputation speaks for itself.

I would just advertise the horse fairly, be honest about what he has or has not done and let people who see and respond to your ad decided what they want him to do.

[judybigredpony]

I get a solid $5K for a big quiet sound classy looking horse with some jump talent 4-6 16.1 and up. Good minded mannerly without any hunt experiance. $$$ Over that they look for some hound time…

[xeroxchick]

Some excellent advice given here.

Just want to add that two or three hunts do not make a field hunter.
Some ads will say “has hunted” and you wonder what that means - it can mean he was a nightmare. So unless you wanted to put the time and training into it, I would not recommend taking the horse out with a hunt.

I was visiting a hunt last year and a woman had a good younger rider “try out” a horse who had never hunted that she was thinking of purchasing. The horse was probably a good sort, but to be put in the middle of first flight with fifty couple hounds running around, well, the horse made it almost half way through, then dumped the poor girl and took off for parts unknown. (I considered at that point I could have offered the fuming seller a few hundred bucks and taken the horse home, really train it to hunt and get a steal, but I digress)

A knowledgable hunter will know that they can be angels the first three hunts and then get very yeee-haaa oh boy lets go go go the fourth or fifth. A horse who has never hunted is usually far better to work with than one who has hunted only once or twice at a hot gallop.

[Jaegermonster]

I always start them off in the hilltoppers and am prepared to go in early.
You can always change fields or stay out longer, but once they have a bad experience like that or you fry their brains it can take a whole season or longer, if ever to fix it.

[sar2008]

[QUOTE=pintopiaffe;5049688]
Is the fact that they have only done hunter paces & trail rides the problem? [/QUOTE]

:yes:

In order to go for a substantial price as a “hunt horse” they need to be proven. Hunted for a season at least–preferably with a well known hunt. Start them out hilltopping and then move to first field. The only way to truely get a horse fit for hunting is to go out and hunt! Go in early if you need to, gradually building stamina.

I sold my draft cross a few years back as a hunt horse. She had successfully hunted for 2 seasons, stood at checks, fine with the hounds, could hunt on the buckle, AND had hunted with a faster paced hunt. In my area, thats important or they won’t even look at draft crosses.

She sold for $15K.

IMO, it also depends on what your marketing them as. A hunt horse will go for less (if they haven’t actually hunted) then an event or dressage prospect.

If they can get out and actually go out with the hounds that would be helpful in helping them sell. In my area, people don’t want to spend $7500 on something they aren’t sure won’t kick at a pack of hounds running through, under, and all around them. Hunter paces and trail rides are a lot different then a group of 25 horses all galloping at top speed around, over and through the woods

[Borntorun]

Good hunt horses on the Eastcoast generally sell for at least $7500 if they’ve hunted at least a season and are somewhat attractive. Once they have some serious hunting mileage under them and are sound, attractive and won’t kill you…They bring big bucks! I wouldn’t even consider selling my 16.2hd sound, attractive, gelding with 5 seasons under his belt for less than 15K, even in this economy!! I bought him as a “prospect” 5 years ago for 3K. Never hunted a day in his life until I got him. Hope this helps!