Questioning a board price increase - yes, I understand inflation

[Impractical_Horsewoman]

In a very different thread, there was a discussion about the suspiciously cheap rent-controlled apartment in Friends owned by Ross and Monica’s nana. I never heard of rent-controlled stalls before!

Honestly, the “old friends” discount seems to be almost engineered to create bad blood at a barn, given that there’s always concerns the BO favors certain people. I mean, lucky people paying $500 a month in an area where average rates are $1000 but honestly, that seems nuts to me.

Even with multiple horses–like, if the BO depends on someone with three horses who shows every weekend and lessons twice a week to keep the place going, lots of time that person is less likely to get yelled at if they don’t bother to clean up the poop in the wash stall. In other words, there’s already perceptions of favoritism that can lead to resentment between boarders.

[endlessclimb]

I am VERY good friends with the BO. I also do a ridiculous amount of stuff around the farm to help out.

I pay the EXACT same price for everything as everyone else. BO and I discussed way early on in our friendship that under no circumstances would money ever get involved.

[enjoytheride]

@mmeqcenter

On Facebook last year I saw someone complain about their BO raising their board price, stating that it’s not their job to subsidize the BO’s personal horses. Whaaaat? Since when do you get to control what a business owner spends their expendable income on?? Do you pitch a fit every time some billionaire whose store you shopping at buys another yacht? GTFO.

So I was in this situation. My barn manager panicked at the price of hay and said that she’d have to raise the price of her board because she couldn’t afford to buy hay. She had two boarders and owned 19 of her own horses and estimated that the price of board would have to go up $100 a month to cover the price of hay for the two boarders and her own horses. In addition, she wouldn’t be able to pay me the $20 a weekend for farm sitting those 19 horses when she went out of town.

Do I mind a price increase? Not at all. But two boarders can’t cover costs for 19 personal horses and I didn’t feel like $20 for four extra trips to the barn and am/pm chores for 19 horses was a lot.

[mrs_beasley]

Hello.

Skimmed all of these comments, so forgive me if these things have already been mentioned.

I am a BO/BM/Trainer of a 45 horse barn. 85% of them are boarders (mostly stall but a few field).

We recently raised our board by $75 for ALL. Not just for stall board. We are located in a place where boarding barns are starting to disappear and virtually nobody offers field board.

If I were to have texted ONLY my stall boarders and said “your board is increased by $75 as of April 1”, and they found out that the field boarders were exempt from the price increase, they would be pissed. $75 per horse across the board was the more fair option than $150/stall board increase with no increase for field boarders.

Grain and hay in my area has increased in cost. The price to have these things delivered has increased due to fuel costs. Field board horses get fed the same nice hay and grain as the inside horses. I still have to pay someone to go out to the fields to feed/scrub the water tub/pick poo out of the shed, drag the field, etc. i have to be sure to pay them a living wage so that they can get here every day.

Additionally, are you paying your trainer for lessons and/or training rides? She’s not getting rich off of your board increase, but she may be able to feed herself properly if her clients respect her enough to pay her for lessons and training rides.

Unless you see her pull up in a brand new Tesla, I’m sure she’s not ripping you off. Asking for her to “show her work” in regards to the math she did to determine her price increase is insulting to her, but will also be way less exciting and offensive to you than I think you are hoping for.

[vxf111]

Your BO is free to do this but man, I feel like this invites drama.

[OfCourseItsAnAlter]

@mrs_beasley

Unless you see her pull up in a brand new Tesla, I’m sure she’s not ripping you off.

Even if she does pull up in a brand new Tesla, that doesn’t mean she’s “ripping you off.”

[AnastasiaBeaverhousen]

I think the OPs gripe is that her board is getting raised higher but she is not getting more for her money.

The BO is making a Cost of Living adjustment.
The full board clients are not getting any more service for their money either.

We do not know the calculus used in the adjustment. Neither does the OP.

The OP can ask, whether it is wise to do so is another topic.
I don’t think the OP has the right to demand an answer or see the math .

