Saddle Fitting, Wide Short Backed Hony

[CoastalPony]

For context, I live in a remote area without consistent fitter visits. I haven’t found anyone able to help or make suggestions with this, which is fair - if they don’t stock anything and aren’t aware of anything that would work I won’t expect miracles.

I’m at a point where I’m wondering if people are just being polite and not just saying this particular horse and I aren’t going to be a fit physically.

We’ve had limited success with Amerigo and Harry Dabbs, but there hasn’t been a long term solution. Both were realistically too long but the balance was forward so we got away with it short term. Mare eventually did get sore over her lumbar while we looked for better options, so I don’t want to repeat that experiment.

The basics of my question: oversized GRP mare has 15" space for her saddle. I’m needing a 17.5" seat. In fairness I could lose weight, but the reality is even at my tiniest we’re maybe looking at a generous 17", so a minimum 2" difference between her back and my saddle (pretending panels are same length as tree). Is that even a possibility, especially long term as the primary rider? I’ve read the SMS recommends shortening the panel no more than 1/2" smaller than tree size, and I’m not sure how the math really works as far as me being adult sized and the balance/weight distribution on a really short panel.

My bigger picture question I guess is just because I could in theory have a saddle custom made, should I? Does it make sense? Is there a point where we just say the rider doesn’t fit the horse?

[LilRanger]

You know who else rides wide, short-backed honies? The British! Look at some of the British saddle makers, many are designed for just such horses. I’ve seen many threads here on saddles for wide backs, and British saddles are often recommended.

[ClearDonkey]

Echoing the British-made recommendation. I ride my short-backed, round Morgan in a Black Country Eloquence X, but many of the hoop tree British saddles that we tried provided a good fit.

[exvet]

I have owned, shown and bred Welsh Cobs for many years. I currently own 3 and all have very little real estate in terms of length of back. My coming 11 year old who I’ve been competing in dressage has only 15 inches to work with which has been a challenge with his beer keg round barrel (but flat back) and very large shoulders. I did have a Prestige semi-custom made for him by going with a 17 inch seat on pony panels a few years ago. It worked for a while but now he’s outgrown that one and I’m currently in saddle search hell. I am making due with Antares but have had to go with a 16.5 inch seat which for me is doable but there are 16.5 inch saddle that have been too long for his back due to gussets. There are used saddles for sale that have larger seats 17-17.5 on pony panels (used to be you’d see them on 15-16 inch seats when talking English disciplines). I do agree with others that the British made saddles could very well be a place to start whether you go custom, semi-custom or used. Good luck. I purchased the used Antares to use for the meantime. I am lucky in that I have a saddle fitter scheduled to come next month. I’m extra lucky because she’s an independent fitter so not married to any specific brand. I’ve used her before for other short-back honies with good results. Hoping she can pull out another miracle for me.

[CoastalPony]

Thank you for this! I’ve also got Welsh Cobs and am very partial to them. Luckily there was a little more real estate to work with on my current cob mare, so while length was a consideration, it was more the keg barrel that was the challenge. The youngsters I have look like they’ll be on the bigger side, so fingers crossed I’ll be OK. I’ve been served well by a few of the british brands for the cobs I’ve had - thank you to everyone for confirming they are still the way to go.

BUT I absolutely did not learn my lesson re: harder to fit honies, because the GRP mare grew up and suddenly I am looking at withers, big shoulders, plus a short AND curvy back

I’ll reach out and see if I can get some traction by asking for options with pony panels - I wasn’t sure if the seat size I need would exclude that option but it’s nice to hear you had some success. I feel like I thought I had ponies with short backs, then this one grew up and hers ended up a full inch shorter than the one I thought was short. I’ve been second guessing my life choices ever since. I understand your frustration well. Good luck with your fitter, fingers crossed!

[exvet]

I think my coming 3 year old section D will be a little more forgiving in his length of back for saddle fitting but he’s going to be VERY wide shouldered. My coming 11 year old is my homebred and his short back didn’t/doesn’t really surprise me. That being said, I think every Welsh Cob I’ve taken up the levels have required significant changes in their saddles or total switch outs every 2 levels or so just because the way they develop muscle on their frames. Just out of curiosity is there any Welsh in your GRP?

[CoastalPony]

Her sire was Welsh B (Wedderlie Mardi Gras), dam swedish warmblood. She looked liked a petite warmblood until about 6, then suddenly she filled out hugely and at 8 I get asked if she’s out of my cob mare all the time.

My current D mare is 16 this year and yes, a succession of saddles through her life - she went from baby potato to growing some withers and a serious topline doing lower level eventing and dressage, and now we’re trending back to a trail riding potato I’ve got a pair of coming two year old welsh D geldings I’m excited about, one of which is going to have the massive shoulders you speak of. I’ve saved every remotely cobby fitting saddle I’ve ever owned in hopes of the whole thing being a little less painful when the time comes.

