Sealed motor fans, UL listing, what does it all mean?

[Simkie]

So we’ve had a few threads about how important it is to use the correct fan in the barn, with an emphasis on a sealed motor. Previous discussions have talked about looking for a UL 507 rated fan.

But some fans are UL 507 rated without a sealed motor, like this one:

https://www.globalindustrial.com/p/hvac/fans/workstation/industrial-floor-fan-18

APPROVALS OR CERTIFICATIONS UL & cUL Listed, OSHA & UL507 Compliant
MOTOR TYPE Open Air Over

Here is an example of a UL 507 rated with a sealed motor:

https://www.globalindustrial.com/p/hvac/fans/workstation/outdoor-rated-workstation-fan-18-diameter-with-yoke-mount-1-3-hp-120v

APPROVALS OR CERTIFICATIONS ETL, cETL Listed, OSHA & UL507 Compliant
MOTOR TYPE Totally Enclosed

The second one is for sure suitable for the barn, but what about the first? Probably no, because of the “open air over” motor, but maybe, with that UL listing?

@clanter you always provide great insight on these topics…any thoughts/feedback?

[Leather]

I’m not an UL507 or electrical/safety standards expert, but I’ve got a general working knowledge of standards/compliance so here’s my take.

All electrical products must meet a safety standard particular to their product type and intended use. UL507 is the Standard for Safety for Electric Fans rated 600 volts or less. There is a whole list of the types of products covered by the standard, including “fans and blowers that circulate air, such as desk, ceiling-suspended, and hassock fans.” Depending on a product’s intended use, different parts of the standard are applied.

So I think that any fan that that falls within the scope of UL507, including your garden variety desk fan, needs to be UL507 compliant. It just depends on what parts it has to meet based on its intended use.

Fans must be tested by a Nationally Recognized Testing Laboratory, and if it passes the requirements it can be listed by that test house and will have that test lab’s “mark” on it. UL Listed means that Underwriters Laboratory tested the fan to the requirements of UL507, ETL Listed means that Electric Testing Laboratories tested it to UL507, (cETL means it can be sold in Canada). (It gets a little confusing because UL both tests and publishes standards - the standard is UL507 because UL published it.)

So UL507 certification applies to both open and closed motor fans.

[Simkie]

@Leather

I’m not an UL507 or electrical/safety standards expert, but I’ve got a general working knowledge of standards/compliance so here’s my take.

All electrical products must meet a safety standard particular to their product type and intended use. UL507 is the Standard for Safety for Electric Fans rated 600 volts or less. There is a whole list of the types of products covered by the standard, including “fans and blowers that circulate air, such as desk, ceiling-suspended, and hassock fans.” Depending on a product’s intended use, different parts of the standard are applied.

So I think that any fan that that falls within the scope of UL507, including your garden variety desk fan, needs to be UL507 compliant. It just depends on what parts it has to meet based on its intended use.

Fans must be tested by a Nationally Recognized Testing Laboratory, and if it passes the requirements it can be listed by that test house and will have that test lab’s “mark” on it. UL Listed means that Underwriters Laboratory tested the fan to the requirements of UL507, ETL Listed means that Electric Testing Laboratories tested it to UL507, (cETL means it can be sold in Canada). (It gets a little confusing because UL both tests and publishes standards - the standard is UL507 because UL published it.)

So UL507 certification applies to both open and closed motor fans.

So UL507 alone is not indicative of an appropriate fan for this use–we still need to look specifically for a sealed motor notation.

Thank you! That was not my understanding from previous posts on this topic

[Leather]

This is purely speculation, but I’d imagine that some may specifically call out UL507 to clarify their certification because there are many different safety standards that are applicable to fans/blowers depending upon their design features (such as voltage) and intended use.

They don’t specifically call out the standard on the less powerful fans, but once you get up into the borderline consumer vs. industrial fans it would matter.

This is a good overview of the various standards based on the use: https://www.pittsburghairsystems.com…%20Control.pdf

I also suspect that this is a giant puzzle of standards/certifications at both the component (motor) and finished product (fan) level. So a motor may have a certification on its own for its basic operating functions/specifications but could be used in a variety of final applications. When that motor gets put into a fan, there are another set of standards/certifications that apply.

For example, I’ve seen “outdoor certified” thrown around for fans that I’m assuming means it has passed some sort of moisture related tests, but it’s hard to know if those are UL507 related tests or some other standard.

You’d need access to the standards or the product’s certification file to get to the nuts and bolts. This is possible, but you need to pay for it. So unless you happen to be in the industry it could be pretty expensive to figure this all out.

Maybe we’ve got some engineers with access to the standards and test house certifications that will figure it out for us.

