Does anyone have first hand experience with installing/use of radiant heat under/in the concrete floor of their barn? Expense? How well it works in very cold, very northern regions of the US? I know concrete in stalls is not optimal, for various reasons, so there would certainly be rubber mats in stalls. Worth the effort & cost??? I do realize that the barn structure itself would need to be insulated well too in order for the radiant heat to do its’ job - any suggestions greatly appreciated!
I have never seen in it in the horse part of the barn. I did see a gorgeous barn on the North Shore of MA - the wash stalls were heated, as was the tack room and viewing room. They had radiant floor heat. The feed room probably did too, but I didn’t see that.
The horse stall part did not have heat.
I suspect it’s not common for a few reasons - the first being cost! Not only do you need to install it, you need to run it. And also, horses don’t need heat the way people do. A barn full of horses who have a good supply of hay will be warm enough for them.
Heating the people parts of the barn will absolutely make it nicer for the riders and caretakers.
I know someone who did it and the smell of ammonia in their barn is god awful no matter how spotless they keep it. Don’t hear under the stalls!
Entropy Farm in Woodstock IL (http://www.entropyfarm.com) has radiant heat in the aisle floors. Basically, hot water piped through PVC encased in concrete in all the aisles. It is owned by an equine vet who is an active breeder of Olderburgs, with many ROC USA babies born there.
I attended a schooling show there when my share boarder was riding my horse. Beautiful stalls, great natural light, nice and clean, warm and toasty with snow on the ground outside. Only drawback was condensation running down the outer barn walls and pooling in the wooden window sills in each stall. I thought that would eventually rot the wood sills, and thought the barn designer forgot about humidity control with that many horsey bodies inside…
Entropy Farm in Wookstock IL (http://www.entropyfarm.com) has radiant heat in the aisle floors. Basically, hot water piped through PVC encased in concrete in all the aisles. It is owned by an equine vet who is an active breeder of Olderburgs, with many ROC USA babies born there.
I attended a schooling show there when my share boarder was riding my horse. Beautiful stalls, great natural light, nice and clean, warm and toasty with snow on the ground outside. Only drawback was condensation running down the outer barn walls and pooling in the wooden window sills in each stall. I thought that would eventually rot the wood sills, and thought the barn designer forgot about humidity control with that many horsey bodies inside…
I had radiant heat in my barn in northern WI. It was in the people areas and in the barn aisles, not under the stalls. We had Modine forced air heat in the indoor arena. We also had a very good air exchange system, so no condensation, and the whole system worked wonderfully.
I now have radiant heat in my small three stall private barn in central WI, also just in the aisle and the people areas. Again, it works very well and I have zero issues with it.
Strongly consider adding a solar component to the system, if you aren’t already thinking along those lines. Every hour the sun is out is an hour you’re not paying for gas or electric to heat the fluid in the system.
You also have the option to get potable, hot running water for the wash stalls, bathroom, etc. from the same system.
This is from a residential installer, but the concepts are the same: http://www.radiantcompany.com/system/
These guys have a catalog that will give you an idea of costs: http://www.radiantec.com and http://www.radiantec.com/pricing/sample-costs.php
There’s also this youtube video specifically for a barn, and looks like plenty more where that came from. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YWa2onYt7BI
And just to make you think twice about the whole project (not really): http://inspectapedia.com/heat/Radiant-Slab-Heat-Mistakes.php
Thanks so much for all the info!
[QUOTE=Inese;8541087]
Entropy Farm in Woodstock IL (http://www.entropyfarm.com) has radiant heat in the aisle floors. [/QUOTE]
They also ended up going with a geothermal field because the propane bill was hideous…
My tack room/feed room/bathroom are heated with radiant heat in the concrete floors. I think it’s also under the wash stall as well, but not in the barn aisle. It works great, but it does run off of propane which is expensive (fortunately it’s on my parent’s property so I don’t pay the bills :D). We don’t keep it toasty warm, but in the dead of winter 55 degrees F feels pretty darn warm when you walk into one of those rooms.
I don’t see why you would bother putting it in the aisle. Not only is it expensive to install and operate (but maybe you don’t care about that), it really is amazing how warm the barn stays when the doors are closed and the horses are inside. If you have the radiant heat and you’re not going to close the barn doors and windows then you’re just trying to heat the outside which is a waste anyway. The walls and roof of my barn are insulated, so that helps.
[QUOTE=Inese;8541089]
Entropy Farm in Wookstock IL (http://www.entropyfarm.com) has radiant heat in the aisle floors. Basically, hot water piped through PVC encased in concrete in all the aisles. It is owned by an equine vet who is an active breeder of Olderburgs, with many ROC USA babies born there.
