Reining Breeds

[Tamara_in_TN]

[QUOTE=netg;5130127]
I know plenty about QH breeding and bloodlines. I’m talking about what I could see the Europeans doing. They get breeding for the best horse possible and having a registry instead of trying to keep a pure “breed.” I think using that wisdom we could see some great non-QH reiners in the future.[/QUOTE]

the NRHA is open to all breeds and all their competions are (I think ) open as well…it’s about entering if you think you got a chance of winning and winning means normally riding QH’s bred for reining

Tamara in TN

[Tamara_in_TN]

[QUOTE=Foxtrot’s;5130020]
#300 - Brazilian reiner W. Teixeira on SJ Rodopie - the big grey was not a QH - but I failed to recognize the breed … anybody?[/QUOTE]

he is a Brazilian Criollo…their native cattle working stock horse

Tamara in TN

[netg]

[QUOTE=Tamara in TN;5130253]
the NRHA is open to all breeds and all their competions are (I think ) open as well…it’s about entering if you think you got a chance of winning and winning means normally riding QH’s bred for reining

Tamara in TN[/QUOTE]

Yep.

But I prefer the registry concept to the breed concept, as much as I absolutely love Quarter Horses. Cross the great reining bred QH with horses who pass inspection and are approved for improving upon what you have by adding some athleticism or power, etc., and call it a European Quarter Horse or something. Make it a registry with inspections where you look for a horse who can get its hind end under it well, built to slide, spin, change leads, great mind, etc.

I don’t know that this will happen, but I believe combining the attributes of the QH bred to rein with smart breeders making the right choices to enhance the best attributes (note: I am NOT one of the people who would be smart enough to know what would improve the horses), and you can end up with a better horse. It’s exciting to think it might happen, to me.

[Foxtrot_s]

Yabbut - we already have several lines of QH’s bred to do different disciplines. They are already being bred to get better and better at their discipline - why go outside and have yet another registry. If a European-bred horse can beat a US type bred QH, let it compete under its registry…or non-registry. I argue with the need for more athleticism, and it’s pretty hard to improve on the mind of a QH. Sure, breed out the less desirable traits of small feet, etc., and breed in good hocks.

[Foxtrot_s]

Thanks Tamara - How come you know so much!!! I didn’t recognise “BC” as Brazilian Criollo. The breed that Tschiffley rode on his ride to Washington from Argentina…with Manch and Gato - a much loved childhood read. Very good endurance horses.

[CDE_Driver]

Hmmmm, my MIL has a nice Shining Spark son…maybe I should breed my Flemmingh mare to him

[netg]

[QUOTE=Foxtrot’s;5130462]
Yabbut - we already have several lines of QH’s bred to do different disciplines. They are already being bred to get better and better at their discipline - why go outside and have yet another registry. If a European-bred horse can beat a US type bred QH, let it compete under its registry…or non-registry. I argue with the need for more athleticism, and it’s pretty hard to improve on the mind of a QH. Sure, breed out the less desirable traits of small feet, etc., and breed in good hocks.[/QUOTE]

Because the Europeans have now imported a lot of them, and most likely want to breed their own horses, instead of always having to ship them in from the US. Genetic diversity is a positive.

I’m not suggesting in any way, shape or form that the AQHA should change (I think it needs to look at other problems first), but that I see it unlikely the Europeans will do things the way we have, especially given the soundness problems we have inbred into our horses.

[Go_Fish]

@netg;5130401

Yep.

Cross the great reining bred QH with horses who pass inspection and are approved for improving upon what you have by adding some athleticism or power, etc.,
and call it a European Quarter Horse or something. Make it a registry with inspections where you look for a horse who can get its hind end under it well, built to slide, spin, change leads, great mind, etc.

Adding athleticism? QHs are about the best athletes on the planet. I can’t think of one single attribute that a WB can add to a QH to make it a better reiner.

I raise Holsteiners. But no way in hell could one of my Holsteiners do a better job of “getting it’s hind end under it well” than one of my QHs.

Hon…go breed your WBs to QHs to try and get a reiner. Best of luck. Ya just never know, really.

I think there’s a very good reason that European reiners are buying/raising QHs. Like cutting, it’s sort of a sport built around the stock breeds. WBs just aren’t bred or built for it.

As a side note, I’ve used my WBs for turn back occasionally when they needed an “attitude adjustment.” They try hard and they “get” it. But honestly, they suck at it.

[leilatigress]

Honestly AQHA needs to look no farther than the horses on the ranches working day in and out to fix its own feet issues. Making them less beef cattle is easily done as well. Leave the QH’s alone as far as out-crossing goes. If the AQHA decides to open the books again I will be first in line and rather loud to shout it down. I’m all for the appendix to help with the wonky HUS to maybe get decent movement for hunters and jumpers on the FEI level but anything else crossed in there? I wouldn’t agree with it. Other registries want to improve their breed with the QHs let em let QHs improve QH’s!

