Pup on Prozac questions

[Bensmom]

Hi all,

I’m confused and my poor pup’s distress is driving me bonkers. (Though, I must say, after reading other the tales of other folks here who have had dogs with anxiety issues, ours seems minor by comparison!)

Background: Opie is a Lakeland Terrier, who is about to turn 4. He was purchased as a puppy by a family and lived with them until June, when they drove to our town from a different state (well, just over the state line, but still) and gave him up to the Humane Society Foster Program. They were not provided with a lot of information, but they knew he was a “thunder-dog.” He was with a foster home, was adopted by one person and returned after a week. (She was told to crate him when he was home alone, she didn’t, and damage ensued when he panicked during a storm, and she returned him.) He went back to the same foster home, met us a week or so later, and came home to live with us the first full week of July.

He moved in, got along really well with my Scottie, and while he was terrified of storms, we used a thunder shirt and thought we were making some progress.

My Scottie was diagnosed shortly thereafter with Lymphoma, and his health declined rapidly. Opie was very good with him – he seemed to understand he was sick and was very quiet and gentle. We lost him last Monday, so Opie is now an only dog.

At my vet’s suggestion, we started him on Prozac three weeks ago to help with the thunderstorm anxiety. I did some research, and saw that it is frequently used in combination with a second drug, but my vet has no experience in that treatment protocol, and so has just prescribed the Prozac.

My research also indicates that the only known side effect is a drop in appetite and that usually resolves around week 3-4. We are seeing some other things that have me puzzled and I’m looking for some anecdotal evidence to see whether I should blame the Prozac or look for a different cause, or give the Prozac some more time.

My main concern is that a bit of his spark has gone – he has little desire to play, and even his energy for going on walks has dropped way, way, off.

He has also developed a bit of a tremor – when he is at rest, his hindquarters and tail vibrate. It is so pronounced that I videoed it last night to show the vet.

Also, his anxiety seems worse, not better. He’s gone from being a little anxious when traveling on the interstate to total anxiety. He loves to go and will jump into the car, and is fine around town and on back roads (he will lie down and sleep just fine) but at freeway speeds and freeway traffic, he’s a mess. Add a storm to that, and he is just exhausted by the time he gets home and it is over.

My husband wants to stop the Prozac altogether, but I’m not sure. I don’t want to give up on something that could give him some peace.

Have any of you seen side effects from it? Thoughts, suggestions?

Things we’ve done:

• Thundershirt – helps some, not a miracle cure
• Ace – not drug of choice
• Crate with dark blanket – creating a den or safe space. didn’t soothe him, though thank goodness, he isn’t destructive in the crate.
• holding him in my lap – either during a storm or in the car. Seems to calm him for a few minutes but no real relaxation.

I have contacts at the University’s vet clinic and I will be reaching out to them this week too – my hubby will probably have a cow that not only is my rescue dog on Prozac but seeing the doggie psychologist, but I want to help him if I can.

I wish I knew more about what led his people to give him up. I have their contact info, though I’m not supposed to use it. I don’t want to blame them, I just want to do the best thing I can to help him.

Thanks for any input! I’m particularly interested in whether the effects we are seeing in him are Prozac related or are just maybe depression/issues that we are just now seeing in him after him being with us five weeks.

Libby & Opie

[threedogpack]

My suggestion is to contact a veterinary teaching hospital that specifically has a behavioral unit. Some will do consults over the phone. The one I recommend most would be University of PA, who may refer you to a doctor they trust closer to you. In the meantime, if you have not read any of the work done by Dr. Karen Overall, please do. She is a pioneer in the field.

http://veterinarynews.dvm360.com/storm-phobias

http://www.dogaware.com/articles/wdjanxiety.html

[FreshAir]

I have used Prozac and it works but sometimes it is used in combination with a melatonin. You have to be careful with changing things with medication rapidly. About the highway, remember, he went on a highway and got dumped by his family at the shelter so that triggers that anxiety. I had that with a dog when we left home. Leave the grocery store lot, no problem. So I would break up the drive so when we left the tigger area, we had a break, then re-started. With the highway, you might go one exit, get off, take him out of the car, do some sit stay treat exercises, hop back in and go home. It will be a lot of work, but worth it. I have never had a thunder anxious dog but remember that the dog will look to you as to whether or not it is something to get worked up over. I don’t coddle when I think they are getting anxious. I treat it like it is no big deal. My friend that has one like that says leaving the tv on helps. I think your crate idea is a good one. Also have you tried filling a kong toy with treats and sealing it with PB so the dog has “work” to do? Lots of people need anxiety meds, some dogs do too. Your dog has been through a lot.

[cloudyandcallie]

One of my aussies developed ulcers when she stressed out from the addition of a few more dogs to our pack. My vet put her on prozac for about 6 months. No problems. No issues. She recovered from her ulcers and got over her stress. Although she always wanted to be the only dog. (I already had 2 dogs when I got her and I got 3 more, including her 3/4 sister later.)

Prozac worked great for her. My only regret is that I did not get it from my doctor, since then it would have been paid for by my health insurance. As it was, I had to pay for Schehera’s prozac myself, and there was not a generic version.

You might want to have the vet give your dog some tranquilizers if the prozac is not working. When Schehera’s 3/4 sister Binkie was a year old, she developed allergies so bad that she had to have tranquilizers as well as her allergy meds. Fortunately she outgrew her allergies as Schehera outgrew her anxieties.