[clanter]

UL/ETL as noted test to a Standard… there are agreements between UL and CSA (Canadian Standards Association) that they are equal

Both UL/ETL organizations are private testing agencies without a connection to a government. ETL is a test lab only UL creates Standards and tests to those Standards. ETL tests to their interpretation of the UL Standard

(Consumer Protection Agency is a US gov agency and completely separate)

Something needs to interjected which is ratings for electrical devices …NEMA is the National Electrical Manufacturers Association, IP is International Protection (IP) and UL Rating Codes

https://www.anaheimautomation.com/ma…ng%20Codes.pdf

back to box fans… most likely any box fan sold does have either an UL or ETL Label attached (in some states the device must be labeled)… just because it has a testing label does not mean it approved for the finial application. Misapplication of products in consumer hands often occurs

[Simkie]

What got me started down this rabbit hole was looking for a sealed motor fan that can sit on the floor and is outdoor rated–not an easy thing to find, apparently!

(I did find one, eventually–for anyone else that might need such a thing, Air King makes a few sizes.)

But it seems like everyone lists their stuff a little different, and “outdoor” marketing doesn’t always mean “enclosed motor” and (as learned here!) UL listing doesn’t mean it’s the right one, either. So tough to sift through! That global industrial site in the first post sure could make it easier if you could search by motor type but nooooooo they don’t let you do that. Even Tractor Supply doesn’t say “enclosed motor” on the ad for their barn fan…they make you dig around in the product pdf for it. Can’t we all just be up front with this stuff?! :sigh:

Thank you both @Leather and @clanter for your insight!

[Leather]

Funny you should mention the Air Kings @Simkie, that’s actually what I wound up buying for my barn a few years ago. I think I bought the Air Kings because they were the only ones who listed the information I was looking for.

I’d be willing to bet that the same fan is branded/marketed by many companies, but nobody else had the information readily available online.

It would be nice to figure out the OEM and then comparison shop.

[Obsidian_Fire]

Okay folks, this is hubby’s area of expertise, I will let him answer:

Air King would be the OEM, a motor manufacturer does not build complete fans, they only build the motor. So you look for Fan Manufacturer’s not motor manufacturer’s as the OEM. In addition there are three types of enclosures that meet the UL approval, TEAO (Totally Enclosed Air Over), TEFC (Totally Enclosed Fan Cooled) and TENV, (Totally Enclosed Non Ventilated) All three are enclosed but require different types of air flow over the motor to keep it cool. When you enclose a motor you create additional heat, which shortens the life of a motor due to heat build up. So TEAO is good for an OUTDOOR application, but requires a fan to move air directly over the motor. A TEFC is good for an application where this is not a lot of airflow over the motor, so the motor creates its own airflow with an additional fan on the motor, also good for DUSTY and WET environments, TENV is good for no airflow, dust, dirt and moisture, however this motor is MUCH larger in size for comparable HP because it uses the shell size (surface area) to dissipate heat. I personally would try to find a TEFC motor depending on size of the fan.

Does that help? If more questions, I’ll ask him again.

[Simkie]

That is fabulous info, @Obsidian Fire thank you!!

Now if only it was easier to FIND what sort of motor is in each fan

[Leather]

Thanks for that info on the motors @Obsidian Fire - I had figured there were ratings for the motors themselves but as @Simkie said it’s just about impossible to find that information. I wonder if you contacted the fan companies directly if they would disclose that information or not.

Also I should have been more specific about what I meant by OEM - I had meant whomever makes them for Air King as I hadn’t looked them up to see if they do their own assembly/manufacturing or not. Absolutely they buy the motors and parts from other manufacturers.

Air King is a Lasko company, who looks to hold the ETL listing. Per an Air King product catalog I found they say they have 4 North America manufacturing facilities. My fan says “Assembled in USA” so that does line up with them actually assembling them themselves using sourced parts.

[goodhors]

Thanks for the information.

[Horse_Rider]

Any advice on how to hang these fans? I can’t put them on the wall or ceiling (not my barn to put holes into and there’s more metal than wood in the stall fronts/ceiling). Are they easy to bungee to the stall front like a box fan or do I need to get some accessories to make this work?

[Simkie]

@Horse Rider

Any advice on how to hang these fans? I can’t put them on the wall or ceiling (not my barn to put holes into and there’s more metal than wood in the stall fronts/ceiling). Are they easy to bungee to the stall front like a box fan or do I need to get some accessories to make this work?

They’re made to be mounted to the wall (sometimes ceiling) with an included mounting bracket, but you could certainly remove the bracket and bungee somewhere. Just make sure you have good airflow.

[Jackie_amp_Starlette]

Just fyi…I bought these last year and love them. Horses are enjoying right now with our 90 degree Michigan weather!