Safesport in the wake of the Barisone Verdict: Weaponization and Inconsistent Standards

Well, it’s probably better to have safe sport investigate the person who makes a false report on their first time, rather than not pursue it so that the same person has the opportunity to file a false report again and again and again, which would continue to waste safe sport resources each time.

If it stirs up trouble for somebody the first time and there are no consequences for the person who makes the false claim, that would just encourage them to do the same thing the next time they get mad at anyone.

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As I mentioned on a different thread, I have never in my life seen a human drug tested at a USEF horse show. Never. Not once. Horses, yes, many, many, many times. Not one human ever.

I believe they do drug test humans for FEI competitions although I don’t know the frequency of it.

As I recall, the Canadian show jumping team did not get to compete at Tokyo following the drug test results for a rider at one of the qualifying competitions. So it does happen for international competitions.

But national competitions? I have never seen it.

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The safe sport training should only take about half an hour if the person has already taken the longer initial course in the past.

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I lost faith in Safesport/Usef when they didn’t act on a local pro cyber bullying the teenager who bought her horse. The cyber bullying videos are still up on social media, as well as the photos. Said pro was reported by the teenager’s former trainer with screen shots/video recordings taken. Nothing came from it.

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I had to give this some thought over the weekend. I don’t think that Barisone/LK is a safe sport issue. Adults have other avenues to address such problems, it just didn’t work out well for MB because of a lot of factors (read the many threads). Safe Sport needs to focus on kids.

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And you would think that if he’d killed these two, or himself?

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This is frustrating, so people think Safesport should do nothing if you are being harassed in the way LK admits to doing. The police do nothing too.
What is a person supposed to do when confronted with the likes of LK and clan?

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So, the USEF rules are for almost everyone, just not those with deep enough pockets and litigious enough characters to sue or even just threaten to sue.

Note, this is not a comeback at you, @Ghazzu. I think you are sadly more right than not on this one. But, if true, it’s disgusting. Funny that their threat of lawsuits is the bullying that will keep them from being held accountable for bullying.

Ugh, now I’m depressed. How can people like this ever be stopped or even occasionally held accountable?

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According to some people, giving them “respect” would have solved everything…

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Right! I forgot that wonderful advice. Silly me.

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Gotta call their bluff. That’s the only way.

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And then they up the anti and torture you…oh great.

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I know. :persevere:

I just came here to say this. I hope there is a SS investigation here. But I don’t think SafeSport is broken or wrong overall. (And the Kehring article is a terrific explanation of why.)

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You understand that a confluence of lifelong events are what led to Barisone’s mental break, right? That it wasn’t one thing?

The LK situation was one link in a long chain.

He suffers from severe mental health issues, as evidenced by a now not guilty by reason of insanity verdict for shooting his client.

The chain is still, and will always be there for Barisone.

Safe sport should retain their ban.

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I don’t think safe sport needs to be viewed as broken or wrong overall if it’s just recognized as imperfect. It’s a relatively new organization with a huge amount of responsibility that had to start from scratch, only to be overwhelmed by the pent up demand for a place to go with such complaints once there was finally a place to do so.

Let’s say that 95% of safe sport complaints are legitimate, just to invent a number for the sake of argument. Not necessarily provable, not necessarily resulting in suspensions based on available evidence, but legitimate in the sense that they are filed by someone who really thinks they have a solid grievance.

That would still leave 5% of the reports that might be false, whether they are motivated by spite or jealousy or evil plots or what have you. That 5% still represents a pretty big number of false reports, if safe sport is getting thousands and thousands and thousands of complaints.

So that means safe sport needs to have a mechanism in place to handle the false reports, and also to hand out some consequences to the people who purposely file the false reports. Otherwise those same people will just keep filing more false reports whenever they want to stir up trouble for someone.

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That’s the issue I see with this whole case.

MBs ban seemed to be triggered by a criminal proceeding. Which makes sense, and is consistent with how SS has handled other coaches who have serious criminal charges pending against them.

Complaints regarding LKs conduct are challenging… because she specifically was harassing her own coach, and harassing other adult peers. SS is in place to protect minors, and to address reports of abusive conduct when there is an imbalance of power, and an adult is being abused by their coach or employer. So concerns about LKs conduct don’t actually fit into that framework. But… her conduct might be something that code of conduct policies that USEF has for all members could actually address… just not so much a SafeSport issue.

But then… there is the issue of the actual report filed with SafeSport in August of 2019 regarding MHGs children. Multiple details about this became public during the Barisone trial. The DCPP (NJs version of child protective services) caseworker testified she visited the farm on 08/07/19 to do a child welfare check, and interview people, because SafeSport had contacted the local DCPP office after receiving a report. There is nothing inappropriate about that… SafeSport is a mandatory reporter, and should act to ensure immediate welfare of any children they receive reports about. Of course, DCPP should follow their procedures and immediately investigate welfare concerns. So that’s what they both did. And that’s a good thing.

When the DCPP caseworker got to the farm, the very first person they questioned was the custodial parent of the children. Then, they questioned another adult present on the property. Then… the shooting happened. The DCPP caseworker didn’t get the chance to interview anyone else (specifically MB) that day.

Sooooo… after listening to all the information that came out at trial, a lot of people were left with a clear impression that the initiating SafeSport report was made by LK - she’s admitted as much in multiple social media posts. And that report wasn’t just about any issues she had with her own coach (MB)… it actually was also about MHGs children. And whatever was reported to SafeSport kicked off a child welfare investigation. MHG has very clearly stated that her children had a very good relationship with MB, and any statements otherwise were false. Sooooo… the question is, was an intentionally false report concerning MHG’s kid’s welfare filed with SafeSport? And was that report filed as part of a bigger campaign of harassment? That bigger campaign of harassment was detailed in sworn testimony in court during the trial.

This is the crux of the issue. SafeSport code prohibits people from knowingly filing false reports. The same goes for people who do this with other crimes, and file false reports with the police. It’s a crime to file a false police report. It’s a very very rare thing… but sometimes… it happens. So the key question people are wondering about in the wake of this case is… what is the mechanism for SafeSport investigating a potential false reporting issue? Is there a mechanism?

That seems like a fair question.

And again… for the record… the very specific issues involved in this particular situation should not be conflated with situations when someone filed a sincere report about sincere abuse concerns, but there simply isn’t evidence to support initiating a full investigation. That’s a different thing entirely than an instance when someone intentionally and knowingly files a false report, as part of a broader effort to harass someone else.

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Safesport cannot prevent people from committing homicide.

Honestly, people’s hot takes on this are completely weird.

If you commit homicide we don’t blame whatever caused you to commit the criminal act. That’s… not how ANY of this works?!

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The questions that need to be answered are…

  1. Did DCPP complete an investigation? Information thus far implies they did not complete an investigation and have had no involvement with anyone named in the report after the visit and shooting.

  2. If they did complete an investigation, did they share information with SafeSport or was it kept locally? DCPP may refuse to furnish anything they have to SafeSport, without a court order. If SafeSport has no information from DCPP regarding their findings (or lack thereof), they can’t act in any way in regards to LK’s complaint, because they do not have any factual basis for determining if it was a legit complaint or a screw-job perpetrated by a mentally unstable drug addict.

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Not what I said. At. All.

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