Self-combusting hay?

[cnvh]

I saw something scary at the barn today… Manure spreader (which is parked basically inside the barn) was full of the usual shavings, poop, old hay, etc., and it was actually smouldering, with smoke coming off it. It wasn’t steam-- it was warm here today-- it was actually smoke (I’m pretty sure, anyway), and had a very different smell. I spread it around some with a pitchfork to try to cool it off; holding my hand 12" over it felt like holding one’s hand over a campfire. :eek:

I know enough to know that barns burn down all the time from wet hay catching on fire, so this seemed like a Very Big Deal to me… Mentioned it to another boarder who didn’t seem to be as concerned; she said it’s pretty common for the thing to be smoking.

The manure spreader gets hauled out and dumped about every day, day-and-a-half. How long does it take for wet hay to actually COMBUST???

[BaroquePony]

It probably was composting and I think that can get hot enough to smolder … I don’t know if it will break into flames, but I sure wouldn’t want that near my barn. I have seen smoldering manure piles near a barn … don’t know how well that goes.

I keep my compost piles away from the barn, and check them for heat every now and then.

[BaroquePony]

duplicate …

[kdow]

Even if it is normal, why would you leave something that is even considering catching on fire IN A BARN?

[cnvh]

The barn manager was alerted and it was removed. I was just surprised to see it getting so hot in what seemed like not a lot of time-- like I said, the spreader is usually dumped every day, two at the absolute most.

[clanter]

local hunter barn’s compost pile burst in flames… with the help of a bulldozer it took three days to extinguish

[HungarianHippo]

If it’s spread every day or two, that does not seem like enough time for manure to build heat high enough to burst into flames. And that it’s in the spreader says that it’s an inherently small quantity, which also reduces the risk that temps could get hot enough to combust. But regardless if it was truly smoking and as hot as you say, you were right to be alarmed.

Be careful about moving it around with the pitchfork–which introduces oxygen into a very combustible situation (that pile “wants” to be a fire if only it could get enough oxygen to do so). If the pile is truly about to combust, it’s about the worst thing you can do.

First priority is to get the spreader away from the barn (or if a manure pile, get a tractor to push the pile away from the barn). If I couldn’t get it moved quickly, I’d probably get a hose running on it to thoroughly soak until the tractor arrived.

But, on the other hand, the BO will not appreciate boarders dousing the spreader when it wasn’t really needed. (Kinda like when passers by call the authorities because they see your horse sleeping and think it’s dead–good intentions, but, :rolleyes: ). I’d suggest the BO get a composting temperature probe, and define what internal temps are in the safe zone, what needs action.

[goodhors]

Guess with temps like they are now, barn should plan to empty the spreader RIGHT AFTER cleaning stalls. Gives the piled manure in spreader NO CHANCE to start the composting process. Also lets the spreader floor dry out better without manure inside.

I do think you were correct, to get attention focused on the heated load in the spreader, take it out and dump before heat built up. Composting piles do get VERY HOT quickly, which is why the process is successful in killing seeds, “cleaning” the things in the pile for use when fully done composting.

Combination of factors that can make stall manure and bedding get hot faster than expected. Obviously things were “right” that day. This is the Barn Manager’s WAKE_UP NOTICE, things need to be changed slightly, with immediate disposal of the manure when stalls are done. Nothing bad happened THIS TIME, got caught before possible combustion. Ways of doing things need changing NOW, while it is fresh in her mind, your mind.

Kind of like when the Cop pulls you over, gives you a warning INSTEAD of a ticket. That is your notice of CHANGE NEEDED in your driving. Leave earlier, allow more time, so you are not ALWAYS going “just a few” miles over posted limit. With no change, you WILL end up getting that ticket. He saw you once, gave you another chance, will be LOOKING for you in the future.

As mentioned, burning manure piles happen, HARD to get put out, often burn for several days!! This is why you NEVER keep the manure pile close to a structure.
We had that happen here, was quite shocking and scary! Didn’t need the fire department, but it was a HOT fire, didn’t go out until the whole pile was burned up. I never make manure piles now, stalls are cleaned and bedding spread DAILY. Wouldn’t have a manure pile unless the spreader was getting fixed, then manure would be scooped up and spread as quick as possible after repairs. Pile would be located WAY OUT in the paddock, no place close to the barns.

Talk to BO about getting spreader dumped daily, quickly after cleaning. Sounds like they have developed the PERFECT combination of wet bedding to let it heat for spontaneous combustion. You don’t want it happening in the barn, or in spreader with fuel filled tractor NEAR the barn. We have had to change some of our “ways of doing things, order of doing things” when an ALMOST incident showed us the way things could have gone badly!! Our warning notice with the fire, so we CHANGED how we do things!!

[cnvh]

Yeah, I didn’t learn until researching this last night (after the fact) that aerating it via spreading it around with a pitchfork was NOT a good idea. Seemed to make logical sense at the time, but now I know better!

[Alagirl]

[QUOTE=cnvh;7728501]
Yeah, I didn’t learn until researching this last night (after the fact) that aerating it via spreading it around with a pitchfork was NOT a good idea. Seemed to make logical sense at the time, but now I know better![/QUOTE]
well, yes and no. by spreading you disrupt the process temporarily, that cools it off some in the now.

of course then the added oxygen fires the process up again.

[cowboymom]

A neighbor just lost hundreds of tons of hay-he put it up too wet and it’s been smoldering in there for weeks. They pulled part of it apart with bulldozers but left most of it together b/c the wind made it a fire hazard for it to do anything but smolder while they poured water on it. The head of the fire volunteers told me it will smolder for weeks.

I would carefully pull apart a small smolder, like you had, but only after wetting it down. A big one definitely calls for back up b/c they can be a literal bomb, just waiting for the oxygen to take off.

[ChocoMare]

I remember Belmont losing several shedrows and horses to spontaneous combustion many moons ago It happens.

[spotted_draft_x_fill]

I’m waiting to hear on the news about a large smelly bonfire in Paris. The last trainer I worked for wanted all the muck in large piles at the bottom of the hill, where it couldn’t be seen. Numerous times multiple piles were smoking. We warned the manager that those piles might catch fire, but the owner didn’t want to spread the muck out due to making his paddocks look ugly and unkempt.

[Alagirl]

[QUOTE=ChocoMare;7729646]
I remember Belmont losing several shedrows and horses to spontaneous combustion many moons ago It happens.[/QUOTE]
Once upon a time the hay loft at the family farm caught fire (long before my time)
My Grandpa rebuild after, with a ventilation system to cool and aerate the hay.
It is a real hazard. I think people underestimate how quickly that process can start. I had a sack of corn husks one time, within a few hours from pulling it off the fresh ears the material was very hot to the touch! Good for my compost pile, but for a hay shed…