Prospect too Sensitive to Leg?

[four2farm]

Here we go. So I went and look at a horse today. I REALLY like this guy, checks a lot of boxes. Love his conformation (tall enough, elegant, pretty head and neck, not downhill) his attitude (very laid back), generous heart girth, nice foot under him (goes barefoot), very nice mover. I would pick him apart and say he moves better free than under saddle, his front pasterns are a little straight, he has a blemish on his near hind and he will lightly crib if left inside with out a basic strap (not even a nutcracker, plain collar strap, no teeth wear and he does not do it outside)

His resume is wonderful, breed points, tons of wins with children and adult beginner/ammys under saddle in both disciplines, a real trooper, lots of video evidence of him showing. He has been doing lessons with kids since Jan and they have been doing open shows and he is doing well there. I watch the owner ride him who rides western primarily ride him English and he was a perfect gentleman, stands at the mounting block, trotted and loped around, ideal. They were riding in the yard, owners daughter riding and goofing around, dogs running around, llamas running around, toddler running around, pigs squealing, turkeys calling, chickens cackling and gun fire next door. He does not turn an ear. He is wearing tack that is not his, the daughter is using his, the bit is too narrow and the saddle not ideal, still not even a a tail snap, this dude can take a joke.

So, I step up on him, feels AMAZING, fills out my leg, I am 6 foot tall with a really long leg and this guy felt like he fit. Hubby said we looked “right together”. We step off and he starts getting antsy/jiggy. Not bad just like he was confused. More commotion arises and the daughter is riding in and out around me, everyone and everything is moving and talking, the dogs, the toddler and I start getting really panicky. He did NOTHING wrong, he is just trying really hard to find out what I want but I want nothing, just to walk. We trotted a bit and I cannot get into it because in my head I am going to run over somebody or something, I am not comfortable in the tack and the only thought in my head is this is not safe!

I have posted here that I had a bad wreck years ago and I am now back to riding. I have been taking lessons and getting more and more comfortable riding there. I really like the trainer I am riding with, she is tall like me, similar age, very patient and an accomplished rider in her own right. Things there are very orderly there, empty fields to ride in, nice arena, well schooled riders sharing the riding areas so everyone stays distant, there are dogs running around but the trainer will put them up if they bother you. Comfortable…

I ride the prospect for a bit longer and I am getting more panicked and he is getting frustrated trying to find out what I want. His worst sin was to try a sidepass over a cone. That is a deal killer! Anyways, I just stopped and dismounted. I watch the kids just cowboy around, he is unfazed, he s exceptionally personable, well mannered, polite, not girthy, not head shy.

So then while we are talking about stuff (owner was exceptionally nice) she mentions he is promised to a kid for a show next weekend and I think about the videos I have seen, his trainers, his previous owner before her, the kids and realize no one has probably in his 8 years of riding has ever been as tall as me or has had that much leg on him. His previous history has been stock horse breed shows. Of the dozens of videos I have seen of him, the tallest rider has maybe been 5.7" Certainly no one one with a 36" inseam and no one with a hunt seat lower leg grip. I reviewed the videos and see beginners or riders with their leg in a more stock seat position.

So here is the gist of the question. He is priced for the market he is in. In my area he is more valuable. He is too far for another test ride. I feel like we will be fine, if he can come here, (PPE pending) we can ride around in the quiet and get used to each other. If we find this leg sensitivity issue to continue to be a problem, I can easily send him over to the trainer to let her deal with him as her leg length is similar and of of course her confidence is far superior. If he and I cannot overcome our differences I can chalk it up to back luck and place him with another rider and buy something else?

Opinions please? Has anyone else faced this issue as a rerider? Am I crazy for considering a horse that I had a panic attack on during the test ride? :eek:

[Bluey]

You know, if that is going to be your one and only, for many years, your best friend, maybe it ought to be one that, questions and all, kinks and all, you would not have any other than a smile in your face, no matter what the horse was or did.

You may just need to keep looking for that one unicorn that fits you, may never quite find it, but since you just started trying, maybe look a little longer?

Or, if you reconsider and think he is the one, it sounds like you really liked him, as you say, you can try him, don’t get too attached, no one needs a horse they are wary of and consider that may have to let him go if things don’t get better, as they were not when you tried him.

[StormyDay]

I’d pass. If you guys didn’t click, I wouldn’t want to force it.

[OfCourseItsAnAlter]

@four2farm@gmail.com

Am I crazy for considering a horse that I had a panic attack on during the test ride? :eek:

Yes, you probably are. I have fear issues over two bad wrecks that happened more than a few years ago. Even after all that time, when I have a scary ride, it sets me back. And I have to claw my way back out of the fear hole again. This horse scared you on your first ride. That, it seems to me, is a pretty big red flag, no matter how much you try to rationalize it.

Hold out for a horse that makes you smile through the test ride.

