Rule Change making spurs optional in FEI classes; thoughts?

I’m on an iPad and haven’t figured multiple quotes

More like WHAT. Try the use of “traditional” tack like bits, saddles, nose bands…etc.

Is English not your native tongue?

:rofl:

Sacred, not scared…presumably meant to imply those things of dressage that are deemed untouchably holy to the institution, much as cows are to the Hindu religion :slight_smile:

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As I said I’m on an iPad…hate it when the machine has its own mind…I will edit my post

EDITED to add that it took me until this morning to realize I had typed “sacred” correctly and it was @trubandloki who typed “scared”…ok my excuse was I was waiting at gate at an airport with flight delayed and not in a great mood.

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I liked my typing error better.

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Fair enough! But I think the scared cows of dressage-land would be a whole 'nuther discussion. :shushing_face:

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I would think that calling dressage people cows is not the correct path to a rule change…

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Sigh…I really don’t know what to think. Help me out here. Are you being purposely obtuse? Or did you just lead a sheltered life and don’t know what an idiomatic expression is?

A “sacred cow” is not a person…It is a figure of speech for something, (an idea or belief) that is considered immune from question or criticism

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What about a scared cow/

Talk to my iPad…it has a mind of its own…I am now back on my trusty computer with mouse and real keyboard.

Y’all ought to read John richard Young’s “The Schooling of the Western Horse”
.
(ducking and running)

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So to me, the reason why a tight noseband is problematic is because
(a) there is no release
(b) there is a bit in the mouth creating pressure in the mouth that is exacerbated by the cage around it.

It’s not nose pressure per se that is a problem and there are bitless options that seem perfectly comfortable for the horse.

(Also the classical lunging cavessons are all about nose pressure, and quite heavy besides. So we’re not against nose pressure as a thing.)

To me the equipment rules are valid for the purpose of “harmony” - ie prohibiting equipment that is most likely painful to the horse and guiding people to simpler, kinder equipment. I don’t think they’re valid for purposes of fashion or even because that was the equipment in use 100 years ago when competitive dressage first became a thing.

I’m fine riding in a noseband but I’m also not clear on the point of requiring one. Why does this need to be a rule? Is it to keep me safe, so the bridle can’t fall off? Is it to force contact with the bit if the horse opens its mouth? Is it because it looks nice? Honestly I’m not convinced by any of these.

I also am very tired of the “why not make your own organization” answer instead of engaging with the question of why the rules are necessary and beneficial in creating the aims of a quality dressage ride, which I see as being about engagement, lightness, self-carriage, and harmony between horse and rider. The rest are details.

(It’s not even a good or helpful answer: a better and more empathetic answer is that Western Dressage exists and allows participation both bitless and without a noseband. For people who want to show their skills that way, or have a finicky horse that is not going well in a typical dressage bridle, that is a kind and useful answer.)

I feel like a lot of this reactivity is actually fear, fear that allowing bitless or noseband free will become obligations to be bitless or noseband free. I don’t find that especially likely nor do I personally plan to ride that way. I just think fewer rules are better. I think asking why a rule is there and if it is necessary is valuable.

(So if you want to argue that the real problem with bitless is that it’s too hard to add all the possibilities into the Dressage equipment rules when they can’t even manage crownpieces and are going completely bananas trying to manage different bit types, that’s an argument that makes much more sense to me. )

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You do understand that pretty much every sport has varying levels of ambition. talent, skill, and competition? Not everyone has the ambition to show FEI or even at all. My friend gets very nice scores at training/first level - high 60s/low 70s. So how is she harming the sport?

The woman I know is very clear in her ambition and knowing she is never moving past 1st level.
Why, exactly, should she sit the trot when her ambition level does not exceed an appropriate level?
She is well aware that her talent and ambition will not support more than she is doing and your going to “another version of not sitting the trot” is just a thinly veiled dig at riders that you deem unworthy.

It’s not just YMMV moment. There is a reason that most shows have 50% of their riders at first level or below. Because most of these riders know they are not ever going to put in the time/afford the lessons/horse to compete above that level and are just happy to be out with their barn friends, enjoying their hobby and time with friends. I’d lose my mind never moving past first level, but that’s me - and I put in the work. But, so long as the horse is happy and appropriately ridden at a level that they can do, I don’t judge. YMMV.

ETAing to try and cover your shaming moment doesn’t change my interpretation that you come across as anyone who cannot sit a PSG extended trot to CDI quality should never go to a show.

Judges are instructed to be as positive as possible. It’s where we are at as a society right now. Everyone gets a participation trophy, you can’t be critical, etc… because… feelings. Some judges are scared if they were to truly be honest, some snowflakes would be filing Safe Sport complaints about body shaming. I scribe quite a bit and sit with judges all the time who struggle with how to word their further comments so as to be nice enough to not get a complaint while giving constructive feedback.

If we were high school kids and someone had posted the vid of the SoCal rider, everyone would be losing their minds about the bullying. I found her riding to be abhorrent, but posting that video online for the world to skewer was unnecessarily mean girl. It needed to be addressed at the show level by the judges and TD, not online.

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It sounds like you find this limiting but the approach of constructive feedback and positive reinforcement is well supported by science for any biological neural network. It works for horses, dogs, and people.

You can extinguish Try. If you want people to simply stop coming to dressage shows and spending their money, sure, that’s a thing. But then you lose the ability to positively shape their riding or to have them supporting competitions for more ambitious types or even to grow them into the higher levels.

Constructive criticism - by which I mean, Identify things that are changeable and provide pointers, identify things that are good and reinforce them, and give honest evaluations against the rubric - that’s how you grow people.

Telling people they are fat or don’t have enough arms to participate and really shouldn’t bother does not grow people.

It can take some thought to figure out maybe some better ways to phrase what you really mean. If it’s “develop more seat in the sitting trot” that’s much more usable than “you’re fat and why did you even try.” It’s also more accurate.

I think it’s as fair to ask judges to do better and improve their practice, as it is of our riders. We share the same goals and we are not enemies in this.

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You might want to work on those reading comprehension skills as I never said or implied any such thing.

I agree. So many riders, especially amateurs at 3rd level, do not have a clue how to use a double bridle. Horses are behind the vertical with gapping mouths and no impulsion.

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I don’t think it’s wrong or mean to tell a rider that their weight or lack of fitness is a deterrent to their horses performance and health. I remember the BO let a woman use one of her horses at a show we were going to. The judge wrote on the score sheet that the riders weight was not compatible with the size and strength of the horse. The BO was crying when she showed it to me, she felt so bad for her horse, but said she felt pressured by the trainer to loan the horse.

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