Saddle returned from trial broken… ugh

[StormyDay]

So, I sell saddles online. Most are older models that need a bit of love before they go to their next home.
Well, about a week ago I got a message saying someone wanted to return a western saddle due to undisclosed damage on the fenders. Sadly, UPS sometimes plays kickball with boxes so I know how it goes. I sent them a return label (so I paid return shipping). I got it today and that damage was actually on the stirrup leather, where the whole buckle was cut off (gnawed off maybe??) and missing. I have photos showing it in good condition before it shipped. There’s no way this happened in shipping.
What the heck.

What do you guys do when a customer ruins a saddle on trial? Do you still refund them? Do you charge a fee for damages? I have never, ever had this happen, and I’ve sold quite a few saddles.

[Fiesta01]

I would kindly explain that the damage could not have been from shipping. I would deduct the cost for repair from their refund. (Speaking as a saddle user, not a saddle seller). Good luck! So aggravating.

[endlessclimb]

If the damage is $100 or less, I might just eat the cost - though I would say something to the individual returning the saddle so they know you are a benevolent god.

[trubandloki]

Did they tell you the damage was caused in shipping or just did not tell you about the details of the damage and you assumed it was caused during shipping.

How could this damage be caused?

In other words, how honest has this buyer been?

I would send them a note and discuss the damage and ask them how much they feel the refund should be with the damage they caused.

[furlong47]

They break it, they bought it. But that depends on how you sold it - sometimes payment services or sale sites will side with the buyer even if they are obviously at fault. If you don’t have a clear policy about returns and damage on your listings, you should. But actually being able to enforce it is not always easy. If they refuse to admit that they caused the damage and refuse to pay a fee/repairs/for the saddle, what are you really going to do? I suppose you could go to small claims court.

[clanter]

there may be a way of recovering full restitution if you can find out their homeowners coverage

my policy

We cover:
Tangible personal property owned or used by any “insured” while it is anywhere in the world After a loss and at your request, we will cover the loss of personal property owned by:

1. Others while the property is on the part of the “residence premises” occupied by any “insured”

[wsmoak]

How was the payment made, and how ironclad is your contract?

Did they communicate with you about the problem when it arrived? If they have pictures of a mangled box and damaged saddle, then your claim is probably with the shipper.

Is it repairable? Depending on how much is involved and how likely the payment method (credit card? paypal?) is to side with the buyer, you may just end up considering this a cost of doing business.

[endlessclimb]

@wsmoak

Depending on how much is involved and how likely the payment method (credit card? paypal?) is to side with the buyer, you may just end up considering this a cost of doing business.

This is my thought, and the fact that reputation is everything. I don’t know if it’s worth the hassle if the damage can be repaired for <100.

[clanter]

@endlessclimb

This is my thought, and the fact that reputation is everything. I don’t know if it’s worth the hassle if the damage can be repaired for <100.

Target and some other retailers are now not even accepting returned merchandise they are just issuing full credit telling the customer to just keep it since handling the return is “more hassle” than its worth (warehouses are full of junk they need to sell)

[StormyDay]

They said it arrived damaged. But, both stirrups are off. So clearly they did something with it before contacting me. And I guess I just don’t get why someone would take the other stirrup off if the stirrup leather was broken. The buyer also said he oiled it, which is a weird thing to do if something is already broken. At this point, it’s non-usable and is probably going to be more in repairs than it’s worth.

It’s also a really weird break, it looks like maybe an animal chewed on it or something.

They paid through Facebook marketplace. It was about $300, so as far as repairs go I don’t think I could find someone in the area to repair it for less than it’s worth, sadly.

[NaturallyHappy]

I’m very sorry. That’s a creepy thing to do. Since they sent it back damaged, I can’t imagine they would be honorable to deal with. Perhaps send pictures telling them you talked w the shipper and were told they do not believe the damage was caused in transit and see what happens. I wonder if they left it out and a puppy got it.

[sascha]

@StormyDay

They paid through Facebook marketplace. It was about $300, so as far as repairs go I don’t think I could find someone in the area to repair it for less than it’s worth, sadly

Eat the loss and sell it for less to someone who wants it as a barstool/decor? It sucks, but you’re not likely to get anywhere with someone like that. If they’d had any scruples THEY would have eaten the(ir) loss.

[StormyDay]

Well, I still have their money. So i can tell them to go kick rocks, which was my immediate reaction.

But I figured I’d ask on here to see if there was an industry standard on what sellers do in this situation.

[trubandloki]

Do you have a video of you packing the saddle that shows the saddle without this damage?

[endlessclimb]

@NaturallyHappy

I wonder if they left it out and a puppy got it.

That, or they have a bigtime rat problem?

I’m torn here, OP. I’d probably take the loss, and sell it as a barstool or something.

[StormyDay]

@trubandloki

Do you have a video of you packing the saddle that shows the saddle without this damage?

Not packing it, no. Just photos from its listing.

[jvanrens]

No suggestions, but would really love to see before and after pictures of the saddle.

Depending on where you live there might be a saddle maker that could do up a new leather for you for a reasonable price.

[beowulf]

They may have broken it during use. I’ve seen western riders run tie downs through stirrups. If a horse objected that could certainly break it. It may be they intended to keep the saddle until that happened, hence the oiling, then something happened while using it that broke it and now they’re sending it back. Both stirrups being impacted at the same spot makes me think it is more likely misuse than a puppy. I’m sorry you’re in that situation. If you don’t have a contract clearly spelled out about what happens when items are not returned in the same condition as they left, you may not be able to deduct cost to repair from the refund.

I did a lot of selling items on eBay in a past career. This thread is proof positive of why I always took a video of the item from all perspectives as it was being packed. We had our fair share of people claim items arrived to them damaged.

[MunchingonHay]

For a living I sell large commerical machines that are shipped via freight (not UPS for FedEx, but the big guys). And you would not believe how many times a forklift operator will drop a 400lb crate or stab the wooden crate with a fork and destroy the machine and then SHIP IT TO THE OWNER.

So when something arrives damaged, we ask the owner to take pictures of the damage and then we will discuss the next course of action (to ship back to us and send out a new machine). OR if it is just cosmetic, we offer a gift card for supplies due to their machine being ‘ugly’ but operational.

BUT in this case the item was most likely damaged by the user. Moving forward, any time some one tells you the saddles are damaged via shipping request photos asap.

We also video all of our packing so people can’t claim something is “missing” when there is evidence its not. Its amazing how quickly they find stuff when you tell them, “let me check the tape”.

[Impractical_Horsewoman]

I would at least reach out to them, show them the pre-shipping photos, and the photos of how it looks now, highlighting the damage. Be very professional, and just say, “can you explain how this happened, because this is not a shipping damage.”

My guess is that they oiled the saddle, rode in it, damaged it, and said “woo-hoo, I’m still within the trial period, guess I can send it back, because it’s not worth paying that much to fix.” So many big box websites will take virtually anything back (or even refund the customer and allow them to keep damaged merchandise, because they don’t want to pay the cost of shipping back), I think it’s created a culture where people do that with anything.