Saddles for the Beyond Wide Cob: expanding the budget

Thornhill Berlin fits my Morgan x Welsh Cob. Tried the Duett, and though it fit the pony OK, it didn’t fit me.

Keep in mind as you’re trying saddles that how it fits your horse affects how it will fit you, so try to sit in the saddles you try on something they fit well enough to be level. My pelvic bone pushes down further than my seat bones so a saddle that’s tenting in the front for being narrow will feel like a total crotch buster when it actually isn’t. Just to add one more facet to your complicated enough saddle search!

One more fyi, I just bought a Pessoa XCH and I don’t see why a blacksmith couldn’t “adjust” an XXW gullet plate to match a wither tracing. It might stress the tree a bit to flatten out that much but I’d just never chance the plate again. Mine is an A/O and the leather is fine, it’s wool flocked so it can be fitted as well.

Best at of luck! Your swimming up stream with this.

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If you can find a Native Pony Saddle Company model, they fit very wide ponies/horses well in my experience. Not easy to find however, as they are located in the UK and I don’t think they have a dealer in North America (may be wrong). I see them occasionally over here.

I’ve tried turning a Wintec Wide gullet plate into a pseudo hoop-ish shape and the saddle simply cannot accommodate it (I do blacksmithing as a hobby and somehow ended up with 2 sets of gullets when I bought a Wintec Wide to try out, so could afford the futz around a bit) so I don’t know that a pessoa would be any better :frowning:

I have been trying saddles both on a horse-shaped saddle stand, an Equicizer, and on one of the other therapy horses if the fit is close ish enough to handle a 10 minute test ride. I’m glad I have the Equicizer and the other horses to test thngs with, because saddles that are okay while stationary aren’t always good in movement. And vice versa. Example being the Ideal I just tried. Despite being a bit smaller seated than I usually take (17.5 seems to be the best for me) at 17", on the Equicizer and on another horse it was a really really good fit for me. I was so very bummed it was so horribly narrow on ponybutt :frowning:

I am going to try to attavh pictures of his wither tracings, his shoulders, and his topline in another post below. I have now had fitters tell me that only a Schlesse will work, only a treeless will work (speaking of, I did come across an Ansur Konklusion within my price range, if anyone thinks it would be worth trying), that his back cannot possibly be that shape without being 1000lbs overweight (he has a little extra padding but it starts much lower than a saddle would ever sit on, so it is a moot point. Plus my vet and my coaches all say he looks better than ever in his muscling and that a bit of cushion evenly over his belly is preferable to his former crest/tail/withers/midline fatty deposits and that what extra he has is pretty acceptable for 16 and IR), and that I should never ride him again. So i am about ready to scream. Haha

You might look into a Crosby Sofride. I used to own an XW one that fit my very wide Welsh Cob/TB. It’s an all purpose type saddle but I evented to training level in mine. It was very comfortable and if you actually found one used, it would probably be well within your budget. I believe it was foam flocked though so limited adjustment is possible and I’m not knowledgeable enough to say how it would compare to saddles you’ve already tried. In later years, I rode the same horse in an XW County Stabilizer but it was outside of your budget constraints.

Your challenge is complicated by the curve of his back. Most saddles for really wide horses are quite straight from front to back. The new Black Country native tree or the Harry Dabbs Hunter are still options on the table. Attaching a photo of a similarly shaped horse I fitted last year.

wide.jpg

If I remember correctly there are a few COTH members that have gotten custom saddles from Heritage in the UK. Deltawave is one of them. I don’t think she posts much any more. They have one that is on sale that may work. They say they can widen to a wither tracing. I don’t know if it can be widened enough. Their prices seem reasonable but are still likely higher than your budget.

https://heritagesaddlery.co.uk/product-category/saddles/used-ex-demo-saddles/

SRS has its own saddle fitter. They also use Spirig. Maybe Röö(oo)sli is also an option.

Fascinating. Thanks for the info!

OP, my previous recommendations were under the assumption that the back was also fairly flat from front-to-back. Now that you’ve posted pictures, I highly encourage you to get in direct contact with @no.stirrups; she really does know her stuff and does a great job. The Harry Dabbs I tried from her was not right for me, but I certainly wouldn’t discourage anyone from trying them and/or working with no.stirrups.

