Reminds me of the time I rode a lesson horse the barn had just acquired with a western background.
Imagine my surprise when I realized he’d been trained with a very light spur stop 🫣.
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I’m afraid that would be me if I bought a western trained horse with a spur stop! I’ve always trained my own.
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My current fox hunter/mounted archery horse is a cutting/sorting horse. I love it! Only a few times has the “whoa” caught me off-guard --once when I was learning mounted archery, the instructor shouted, “lift your BOW,” horsey heard “Bow” and thought “Whoa,” and slid to a stop (he tucks his butt and slides).
Another time, still archery, I cued a turn from standing still --just wanted horse to point the other direction --he did a 180 so fast I did a 360! I slid off still clutching my bow and arrows. (He’s not very tall).
Last example is on the hunt field —a hound cut in front of horse --he sat down rather than step on the hound --nearly sent me over his head --but I stayed on --just cracked my sternum on the pommel of the saddle.
He’s a jewel --I love asking him to do cool stuff —roll back when asked to reverse field, go from canter to standing still in a stride (when I’m prepared for it). Fun horse!
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mine get broke at the cowboy, and they all have serious brakes. you have to just slowly untrain too much whoa. i also had to get mine used to more leg because they were so reactive to leg. figured out after a few that I can’t leave them at the cowboy for too long or I have to untrain some things. It just takes repetition and consistency to work through it. Lots of transitions will help. Knowing they are sensitive, you have to meet them part way and ask less “hard” at first. Add additional “pressure” as they adapt to more cue.
Tangent: I rode my friends WP horse a few times and could never get the cues just right (he’s also really tall and I’m really short).
Almost every time that horse would “randomly” transition to his WP lope (I’m sure I cued him and didnt realize) and I could not get him to stop! Laughing, I’d be mock screaming that I was on the world’s slowest run away.
He was a nice horse, and it was such a shame he had to be retired so young due to a myriad of soundness issues. As nice as he was WP he was drop dead gorgeous when he moved out, and cute over fences. I always wanted to take him in a hunter division or two. I never could figure out those WP cues though.
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YEARS ago I bought and showed/evented a reining trained Appendix QH. He was fun and fabulous. I really enjoyed jump offs when we had to make quick turns and I could ask for a roll-back. Center lines meant I had to ‘sit tall’ but be careful NEVER to get my shoulders behind the vertical. I had some rather prominent judges LOVE him. He did have a great work ethic. The only problem he had was that he had been abused and could not be caught in a field or tied… and he was terrified of men in cowboy hats. But he never stopped at a jump, never even dropped a rail. When I sold him he went to a Pony Clubber and when she went to college he taught the mom dressage. I would buy him or one like him in a heartbeat.
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Does anyone have experience retraining a horse like this for dressage?
I have experience with this horse retraining me. Any minute adjustment with your seat meant Do Something. Sat too deeply and you would be stopped in the middle of the arena (same as if you blocked/interfered with your seat in the slightest). You would not get going again until you were lighter and freer.
Similarly, this horse was very much a “shift your seat too much/sit too strongly in one way” and suddenly you were doing a half pass, flying change, counter canter, etc. It was super discombobulating but the flip side is that I cannot think of another horse who did more good for my equitation and sense of bodily awareness in the saddle. For me, it was a thrilling kind of challenge and I really felt like he polished me as a rider.
These are the types of horses that will teach you to always ask just enough, but never more, and you can gain a lot of refinement and subtlety (and body control!) in the process.
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This is the type of horse I grew up with, and why I wasn’t sure my mare would ever be sensitive enough for me. She has such an unreactive nature it has taken a lot to get her super responsive. You absolutely have to teach them to be active behind in downwards… but you do with by other green horse, too.
The one thing which would make me hesitate is if this horse slides hard in turnout. Every horse I looked at with a big slide (10’+ every time) in turnout messed up his hocks because they were harder on themselves than trainers were!
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I had an 18hh all legs type WB who loved doing sliding stops to the gate. I would call him over and he would book it and slide to the gate every time. I saw shocked and fearful expressions on many faces of people that stood with me when I called him. LoL. His hocks were still fault free the last time I had him xrayd at about 15. He jumped large things for his career. He was started young. He had a lot of miles on him.
I’m betting conformation and early raising has a lot to do with longevity of the hocks and not so much how much tooliganism they get up to out in the field when they are free of the weight and other demands of a rider. Maybe not, but that’s my guess.
