I don’t think they actually know. I think they are assuming or repeating what they heard as fact. A poster here recently stated her opinion based on the Facebook comments ignoring the actual articles.
I have to ask, those who think this is too far in the past to count, you believe that there should be a limit on prosecution for things like assault and rape? How many years does a victim have to come forward?
Here is a list for civil assault. https://injury.findlaw.com/torts-and…-by-state.html
here is actually a good criminal chart:
thttps://victimsofcrime.org/docs/DNA%…y.pdf?sfvrsn=2
Not making any claims about whether this is right or too far, but just answering your factual question.
Are you suggesting that USEF conducts itself like a Communist organization? People are being outed to USEF because of their opinions? If one is a member of USEF, opinions MUST all reflect those of USEF or else? If I wasn’t already convinced that some of the more deranged people make up the horse industry, I’m sure now. Be careful of what you wish for.
I am very sorry for his family and friends. Such a loss is difficult to deal with.
But, I just read this Facebook comment:
I hope the accuser has remorse guilt…she is a murderer
Safe Sport has stated there were multiple accusers. I think very few people know all the details of this case.
Whoa. None of that was said. This was all part of a larger conversation.
@Testable said in post #435
What responsibility do licensed officials have vis a vie safe sport? This was posted on facebook by a USEF steward in one of the recent threads:
“Some people will do anything for blue ribbons Once they get them , they forget what they were willing to do for them And then the stories begin. I’m disgusted with women crying wolf”
If true, I find it highly inappropriate and unprofessional that an alleged USEF steward would be making such statements publicly. USEF should be made aware of what their licensed officials are posting on the internet with regard to USEF business.
I haven’t shown seriously for about 20 years and when I did it was in Dressage in the late 80s - early 2000s, and the scandals in my sport were few and far between compared to the stuff we hear about now. I can’t say that it’s shocking to hear of another trainer who was accused and sanctioned for inappropriate contact with a minor or minors, but it’s immensely shocking to see how many people have a problem with our sport being asked to adhere to the same regulations and answer to the same governing body that the other Olympic sports do.
All this has shown me is that if I had kids they would not be allowed to show horses, period. This isn’t because I think that trainers are all predators. This is because a few people on this thread and far more in the Facebook thread have shown me that if my kid were being subtly groomed by a trainer there are FAR too many people who don’t know the difference between right and wrong because they are too busy hero worshipping their trainers, and my kid would not be safe around people with those priorities. In spite of what some of you seem to think, parents cannot keep their eyes and ears on their kids every second and even when they do it does not mean parents can protect their children entirely. Larry Nassar abused little girls with their parents in the room. How many of you have had your leg position adjusted by a trainer on the ground? Would someone standing on the opposite side of the horse on the ground know how far up their hand went? What if this was done repeatedly over time until you thought the “adjustment” was normal and done to help you achieve the correct hip angle? :no: This is just one possible example of abuse right under the parent’s nose I can think of off the top of my head. What if your kid went back to the tack room or to cool off their horse on the trails with another rider and quietly asked if that had ever happened to them and they were told to keep it quiet and definitely never tell their parents because it’s no big deal and the talented, generous, amazing trainer would be so embarrassed and maybe have his life ruined?
Pony moms searching for info on what happened to Rob Gage may decide that their kids need to pull out of showing after reading some of these comments and those on Facebook. This is not the pre-internet 80s and early 90s where scandals can be more limited in scope and damage. The vitriol against Safesport, USEF and victims who speak out are throwing gas on a fire that might get out of control to the degree that horse showing is viewed in the future as an ugly, dangerous and unseemly sport to parents with the money and time to send their kids for lessons (and maybe at the higher levels where the competition is incredibly fierce and the money is serious it actually is).
WOW! My jaw legit dropped. How can people be so EVIL?
BINGO. There are so many people that knew what was going on and don’t want their skeletons to come out.
Many in the equestrian world live in the bubble and don’t pay any attention to how the “real world” works. It is unethical for lawyers to have intimate personal relationships with their ADULT clients. It is unethical for doctors, psychologists, other health professionals to have sex with their ADULT clients. It is illegal for an adult to have sexual relationships with a minor and was illegal in the 70’s.