Try giving the dog a lot of exercise. A tired dog does not have as much time to stress out as does a bored dog. Mine did a lot of swimming in summer and running in wintertime.

For traveling I use Dramamine. The kind that causes drowsiness. But the tranquilizer will work for about 4 hours, so it would be fine for a road trip.

[S1969]

@Bensmom;8284619

Things we’ve done:

• Thundershirt – helps some, not a miracle cure
• Ace – not drug of choice
• Crate with dark blanket – creating a den or safe space. didn’t soothe him, though thank goodness, he isn’t destructive in the crate.
• holding him in my lap – either during a storm or in the car. Seems to calm him for a few minutes but no real relaxation.

I guess I’m confused as to why you need more help if you can crate your dog during a storm. Unless you live in a very stormy area, I don’t see why you would put him on a daily med (with side effects) if his only issue is anxiety during storms.

Two of my dogs have anxiety during storms and fireworks. I don’t think this is abnormal behavior because they are loud, unpredictable, and cannot be explained to dogs. But since this is really only an issue every now and then, I don’t do anything but let them find a comfortable place during a storm (one dog goes under the bed, the other likes to try to stand on my head.) Crating is another option for her, but since storms aren’t terribly common I let her stand on my head.

I also turn on the AC or fans, and keep the TV on loudly during storms or fireworks. They don’t “relax” but they aren’t terribly traumatized either - no residual effects and the rest of the time they are totally normal.

I definitely wouldn’t keep the dog on Prozac if it’s dampening his enthusiasm for life when there is no thunderstorm.

[SarahandSam]

I second the suggestion to try to contact a veterinary behaviorist. Prozac usually takes quite a while to really take effect, so it might be an issue with adjusting the dosage. You don’t want to quit cold turkey because that can also affect them; if you do decide to go off it, the behaviorist would give you a plan to wean him off.

Xanax works well for one of my dogs for his storm anxiety, but when I tried my other fearful dog on it before fireworks, she was one of those dogs that it has a total paradoxical effect on–she was panting and pacing and frantic. So Xanax can be great, but not on every dog.

I believe melatonin can counteract fluoxetine, but I could be wrong on that.

With the Thundershirt, you have to also use it a lot in non-stressful situations so that they don’t associate it only with impending storm/car ride/fear.

Rescue Remedy (Bach flower essence) and DAP or calming/pheromone collars could possibly help a bit. Will he take treats during a storm? Desensitizing/counter-conditioning involves giving him the impression that scary stimuli like storms mean treats rain down from heaven, so maybe stuffed Kongs, bones, tons of treats, etc. might help, especially if you start them early (when you start seeing signs of tension and before he has a chance to really freak out).

Good luck! I will say my cat off of Prozac is a total a-hole but is great with it, and one of my two puppy mill dogs has been improving hugely on Prozac along with DS/CC, but it definitely took several months to see the improvement from the drugs.

[foggybok]

[QUOTE=S1969;8284689]
Two of my dogs have anxiety during storms and fireworks. I don’t think this is abnormal behavior because they are loud, unpredictable, and cannot be explained to dogs. But since this is really only an issue every now and then, I don’t do anything but let them find a comfortable place during a storm (one dog goes under the bed, the other likes to try to stand on my head.) Crating is another option for her, but since storms aren’t terribly common I let her stand on my head.

.[/QUOTE]

I’m still trying to figure out just why the top of my head would be a place of comfort. This is exactly what my BC does. But my BC is 55 lbs and does not fit on my head. It is not a suitable option… and why on earth does he think that it is a safe place…?

[Simkie]

I agree that talking to a behaviorist is a great idea. Also, SSRIs just aren’t what’s needed sometimes.

Case in point: I’ve struggled with my own anxiety issues for years. Anything that screws around with my serotonin is just BAD for me. Other meds that touch other neurotransmitters are helpful.

Your pup might be similar.

A really good, comprehensive probiotic might also be worthwhile. This research hasn’t been done in canines (that I know of) but wow, is the research in people interesting.

[xQHDQ]

@cloudyandcallie;8284657

My only regret is that I did not get it from my doctor, since then it would have been paid for by my health insurance. As it was, I had to pay for Schehera’s prozac myself, and there was not a generic version.

Just 2 quick points:

If you had gotten the Prozac from your own doctor for your pet and insurance paid for it, that would be insurance fraud.

There is a generic Prozac: fluoxetine. Widely available. I have it compounded into a tuna-flavored liquid for my cat.

[Bensmom]

Thank you guys! I’ve sent off an email to a very well respected small animal vet that I’ve got a good relationship with and asked for a phone consult and am also considering contacting the university, if she thinks it is warranted.

Mostly, I’ve been concerned about whether things like the tic I’ve noticed in his tail and hindquarters is related to the Prozac. I don’t recall him doing it prior to starting the medication, but I’m just not sure.

Poor Opie. Yesterday was a good day, though. No storms! Living in Florida in the summer, thunder-boomers are a near daily occurrence, so on the days that we are storm free, it is nice for him!

[jherold]

I’ve used Rescue Remedy in the past of a storm phobic shepherd. I was very skeptical when my breeder suggested it. But it worked wonders. I would use that and check with a behaviorist about desensitization if thunderstorms are really his only anxiety.