[ChocoMare]

My late mare, Penny, was a Clyde/Standardbred cross and shaped exactly the same way – wide, BIG shoulders, short-backed and scoopy. The only saddle that ever fit was a County–made in England Believe me, I tried them all – nothing ever fit right until my W/XW County Perfection was delivered.

[exvet]

I hear you. I’ve done the same in terms of my own personal saddle bank. I asked about your GRP’s breeding because my one and only GRP was half-welsh cob lol. What I found for her that fit was a Cardanel Profi XW. Of course, I sold it when I was downsizing the herd, disbanding my breeding program and felt confident that my now coming 11 year old homebred would not likely be shaped the same because he was out of another mare (section C welsh cob) and by my (at the time) section D stallion; so, no close relations even going 5 generations back although both true to type. I did keep his sire’s saddle which is still sitting unused in my tack room (MW Albion SLK). I’m hoping it might fit the coming 3 year old section D but I’m not going to hold my breath and are they closely related, not until the 5th generation back . While I’ve managed to have some hand me down saddles fit a few of the young stock for a while, none of my welsh cobs or derivations thereof have ridden in the same saddle as another once hitting third level or going above…of course.

[RedOakAcres]

I somehow managed to breed a short backed hony out of a 16.2 hh mare by a 17 hh stallion. I use a custom Loxley by Bliss saddle that works great on her. It’s a 17.5 seat on pony panels. I lucked out and bought it used. I highly recommend that you look into the Loxley/Bliss saddles.

[Festivity]

I don’t have cobs but I have a short (15.2) Friesian who’s back tracings look like a rainbow and doesn’t have a ton of length for a saddle. I also have wide backed Arabs. I currently have an EQ saddle science saddle for the friesian which was adjusted when she dropped weight nursing so it now fits her and the two Arab mares. It’s great for being able to adjust fit as muscling and weight changes. It also provides a lot of shoulder freedom and all of my horses move out better in it. I’m currently trying to figure out how to fit two more of their saddles, or the reactor panel saddles which are basically the same just for endurance/trail, into the budget so everyone has their own saddle for when the rest of the family rides. EQ has been super easy to work with and will do remote fittings if they don’t have anyone in your area.

[CoastalPony]

County is/was my brand of choice for my Welsh D mare, sadly they weren’t able to come up with anything short enough for the GRP mare - the XW in (I think it was the Perfection) otherwise could have worked. Thank you for the excellent suggestion though - I would have been happy to carry on with them, I had an Epiphany and an ancient Stabilizer that I absolutely loved.

[CoastalPony]

Too funny…my initial venture into GRP shopping was because I wanted another Welsh D but wasn’t finding what I wanted that was at or near riding age. So I thought to explore Welsh D/warmblood cross. Which led me to buying the little yearling Welsh B cross from the same breeder that actually ticked none of the boxes I had set out for myself

The saddle collection was/is something that I keep spread out between house, barn, and trailer. If they were all in the same place I’d have to admit there is a possible tack hoarding problem. I’ll report back in a couple of years, it will be funny (unfunny) if none of these saddles end up being useful for the young cobs

[CoastalPony]

Thank you for the reminder! I’ve ridden in one of their jump saddles on a borrowed pony and quite liked it.

[CoastalPony]

Thank you, I will look into this. (also the ‘back tracings look like a rainbow’ made me lol. YES I have ponies who make these tracings also)

[Nous]

You could try these people:
https://www.comfortsaddles.co.uk/comfort-elite-saddles/comfort-elite-coblet-saddle

The blurb sounds exactly like what you’re looking for:

So what are our customers mainly looking for? A well designed saddle which fits a wide , short, straight back, forward girth groove and usually quite a bit of excess … flesh

These little guys often have a very short back and big shoulders so often we are making overshot seats to accommodate the riders if they need a bigger seat than the Colbet’s short back can accommodate and this an option on the new Coblet Saddles, the saddle has a deeper secure seat and straighter cut flap to show off the shoulder.

[ChocoMare]

The other one I’d suggest is DP Saddlery. Their saddles are drop-dead gorgeous and can accommodate the Hard to Fit. Adjustable Saddles | DP Saddlery | United States

[Mealticket]

Try a Fairfax. I have a 14h morgan with the very short back, no withers, bulldog build. They are adjustable and nicely made, 1/3 the price of the custom County Connection I had made for her. She hated the County saddle even after 4 adjustments and so do I. She likes the Fairfax a lot, nice leather.

[BraveSC]

Black Country’s can have/be made with a short upswept back gusset so maybe that might be worth exploring?

[Knights_Mom]

My Draft X has a very wide but short back. Ended up the best saddle fits him so well. It’s a used L’apogee.