[Amy3996]

I recently left my longtime boarding barn. The owners decided that stall board was no longer in their business plan, and my horse was not a candidate for 24/7 winter turnout in the dry lots provided. I don’t know what led to this decision - I imagine the overhead cost was part of it. There was no additional revenue coming in - no lessons, clinics, haul-ins.

Boarders were responsible for providing grain. Hay was included in the board. I ended up purchasing my own alfalfa because my ulcer-prone TB needed it. He was eating 75% my hay, 25% barn hay. I did not ask for a discount - I figured being allowed to store it onsite at no additional charge was discount enough.

When I moved barns in December, I ended up paying a grand total of $115 more per month. New barn’s board price includes grain, blanket changes (additional fee at old barn). Trainer requires each boarder to take a weekly lesson. She’s smart - she builds the cost of the lessons into her board. So you pay for those lessons when you write your board check at the beginning of the month, and she’s secured that income whether you take them or not. She’s flexible - if you want one lesson to be a training ride, that’s fine. If your horse is on stall rest, that money goes toward layup care. She told me she likes to give boarders a set number that’s all-inclusive. Steady income for her, and no surprises for the boarders at the end of the month. I really appreciated that.

Coming from a facility where I was paying close to the same rate for just base board and then having to purchase grain, tack on the blanket fee, and pay for lessons on top of that… Getting better care and an on-site trainer seems like a steal.

[Flying_A]

No one is getting their mortgage and taxes paid boarding and often barn owners/trainers unknowingly subsidize costs they are often too exhausted to try to claw back. We start this because we have horses and friends and trainers we love and thought hmmmm maybe I can do this. This sport or hobby is really complicated and expensive equally. I guarantee you every barn owner/trainer loses sleep about the day they ask for more $ from their people.

[BlueDrifter]

It isn’t a model – it is just being kind and respectful.

If OP asks, the barn owner can simply say field board is below market value and they have costs to cover and leave it at that. That is explanation enough and it recognizes what the field boarder perceives as inequality.

I guess my point is that BO want a nice group of people on their property, so if they like their community of boarders, be respectful that they can ask about the increase and the BO doesn’t have to feel challenged that it is asking for an accounting of their finances.

I think new boarders always subsidize longer term boarders to a certain extent. Same is true with farriers, long time clients pay less.

In my case, the BO bought new property, is just now fixing it up, and 50 of his horses came with him from old leased property. He kept their rates the same, with guidance that it will increase as he makes improvements. In essence giving them a year’s notice.

I am not surprised that 50 horses came with him with that consideration.

[BlueDrifter]

No drama that I have seen/heard of between old and new boarders – us new guys feel we are getting a deal regardless of long time boarders’ rates. I am too new to know if there is drama between the long time boarders. I suspect if there were, they wouldn’t have followed him to a new property.

[candyappy]

@2bayboys

If someone is running a boarding barn as a business and their full time occupation, why wouldn’t the business be expected to cover the living expenses of the business owner? Do you expect someone to run a boarding barn AND have another job to pay for mortgage, truck payment, groceries, etc? I don’t understand the expectation that barn owners should offer boarding at cost and not actually draw a salary for their labor and for the inconvenience of allowing strangers to enjoy their property.

I never said to offer boarding at cost? I never said a BO shouldn’t draw a salary?

I was asking what expenses (in addition to 100% running/ covering the boarding operation) was the business expected to cover for the BO’s here ?

Just like with anyone else, if you live above your means you either cutback on your personal spending or work 2 jobs.

[Angela_Freda]

One barn I boarded required four lessons or pro rides a month.
But they did not require that of one couple, who acted like they owned the place, for lessons. And the explanation was “because they’re my friends”.
Ok, so I’m not your friend. Got it. Nice.
And yes the friends and multi horse, show a bit folks didn’t have to sweep up after their horse either.

Let’s note, I worked there, including one day a week all by myself. But I’m not your friend.

[endlessclimb]

What job isn’t expected to cover mortgage and property taxes, food and entertainment, maybe a car payment or two?

What are you getting at?

