Question about riders going different directions. Am I in the wrong?

[meupatdoes]

[QUOTE=RPM;8959231]
I was trotting around the arena on the rail one day when one of the other boarders came trotting towards me. As she approached she looked right at me and started calling “Left to left! Left to left!” I did not have a clue what she meant – I knew I was on my correct diagonal. Did she mean me to go to my left? Which would have put me directly in her path? I decided to ignore her and stay on the rail, which I had been taught was the correct way to proceed.

If she had simply called out, “Keep right!” I would have known exactly what she meant, from years of driving on US roads, cycling, riding escalators, etc.

And I would have kept right anyway, if she had just kept her mouth shut.

It’s the riders who don’t know to keep a horse’s length when following each other that make it difficult to share an arena. Other than for them, I love sharing arenas with different riders working on different things.[/QUOTE]

Left to left means you keep riders coming at you on your left side. Your left shoulder will be next to their left shoulder as you pass each other. It works no matter what direction you are going. This is a very standard “way of putting it” in the US, as well as a standard rule which you should pretty much assume is in place unless you are told otherwise.

However, I was in Germany once at a new barn and the trainer explained the rules of the ring as “When you are riding clockwise, pass on the inside. When you are riding counter clockwise, pass on the outside.”

I was like, “Left to left, got it.”

Trainer was like, “Wait what did you say?”

“You know, left shoulder to left shoulder… right?”

Trainer thought for a second and was like, oh my God, that is such an easy way of saying it, I’ve never thought about it that way!

So I’m not sure if that is an all-of-Germany thing or just that trainer, but not everyone has heard “Left to left”, even if that is how they generally pass each other. Overall it is pretty standard in the US though.

[chicagojumper]

[QUOTE=Inese;8958569]

The riders compete in “C” shows (www.ptsshows.net), the “B” shows (www.nihja.org) and “A” shows (Lamplight/Ledges) - all around Chicago.[/QUOTE]

Not to derail the thread, but IHJA does the A and B shows, NIHJA is the C circuit, and PTS is series of schooling shows. (I always chuckle at PTS because that’s an unfortunate acronym in the veterinary world).

All of the outdoor Chicagoland A shows for 2017 are being held at the new venue at Balmoral Park in conjunction with HITS. No Ledges or Lamplight except for the indoor series. I’ll miss riding at Lampligt.

[mvp]

@snaffle635;8958561

However, it sounds like there’s an unwritten rule at this barn that this particular rider has the right of way at all times - at least in her own mind.

I think you are fanning the flames, here. You can’t tell whether or not the Big Client has been imperious from the OP. Maybe the Big Client being so is only in the OP’s mind, and not in the Big Client’s mind.

Look, no one wants to crash. Rules are great but they aren’t a substitute for communication. If I’m not sure how someone in the ring with me will play, I just watch them and I take the initiative to tell them where I’m going; I don’t tell them how to ride or how to share space politely.

If we will pass in opposite directions, I’ll say “Inside” (if I’ll pass them there) or “Outside.” If I’m coming up behind them, I say “On your left” or whatever. It’s all very quiet.

I tend to ask a new horse/rider combo in the ring if their horse needs some space. They can tell me if he’s spooky about oncoming traffic, or if they don’t want to be caught between me and the rail or if I can’t come up behind them at a faster gait.

And I defer to the person doing the faster/harder thing, or to the beginner rider or green horse who can’t get out of the way.

I learned all this riding in busy schooling rings where chaos reigned. The folks that want all people at all times to know and obey the set of rules they have learned eventually get into trouble, IME. That’s because they ASSume lots and have not developed the skills of looking up for traffic and communicating with other riders in real time. Those skills are bacon-saving ones.

[Foxglove6]

At my barn, “lessons have the right of way” basically means that the trainer teaching a lesson has the right to kick you out of the arena or tell you what to do if that’s in the best interests of their students. We have 3 outdoors, 3 round pens, and one indoor, so it’s not usually an issue unless it’s inclement weather. It gives the trainers some leeway to say this kid is a beginner, can you please go to another arena while we work on some things. I know most of the trainers and just ask them if we can ride in the same space or if I should try elsewhere.