[quietann]

[QUOTE=HFSH;5129658]
any Morgan reiners out there?[/QUOTE]

Not at this level, I don’t think, but some Morgan shows do have reining classes, there are still ranches in the US that use Morgans to work cattle, and I think they could offer a lot to the open reining scene. For one, they almost all have GREAT feet, and the breed is known for soundness. The sport-bred ones are not as high-headed as the breed usually is.

(Actually, the QH breed owes quite a lot to the Morgan breed; before the QH was an established breed, ranchers often used Morgan stallions, the US Remount horses often were Morgan or part Morgan, and once AQHA was established, a few of those Morgan stallions were also registered as QHs. See http://www.2wfmorganclub.com/pdf_files/APersonalQuest.pdf)

[lalahartma1]

[QUOTE=Foxtrot’s;5130020]
#300 - Brazilian reiner W. Teixeira on SJ Rodopie - the big grey was not a QH - but I failed to recognize the breed … anybody?[/QUOTE]

Anyone have a photo?

[Plumcreek]

[QUOTE=Tamara in TN;5129752]
only to a point,they have all the handle and rate and “want to” but they are not built to slide

Tamara in TN[/QUOTE]

Right.

It is not the breed, it is the conformation and the strength in the rear end to hold the ground in a slide.

[Tamara_in_TN]

[QUOTE=lalahartma1;5130714]
Anyone have a photo?[/QUOTE]

http://quarterhorsenews.com/index.php/reining/reining-events/9880-images-2010-alltech-fei-world-equestrain-games.html

mid way down

Tamara in TN

[Tamara_in_TN]

[QUOTE=netg;5130589]

I’m not suggesting in any way, shape or form that the AQHA should change (I think it needs to look at other problems first), but that I see it unlikely the Europeans will do things the way we have, especially given the soundness problems we have inbred into our horses.[/QUOTE]

they will if they win…they won’t change a single thing

Tamara in TN

[Tamara_in_TN]

[QUOTE=leilatigress;5130647]
Other registries want to improve their breed with the QHs let em let QHs improve QH’s![/QUOTE]

there are about 8 or 9 special “lines” w/in one breed…no need to blame poor breeding of east coast dirt lot subdivisions on working lines ;

non QH people should understand that the QH are as regimented in bloodlines among real breeders as the Welsh are in Wales…just as one does not normally go crossing out of sections in Wales, one does not go crossing Rugged Larks with Shining Sparks to get a Hancock Horse…

I’ll translate that for non qh people “you don’t cross a new jersey hunter hack with a texas cattle pony and get an old style Hannoverian”:lol:

Tamara in TN

[jumpytoo]

Morgans,saddlebreds,paints and arabians offer reining at their shows… there are some good horses in each breed and yes the paints are over colored QHs.
I dont see the QH breeders going out of their breed for diversity…there is alot of choices and its not like everyone is just trying to breed to the same stallion. There are also various funds that encourage breeding registered QH,TB and Paints… an example of this would be the one Texas has to promote breeding in Texas and by Texas horses, so people look around home for breeding… not over in Europe and not at warmbloods.
The breed registries and performance associations also have incentive funds along with prize money awards… for specific performance types.

You can take your jumping or western pleasure horse and teach them to rein BUT most of them just won’t be catty ( or stay sound) or have the “sit” that one bred for reining does.

Have a realstic plan+breed for a purpose= sucess in the showpen (for whichever discipline)

[ThirdCharm]

[QUOTE=netg;5129875]
Athleticism, reach, and quality of movements besides the slides. Overall dynamic energy and explosiveness.
.[/QUOTE]

You have WATCHED reining and cutting if you’re a QH fan right? The only way a WB (and I’m a sporthorse person) could compare with a good cutting/reining horse for energy and explosiveness would be if you shoved a stick of TNT up their hinder parts! And reach/movement of the warmblood variety would be as useless on a reining horse as it would be on a 3-gaited Saddlebred ! They are just not put together to do that job and if you did find one freak wb who was, why would you risk outcrossing to it (and ending with a throwback to its dressagey wb forebears) instead of going with a proven successful bloodline?

Are you one of those QH fanciers who thinks it’s perfectly cool for a QH to be 7/8 TB, 17h and look like it just crossed the finish line at Churchill Downs?

Jennifer

[Tamara_in_TN]

[QUOTE=Plumcreek;5130955]
Right.

It is not the breed, it is the conformation and the strength in the rear end to hold the ground in a slide.[/QUOTE]

right, I can put rate and handle and want to on just about any breed out there…but the great slide is a conformation thing completely:)

Tamara in TN

[Tamara_in_TN]

[QUOTE=ThirdCharm;5131318]

Are you one of those QH fanciers who thinks it’s perfectly cool for a QH to be 7/8 TB, 17h and look like it just crossed the finish line at Churchill Downs?

Jennifer[/QUOTE]

there are QH lines for that as well…
and there are 14hh low headed brush cats what slink the ground and 16.2hh snow plows that work the Nawthern ranches

the fact is most people outside the breed have no idea of the differences

Tamara in TN

[ThirdCharm]

What the Europeans will do is import some of our best QH bloodlinesN ruthlessly cull anything that has navicular or HYPP like the AQHA shoulda done a long time ago, and start kicking our behinds in reining…

Jennifer