[mollymoon]

Agree with others that it might just not be a good fit. On the other hand, it seems like a fairly straightforward training issue. Have you talked to the trainer you would send him to about the “uncomfortable with/confused by leg contact” issue? Has she had experience fixing that? Is she confident that she could? How long does she expect it might take to train it away, and are you willing to send the horse out for training for that long? And if it’s not something that ever gets fixed, are you prepared to put on your logical hat and sell the horse to a better fit?

[four2farm]

The confusion here is that the horse did not scare me, the surroundings panicked me.

The horse was confused by my leg length, he kept trying to move off my leg, this was not bad, he was not scary, he was like, hmmm do you want this or this? No tail snapping, no ear pinning, just “what does your leg down there mean”? Of the 5 prospects I have seen, (I have been busy horse shopping due to work downtime) This is the one that felt “right” and struck real interest.
The thing here is that he is at place that he is not fazed by, yet, it made me feel totally unsafe to be in that situation with all that going on.

That I felt the click, yes, he felt like Mr. Right, he felt wonderful. I was having a full fledged anxiety attack including chest pain and shortness of breath and this good guy was asking to side pass over a cone. Does it get better than that? I liked his willingness to please it just seemed like if we had some quiet time, tack that fit and if I had ridden him in a safe environment there would be no question. His environment is not going to change, a trial is out of the question due to distance,

The question is: Have other riders dealt with a height difference between past riders and have success repositioning leg cues. He is sensitive sided which is plus. I do not want a kick ride, I want a responsive partner, just not a explosive bronc. I am asking if this is enough of a concern to pass on an otherwise lovely horse. Granted he has a PPE to get through, but unless major changes have occurred since January 2020, we should be good as he passed a PPE then.

[Beck]

@four2farm@gmail.com

The question is: Have other riders dealt with a height difference between past riders and have success repositioning leg cues. He is sensitive sided which is plus. I do not want a kick ride, I want a responsive partner, just not a explosive bronc. I am asking if this is enough of a concern to pass on an otherwise lovely horse. Granted he has a PPE to get through, but unless major changes have occurred since January 2020, we should be good as he passed a PPE then.

Horses adjust with quiet repetition. He’ll learn ‘new’ aids and learn to tolerate the leg contact. It just takes consistent riding and time.

If you like him that much, I’d give him a try.

[four2farm]

@mollymoon

Agree with others that it might just not be a good fit. On the other hand, it seems like a fairly straightforward training issue. Have you talked to the trainer you would send him to about the “uncomfortable with/confused by leg contact” issue? Has she had experience fixing that? Is she confident that she could? How long does she expect it might take to train it away, and are you willing to send the horse out for training for that long? And if it’s not something that ever gets fixed, are you prepared to put on your logical hat and sell the horse to a better fit?

I am not making any final decisions until the trainer I mentioned above has been consulted, my lesson horse was trained in a similar way when he came to her and he is putting up with me now, so we can talk more about that. She is at a horseshow this weekend, so our conversation can wait until Monday. Sending him there would not be a problem, that was the plan all along as I plan on riding through the winter. I currently do not have winter weather footing here at home. As for selling, yes if it cannot be fixed then selling would be considered. He would have to come here for a few weeks to a month, stalls will open after show season ends. I would look forward to that as time to bond, make sure we have nutrition figured out, tack and furnishings fitted, get a solid health baseline. Plus a summer of teaching kids and going to horseshows deserves a few weeks to let down and relax before starting in another training regime.

[RedHorses]

@Beck

Horses adjust with quiet repetition. He’ll learn ‘new’ aids and learn to tolerate the leg contact. It just takes consistent riding and time.

If you like him that much, I’d give him a try.

Generally horses easily adjust to different riders who have slightly different leg positions. I’m sure you would have been able to get the walk had you not had the anxiety about the activity around you. I’d bet your tension was tightening your leg and giving the horse the idea you wanted something more than just a walk.

”‹”‹”‹”‹”‹”‹If you are confident that you can resell if it doesn’t work, go for it. :yes:

[clanter]

@four2farm@gmail.com

The question is: Have other riders dealt with a height difference between past riders and have success repositioning leg cues. He is sensitive sided which is plus. I do not want a kick ride, I want a responsive partner, just not a explosive bronc. I am asking if this is enough of a concern to pass on an otherwise lovely horse. Granted he has a PPE to get through, but unless major changes have occurred since January 2020, we should be good as he passed a PPE then.

The trainer we used for our young horse was 6ft 6" … our horse learned to take leg cues from wife who 5ft 5" and short legged as well as our our kids without an issue (well, she (the horse) also knew voice commands which helped) But the horse had no difficulties learning what to do, she was shown a lot and always was placed in the top three of a class

[eightpondfarm]

i like him for you. I’d get him. Your plan seems solid. I wish you a good horse to regain your confidence upon and this guy sounds like ‘it’.

[hoopoe]

do not dismiss the effect of your seat and back tension adding to the issue. You admit you were tense and uncomfortable in the environment. When you get in your saddle and in your environment, this may certainly change. I like a horse that is light to the leg and seat, as a dressage rider

[Marla_100]

If you decide to move on to PPE, I’d ask the vet to concentrate on those front feet. With upright pasterns and lots of miles on him, he’s the right age to start showing navicular changes/problems. So definitely go for front ex-rays and any special shoeing needs.
Otherwise he sounds pretty good.