It’s easiest to have the barn post rules. At my barn, slow horses get the rail, faster horses pass on the inside. If it’s a bunch of boarders and we are all advanced, we just pay attention to each other and call out if we get close. There are a few teens that I prefer not to ride with because they are inexperienced but like to run fast but cannot control their turns. I think that’s part of just learning what the clientele is like at a particular barn.

OP, I agree with other posters that the easiest way to deal with your Dangerous Diva is to be loud and definitive about calling where YOU are going to be. Then it’s on her to yield to you because you called it first. You’re showing her what you want by doing it yourself. If she wants something else, she has to call earlier than you and you will also yield. If you call something and she refuses, that’s a thing you can directly talk to her about.

[equidae]

Left shoulder to left shoulder. And the horse going in the faster gait gets the outside track. I too have felt some people don’t know this and wondered if I was wrong (mostly at hunter barns).

[lys]

left shoulder to left shoulder is for passing going opposite directions.

if two horses are tracking the same direction, one at the trot and one at the canter (for example), the individual at the canter should pass on the inside. this, like others have stated, is a safety issue, as you would not want to have a horse between another horse and the wall/rail. i can see how having a set rule that allows horses at the faster gait to have the rail would work if all riders agree to abide by that and give ample room for passing, but i still think it’s backwards. i wonder what pony club says? going to see if i can find a mention of it in the manuals.

i do agree, though, that if you’re walking/cooling out while others are working, it’s best you stay at the rail so they can more easily maneuver around you. if you’re walking and weaving in an out it’s a lot harder to predict where you’ll be and safely maneuver around you.

communication/calling out is key.

[JustJump]

[QUOTE=Ponyclubrocks;8958698]
Many barns operate with their own set of rules. When in doubt, call it out. If someone is approaching me and I don’t know their intention, I don’t wait for them to speak, I say, “inside please” or “outside please” firmly. I don’t say it like it’s a question, but a statement of fact. If someone speaks first and claims a track I always yield to their claim since they spoke first.[/QUOTE]

THIS.

Generally, stay to the right when possible. Yield to those who are jumping. Stay off the track if you are just strolling about when others are working at speed.

Most importantly: State your intentions! CALL THE TRACK! Whoever calls it, gets it!

[RugBug]

@lys.;8961874

left shoulder to left shoulder is for passing going opposite directions.

Not really necessary to distinguish this. You can’t pass left to left unless you are going in opposite directions.

i wonder what pony club says? going to see if i can find a mention of it in the manuals.

Pretty sure pony club says faster horse to the outside. I do not agree with pony club on this. :winkgrin:

[lys]

[QUOTE=RugBug;8961896]
Not really necessary to distinguish this. You can’t pass left to left unless you are going in opposite directions.

Pretty sure pony club says faster horse to the outside. I do not agree with pony club on this. :winkgrin:[/QUOTE]

distinguished the opposite directions bit because some people left it simply at left-shoulder-to-left-shoulder when really that’s an oversimplification.

if PC does say that, then i don’t agree with them, either.

[Raymundo]

I agree with RugBug and others that the walking horses should stay ON the rail so you never have a situation with a horse trying to squeeze between the rail and the walking horse. So many horses will spook off the rail or suck back when trying to pass through a smaller space especially in the winter or at night when it’s dark outside the covered arena and scary noises are happening out there where the horses can’t see. And you are likely dealing with various skill levels of horses and riders.

Our covered arena simply isn’t wide enough to accommodate 3 possible tracks of horses that way–horses on the rail, off the rail and crossing the center. Because of a prior incident, my horse is a bit touchy about cantering toward other horses and the last place I’d want him to decide to sull up about it is between a walking horse and the rail. I’d much rather have the option of leg-yielding to the inside or circling to get his mind back on his job.

To the point of riders all going the same direction, I’ve ridden in barns before where, when confined to the indoor during bad weather, everyone rode the same way and changed directions at the same time when there were lots of horses in the arena. If you really needed to work on serpentines, flying changes, half-pass, whatever, you came out in the late afternoon or evening when the ring was quiet. With 90 horses and only 1 covered arena, sometimes you just have to do exercise laps and call it a day. It looked like those videos of the am schooling during Indoors. Honestly, many smaller horse show warm up areas do tend to work that way if there isn’t another large option just for safety with people jumping, etc.