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You see a horse with a hard stop, I see a rider with no experience with reining horses… I bet this horse’s owners would think just the opposite. 
Regardless of discipline, horses should be stopping off your seat, not your hands, so I wouldn’t call a big stop like this a training problem. Could you refine* him to be softer/more forward through the halt? Sure. But you will have to change the way you handle and ride him. If you don’t think you can commit to changing the way you handle and ride, and commit to having no timeline (IE don’t assume you’ll get it in 30-6-90 days etc) to refine this horse, I’d pass on him. Some riders just don’t adapt to individual horses as well as others. There is nothing wrong with that, but know your limitations if you think that’s you.
You have to ride the horse that’s underneath you, not the horse you think they are. Comparing a reining horse with a big stop to a classical dressage horse is unfair to both.
*I wouldn’t use the word “retrain” here, but instead refine. He already has a good stop, don’t un-train it as others are recommending. Refine it by asking him to be more forward through the transitions down, while being as light and small as possible with your cues. If you never start with light cues, you will never have a horse that responds to light cues. Don’t just blindly kick him forward if he stops… He will just get defensive about your aids and stopping in general. I’d rather push them laterally into a small circle and drive them forward into the circle with a normal, light cue. Once he’s moving forward, come out of the small circle and try again.
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OP, I suggest you need to look at yourself and decide if you are willing to change YOUR ways. They say if you want to improve your tennis game, you need to play with someone better than you. Seems like this horse could teach you a lot.
Take a look below. Dressage Rider and Cowboy…they ride their respective horses then swap horses at about 4 minute mark. I think the cowboy roder the dressage warmblood much more softly and fluidly than the dressage rider.
Actually if you look closely at around 4:28, the dressage rider “stops” the western horse with his seat a couple of times…and the rider gives some pretty crude leg cues to get the horse to move on…eg., he kicks the horse…
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I guarantee it’s not the same as what I’m talking about.
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I guarantee you probably can’t imagine a tall warmblood sitting on his ass and “paddling” with front legs exactly like a reining horse. 
It was absolutely terrifying until one realized it was totally under control.
THIS ^^ x 100. What it sounds like is that you are using a strong seat aid, but also that you are taking your leg off. Learn to lighten your seat aid (think it rather than do it, as others have suggested) and keep your leg ON. Also, if this is happening when all you are trying to do is half halt, then you are holding the half halt much too long. Finally, you mentioned that it happens when you are trying to rebalance him, it sounds like he is not losing his balance in the first place if he can tuck and halt so readily. Concentrate on the forward and only half halt when you really need to. Good luck! He sounds like a keeper.
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As a hunter-turned-ranch rider, I’d like to second/third a lot of the advice you’ve already been given and add some tips of my own.
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Never, ever, ever say “whoa” unless you mean “stop your feet RIGHT NOW and do not move again until told otherwise!”
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Watch a few top level reining patterns. You will notice that, when the riders ask for a stop, they bring their shoulders behind their hips and push their legs forward and off the horse. However, when they transition from large fast circles to small slow circles, they simply slow their seat and keep their legs on. This is a key distinction for well trained reiners. Keep your legs on the horse unless you want to stop entirely.
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If he gets quicker than you want at the canter, in addition to a slightly deeper/stiller seat, try pressing your lips together and humming softly. Many reiners use this cue. You can’t do it in the dressage ring, but it may be helpful for this transition period.
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Most of the actual guiding of these horses is done from just the rider’s seat and weight. It’s amazing how sensitive a nice working western horse is to the slightest change in your body. Enjoy this part!
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I’ve been riding my friend’s ranch/roping horse quite a bit and I’ve gotten a little bit addicted to that feeling! I recently purchased the gelding I’ve been riding/leading for years, and he has a lot of opinions about riding on contact which lead to evasion and general bodily wonkiness; rather than continue with what hasn’t worked, I started incorporating some of the ranch riding stuff and the difference has been night and day. It reminds me to ride back to front and his self carriage has improved immensely.
He’s 19 and I don’t really have any definite competition goals, so I’m happy to let him be Wenglish if it keeps him comfortable and happy.
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You don’t need to have a cinderblock of “contact” to ride in competition. Here is Alizee Froment riding Mistral with no saddle or bridle…and in GP Freestyle competition. You can see the very light contact she has in the bridle because the horse is in complete self carriage.
In the first video she discusses the effect of the aids thru the seat and balance.
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At least he’s not trained to Spur Stop? That’s a fun one to switch to English.
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