[four2farm]

Thanks Everyone! I woke up with a fresh calm brain and basically started my day thinking about him. Had a good talk with my husband as he is the careful one. He was asleep as my anxiety ridden brain was typing feverishly. He really liked this guy as well, feels like he and I would be a good fit and looked good together. We need to make adjustments, sure, but we know where to get the help we need. Trainer is supportive and comforting. This guy has a long career of being a good citizen, dealing with riders who are inexperienced and or timid. He never even thought of acting up with me, even in all the turmoil. We are also talking about a horse in the mid 4 figures, not exactly a budget breaker. So an offer is on the table, dependent on PPE, video of the walk trot kids showing him next weekend and of course the “dickering on price” I started at 15% off asking price but gave the caveat of paying market plus for delivery.

So now I will be anxiously awaiting the counter offer and window shopping for his potential wardrobe… I wonder if teal is too blingy?

[KBC]

@four2farm@gmail.com

So now I will be anxiously awaiting the counter offer and window shopping for his potential wardrobe… I wonder if teal is too blingy?

Teal is never too blingy! Especially as in my mind he is chestnut, don’t know why, that’s what I saw…

There is a lot to be said for a horse who doesn’t freak while you are freaking out, fingers crossed for PPE.

[merrygoround]

You got on a horse who was confused by your leg aids but really never turned a hair? And wondering if you liking every thing else about him, whether you should PPE him.

Have you considered that you, not he, is the problem? I would suggest that with the right instruction, you are fixable. Horses that steady, and tolerant are not easily found.

[Posting_Trot]

Teal is definitely a great color.

Good luck with him!

[ThreeFigs]

Agree with Merrygoround. This horse may do just fine WITHOUT a “hunt seat lower leg grip” as you describe it. The situation you tried him out in sounds chaotic – just about anyone would have a problem with all that going on! Good heavens – Llamas, kids, turkeys, chickens, gunfire – no wonder you were tense!

He may be the horse who teaches you how to ride with a light leg and more from seat!

[four2farm]

Maria - I agree, that is my main concern as well, he is upright in the pastern, but he is actually got a nice size foot and has been showing barefoot for all summer. I also want pics of his hocks as well.

hoopoe/Redhorses- Exactly! I must have felt like a time bomb on his back, I am sure my lower back was rock hard and my lower leg was clamped on like I was awaiting death. One of the things I enjoy at the lesson barn is that she lets me get there a bit early and I can free walk on loose rein around the arena for 10-15 minutes. It lets me loosen up my lower back, open up my hip joints and get my breathing relaxed and deep. I just play around with lengthen and shortening his stride with my seat as we walk. I find it very relaxing and my lesson ride does as well. He is a little older and this time helps him stretch his top line and and find a nice rolling walk. I would like to do that this horse when he comes home in the interim, just see if we can create a nice loooong walk.

Eightpond- Do we ever really know if a horse is “it” on a sale visit? This forum is full of failed hose/rider matches and successes. We just have to risk it. What I do know is he is lovely to look at, a pleasure to handle and feels like he fits me. Thankfully I have an abundance of picture/video showing him from birth the current age. I see that he is indeed a good citizen and on several occasions a saint. I am going to risk that with slow patient work, proper help and a winter of confidence building we can emerge a happy team. If not my leg makes him crazy and I lease to him to a nice little light legged rider and enjoy their success. Or, I could learn to drink, lol

Beck/Clanter- Wow, 6.6" is TALL, I am so blessed to have found a trainer who is very similar to me to height. Plus her training regime goes either by full training board or just pay per training ride. There is also a couple of very nice young taller rides at the barn, one young lady I found to be particularly pleasant both riding and in person. I feel confident that he could get enough riding up there to get him comfortable with the lower leg cues and the more intense leg pressure.

Thanks everyone, REALLY! I feel like I wanted to get my brain right on this and it just feels good to get feedback. Even the negative, we talked about your replies and they helped me sort out if he scared me or the situation scared me. If we can get through negotiations I can go down in COTH history as the worst test ride that still purchased. :lol:

[four2farm]

@ThreeFigs

Agree with Merrygoround. This horse may do just fine WITHOUT a “hunt seat lower leg grip” as you describe it. The situation you tried him out in sounds chaotic – just about anyone would have a problem with all that going on! Good heavens – Llamas, kids, turkeys, chickens, gunfire – no wonder you were tense!

He may be the horse who teaches you how to ride with a light leg and more from seat!

Yes, but this is in no way to be construed that the owner is at fault or lacking in any way, just the opposite, it was chaos and to her, a normal day. The fact that he was handling it that well was enlightening. My warmblood and TB would be in the next county, we have such a quiet life here. That is my comfort zone, calm, controlled, quiet. I get anxious in city traffic, lol.

No, she was really very nice and my anxiety is my problem. Yes, luckily I am in a position as a recent rerider to adjust my riding style to a new horse.