I attended a schooling show there when my share boarder was riding my horse. Beautiful stalls, great natural light, nice and clean, warm and toasty with snow on the ground outside. Only drawback was condensation running down the outer barn walls and pooling in the wooden window sills in each stall. I thought that would eventually rot the wood sills, and thought the barn designer forgot about humidity control with that many horsey bodies inside…[/QUOTE]
Radiant heating would not cause condensation. It does not introduce humidity into the air at all. Warm horsey breath on cold exterior walls would though, or lots of people and no fresh air.
[QUOTE=rhymeswithfizz;8555288]
Radiant heating would not cause condensation. It does not introduce humidity into the air at all. Warm horsey breath on cold exterior walls would though, or lots of people and no fresh air.[/QUOTE]
Heat on one side and cold on the other does cause condensation, no matter how the heat is made. So it could very well be caused by the radiant heat making the inside warm against the outside cold.
I can not imagine doing it in stalls. The smell of heated urine and manure would be … just yuck.
A barn I boarded at in Alaska had radiant heat in the aisle way, it was wonderful, kept the barn just above freezing so it was comfortable. I can’t answer cost for installation or use but it was really nice!
For the cost to install radiant heat, I echo the idea of solar panels instead if you have a roof with good southern exposure (or the space to do ground-mount).
There are still very healthy tax incentives in place for the next few years that will translate to 30% of the installed cost off your tax bill. Other state-level incentives may exist (check www.dsireusa.org for the available programs in your state). If your electric company has net metering, you can “bank” excess generation and use it to offset your electricity use when the sun’s not shining. (it’s not a one-for-one trade but still a good benefit. Then use the “free” electricity for electric-powered heat like overhead IR.
But, if you don’t have a roof that south or lots of trees/shade it would cut your efficiency so much that it prob wouldn’t be worth the investment.
That is not true. Condensation is caused when a cold surface is below the dew point of the air. You could have a very cold surface in very warm air and not have condensation if the warm air is dry. Heating a barn is tricky because you have conflicting priorities. You want decent ventilation for the horse’s health but you want a tight building so the heat you just paid for does not escape. If you visit a barn in the winter that has a strong odor or maybe extra humid that indicates the ventilation is poor. The barn owner is trying to conserve too much heat.
To have a healthy heated barn you pretty much have to accept that a good bit of the heat that you just paid to make is just going to blow away.
Radiant heat is a great way to heat a barn if you can afford it. I would do the aisle ways, wash stalls, and tack room. Heat is generated at the floor level where people will benefit from it. The air slowly cools as it naturally rises.
Compared to a forced air heater that has to blow heat down and then the hot air quickly rises up.
That is not true. Condensation is caused when a cold surface is below the dew point of the air. You could have a very cold surface in very warm air and not have condensation if the warm air is dry. Heating a barn is tricky because you have conflicting priorities. You want decent ventilation for the horse’s health but you want a tight building so the heat you just paid for does not escape. If you visit a barn in the winter that has a strong odor or maybe extra humid that indicates the ventilation is poor. The barn owner is trying to conserve too much heat.
To have a healthy heated barn you pretty much have to accept that a good bit of the heat that you just paid to make is just going to blow away.
Radiant heat is a great way to heat a barn if you can afford it. I would do the aisle ways, wash stalls, and tack room. Heat is generated at the floor level where people will benefit from it. The air slowly cools as it naturally rises.
Compared to a forced air heater that has to blow heat down and then the hot air quickly rises up.
All great responses, thanks!
[QUOTE=MrChunk;8557244]
That is not true. Condensation is caused when a cold surface is below the dew point of the air. You could have a very cold surface in very warm air and not have condensation if the warm air is dry. Heating a barn is tricky because you have conflicting priorities. You want decent ventilation for the horse’s health but you want a tight building so the heat you just paid for does not escape. If you visit a barn in the winter that has a strong odor or maybe extra humid that indicates the ventilation is poor. The barn owner is trying to conserve too much heat.
To have a healthy heated barn you pretty much have to accept that a good bit of the heat that you just paid to make is just going to blow away.
Radiant heat is a great way to heat a barn if you can afford it. I would do the aisle ways, wash stalls, and tack room. Heat is generated at the floor level where people will benefit from it. The air slowly cools as it naturally rises.
Compared to a forced air heater that has to blow heat down and then the hot air quickly rises up.[/QUOTE]
You beat me to it! Yay thermodynamics!