[candyappy]

@endlessclimb

What job isn’t expected to cover mortgage and property taxes, food and entertainment, maybe a car payment or two?

What are you getting at?

That even in non boarding jobs that make a decent amount of income we may need to adjust our personal spending habits to fit what we make?

Or you get a second job to make up the deficit?

[dags]

@candyappy

I do have a question about mortgage, taxes, insurance and other expenses that would normally fall on anyone who owns their own property.

If you --as the property owner are also living full time on the property as a residence , are you expecting the boarding income alone to cover ALL those expenses in addition to boarding costs? Are you getting a salary in addition?

@candyappy

That even in non boarding jobs that make a decent amount of income we may need to adjust our personal spending habits to fit what we make?

You moved the goalposts on this and now are insinuating there’s too much frivolity going on in the average BO lifestyle (which is hysterical)

Hellz yes your job is supposed to cover your mortgage & taxes, that’s the whole point of having a job? The restaurant owner needs enough profit to pay the restaurant rent AND the rent/mortgage for wherever he lays his head. Why this would be any different for a BO? Unless, for some reason, you don’t feel this particular occupation is deserving of a comfortable living? Whether it can actually produce a comfortable living is another question entirely, but it is damn hard & expensive work and it is definitely worthy of one.

[Synthesis]

And what the people offering boarding are getting at is that the ONLY way to offer boarding is to have a 2nd job (or 3rd) to cover the costs involved. Regardless of whether they have their own horses or not. The fees of boarding alone in most markets do not cover the costs involved regardless of scale.

As a result, the ‘adjustment’ that most make is to cease offering boarding at all and take the property entirely private with only off-property income. Because it is far easier financially and physically.

[candyappy]

@dags

You moved the goalposts on this and now are insinuating there’s too much frivolity going on in the average BO lifestyle (which is hysterical)

No need to get defensive.
What a job (or business) is " supposed" to cover and what it actually does is something that all of us have to adjust our individual spending to.

I am well aware of what my BO went through and his boarding business was profitable and I don’t begrudge any hard working person a good living.

I didn’t insinuate anything. No matter who you are it is always best to live within your means.

[OverandOnward]

@Synthesis

As a result, the ‘adjustment’ that most make is to cease offering boarding at all and take the property entirely private with only off-property income. Because it is far easier financially and physically.

Exactly.

It has to make sense to the BO, financially, as well as personally.

That is true of every business of any type.

@candyappy

No matter who you are it is always best to live within your means.

If someone can’t earn enough to make a decent living, time to find not a second job but a different job that pays more.

That is why there are fewer and fewer boarding barns, even field pasture board, in my area.

[OverandOnward]

There is one business principal for pricing and it is this: The buyer decides for themselves what a thing is worth to them. The buyers collectively set the market price, regardless of cost.

First, find out the market rate. Find out if that rate is bringing enough buyers to leave room in the market for you, too (it depends on how much demand is out there for it).

Then, figure out if your costs make it profitable or worthwhile for you to be in the business. If you need that to include the mortgage payment, insurance and so on, include it. Because it is important to your world.

Then make a go-ahead decision, or a no-go decision. Or, a continuation decision.

Pricing at cost-plus-profit is a huge error that puts people out of business if it doesn’t match the market. If a barn is a high-cost provider and charges accordingly, they may not have much business because boarders can go elsewhere and pay less.

Buyers usually care less about amenities and more about total cost. That isn’t always true, especially in higher-end markets. But in general buyers are likely to choose to pay less for an uncovered arena, even if they would prefer a covered arena. Same for footing, turnout and other amenities. So another dimension is figuring out what buyers consider to be essential services, and what they do not see as essential services they will pay extra to have.

Sometimes it is tough to find the market rate if there isn’t much that is comparable in the area. That may mean you are offering a needed service without much competition, or that what you are offering isn’t that needed, so no one else is offering it.

It is also important to figure out how much available stall board in your area is actually being used. If a board barn is has many available stalls but wish they were full, that’s a problem. Either they are charging too much, or else there isn’t enough demand – maybe both. It will be hard to charge the same rate and not have the same problem.