Not every parent dropped their kids off at the barn because they didn’t care enough to stay. Many barns had working students, many barn to this day have kids that help out. It benefits both sides. The barn owners need fewer full time employees because they have juniors that want to work, or are working off part of their bill.
Not all the reports are from promiscuous 17 year olds. Not every 15, 16, 17 year old was drinking and wanting to have sex with their trainer. Were there some, sure, but to generalize that these woman now complaining were at fault is just ignorant. One reason people come forward 30 -40 years later is they are taking back the control that was stolen from them as a child. No one listened when they were abused, accusers/victims today are not always believed. Not every SafeSport complaint is about revenge. Many victims have spent years in therapy and are finally able to take the step and report the abuse. SafeSport is listening when others are not.
There are plenty of trainers who are voicing their opinions on FB. Are “screenshots” going to be taken of their comments and sent to USEF & Safe Sport? The bigger picture is that USEF is just a club, and like all clubs, can fade into obscurity just as easily as it was formed. All it takes is someone with big pockets and the legal expertise to start a new organization, and the want and support to do so.
There is a big difference between a licensed official and a trainer.
If the USHJA left the USEF, I doubt the USEF would fade into obscurity.
I’ve said on other threads that I absolutely welcome the formation of a new hunter club, where they can drug horses and assault people to their hearts content, or at least until they all go to jail.
It is hilarious that what spurs them to do so are literally those two things.
As Denali said, there’s a different level of expectation from a trainer (USEF member) and a steward (USEF official). A trainer agrees to abide by the rules; a steward agrees to enforce them… and often gets paid to do so.
You say USEF is a club… and to be a member of a club, you have to abide by the rules. The alleged statement of the steward is inappropriate on every level, especially for a club official. No matter how you spin it, it reflects poorly on the organization and insinuates the very rules the steward is to be enforcing are not being upheld. Most anywhere would not want their representatives conducting themselves in that manner online with regard to the organization.
If a trainer’s public post is in violation of SafeSport rules, by all means, I think the post should be sent to USEF & SafeSport as well.
When I read the outraged comments on FB all I can do is wonder how many of those loudly complaining are losing sleep at night remembering their own transgressions.
You and me both. I think a lot of people are running scared. Some of them because they are guilty and know it’s just a matter of time. Others because they may have allowed guilty behavior to perpetuate and are afraid they are about to be in the crosshairs by association.
However, I also think a large number of people are running scared out of ignorance, often willful ignorance. They aren’t reading the SafeSport policies; they are just buying in to the hysteria. Trainers whom people like and respect save face with their clients by saying the SafeSport suspension was because of an anonymous tip submitted by a competitor out of jealousy and they never got to defend themselves. People buy the trainer’s excuse hook, line, and sinker. No one bothers to read the policies and say, “hey, that isn’t how this is supposed to work.” Instead, they join the angry mob and add fuel to the fire. They say things like, “I had a consensual relationship with a 17 year old when I was 18 and I might lose my livelihood because of it!” No, you won’t.
One thing that has surprised me over the past couple days is how many prominent people have stated their involvement with investigations that did not result in suspension. I have read so many responses from officials and trainers that refer to that; to me, that indicates the system is working to protect those falsely accused.
All those threads do show that way too many people are clueless about the constitution.
I’m trying to be charitable and say right now it’s just the product of grief - losing someone you look up to, admire, and love, can lead to lots of casting about, especially after a suicide.
The problem is that that process, plus social media, leads to a building of anger and every little rumor becoming “fact” in people’s minds.
I think law enforcement should be the first step in sexual abuse / harassment allegations and accusations. Safe Sport should be the last step and when all the evidence and facts are in. They are ill equipped to handle investigations. They are not lawyers or police. They are a board established by Congress and the USOC.
We should remember the legal system was founded on Innocent until proven guilty.
I would strongly suggest you go back and read the entire thread, especially the parts where the “due process” and the difference tween constitutional rights and rules for participating in a club are discussed at length.
We should also remember that:
a) Safe Sport is reporting to law enforcement when applicable
b) Safe sport isn’t putting anyone in prison. They might be kicking them out of a private organization.