In the meantime, start saving some additional pennies, because that back is going to be tough to fit in your current budget, unless you get really, really, REALLY lucky. :frowning:

I ended up with a Vega Jump Special for the horse that was wide but also curvy front-to-back, but that’s not in your stated budget. They go up to +4.5cm (Amerigo/Vega’s XXW - yes, they exist; I’ve tried one stamped from the company as such); I used a +2.5cm on the horse that also fit a wide County (Sensation tree and Stabilizer tree) width-wise (the County saddles were too flat front-to-back). That said, there are some very distinct similarities between Amerigo/Vega and Harry Dabbs, so I would still strongly urge you to consider Dabbs. I really think it’s your best bet.

Good luck! :slight_smile:

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Take a look at the Smith Worthington Mystic on closeout. It’s in your budget and they do an amazing job fitting long distance. Their trees are adjustable, but must be done at the shop in CT.

https://www.smithworthington.com/index.php?p=product&id=157

They are fabulous to work with, so call and share your tracings. They’ll be able to quickly tell you what may/may not work from their saddles.

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I would echo the suggestion that you work with Smith Worthington.

The other possibility would be to look for a Balance saddle used. They’re made by Frank Baines on a hoop tree, and there are GP models as well as Dressage.

I have a Balance dressage saddle and a Smith Worthington cc saddle for my Irish Draught mare.

I emailed smith worthington last night with my tracings and back photos, so fingers crossed for a positive response after the weekend! They sound like they would suit my body better than Schlesse, and even the higher priced models are less tgan the quote Schlesse gave me anyway.

I also sent my tracings/photos back to Ireland with my driving coach for her to pass on to her brother who is a fitter, so we will see if anything comes from that too.

You guys are righr in that the front to back curve of his back is causing as many, if not more, issues as his actual width. I never really stopped to look at it til recently. I’d always been too focused on sheer width of shoulder.

it’s a good thing he’s amazing. Haha!!

Another possibility, if you’re comfortable with it is a treeless. Ansur makes very nice saddles and you can frequently find used ones on your price range. I inherited a dressage model that I’m using to trail ride my TWH because fitting a saddle to her was going to be a nightmare for the same reason. I also expect her to change shape as I actually start working her as well.

I did find an Ansur Konklusion in my price range but nobody (the seller or Ansur themselves) can tell me if the seat size is appropriate for me. It is a 17.5 flatter seat and I am usually happiest in a 17.5 with a flatter seat, but Ansur’s size chart wants me in a 20" based on my waistband size, a 19" based on my weight, a 16" based on my height, and a 17" based on my femur. So I have literally no idea if a 17.5 is okay for me and it’s a final sale.

I’m bumping this up because I thought I had found a solution but just found out that it isn’t going to work out after all.

I had my local Frank Baines rep out to measure my pony and send everything off to the saddle makers in mid July. They were confident that they could build something to fit us, I was happy, everything was good.

Found out today that he is in fact too wide for them to build a saddle for. He is a hair wider than their 8W tree, and they can’t build a jump saddle on that tree anyway. They would have been happy to build a jump saddle from scratch on a fully custom tree if we were in England and they could get their hands on him, but we are in BC so that is obviously not an option

So I am back to square one on the saddle front and am now starting to think that I am not going to be able to find a saddle to fit us at all. If an 8W Frank Baines will be too narrow, I don’t see anything else veing wide enough.

I spoke to Balance and they don’t think their saddles would be safe for me due to my lack of feeling in my left leg, and thus lack of lateral stability. They feel as though the saddle would be prone to rolling like a treeless if I were to weight one stirrup more than the other, and since I cannot feel the left side I cannot feel my evenness reliably.

I’m getting really worried that I’m going to have to face the fact that I’m not going to find anything and that I am going to have to either continue riding in my western pad held on with an elastic surcingle setup I’ve been using for the summer while I was hopefully waiting for my Baines (which clearly isn’t ideal), or that I simply need to accept that I shouldn’t be riding him at all. :frowning:

Treeless?
https://www.synergistsaddles.com/saddles-tree-vs-treeless-saddles/

I’ve been cautioned against treeless for the same reasons as Balance gave me. I am a heavier fellow, and I have extensive nerve damage in my left leg which has left virtually no feeling from the hip down. I cannot feel that leg or seatbone and cannot reliably tell how even I am sitting, so the likelihood of a treeless saddle rolling under me is quite high. At least with my current saddle pad and surcingle setup I don’t have stirrups so am less likely to roll if my weight isn’t perfectly even. :frowning:

Could you post your wither tracings?

I have at least been able to increase my budget to $3000CAD, but again, can stretch a bit for the right saddle.