Selling pony

[Pocketpony]

This is getting complicated. PO told me that pony is mine until sold (at which point PO will get sale money) and that I need to find the best option for him until the time that he does sell. PO does not have a farm and nowhere for me to return him to. There is no contract. Just payment arrangement by text for purchase of pony by myself. No money has been paid to PO yet as per terms.

PO cannot afford pony board anymore after making life changes. Still believes that I have purchased pony even though he is legally theirs, registered to their name and no bill of sale to me since no money has been paid.

I have the pony’s best interest at heart but this is getting crazy!

[ladyj79]

Dear PO, I gave you my 30 days notice to end the lease on mmddy, and those 30 days end on mmddy, after which i have no further financial obligations to you or the pony.

[IPEsq]

Depending on the lien laws where you are, sounds like trainer might be getting a free lesson pony after all pretty soon…

[retiredhorse]

Sounds like more of the same…

If PO can’t take back the pony and can’t afford pony anymore, seems like the easiest thing to do would be to sign pony over to you for free (so you can sell/give away pony free and clear, not that I’d want the pony at this point), or to a trainer willing to take on the pony and (re)train & sell or use her as a lesson pony.

PO wants the reward (sale money) with none of the risk (paying for pony until she sells), and that’s just unrealistic and unreasonable. At this point, even if you find a good trainer and have a decent agreement/training & sales contract with them, the issue is still going to be between you and PO. Who’s to say she won’t change your (spoken/unwritten) terms again? Or hold out for a high, unattainable sales price?

If you’ve given notice and PO doesn’t pay board, then BO can put lien on pony? And then pony is their problem. Unfortunate for BO, though.

If PO is using you as an agent of sorts to get pony sold… I’d say get a contract in place for that too. I’ve seen “free leases” where the leasee is paying bills on the horse, until horse is sold, and sales price goes to owner… but everyone is in agreement on this and generally the rider/leasee is getting something out of it, like a nicer horse than they could usually afford, even if it’s for a non-specified time period because horse is for sale during lease. Doesn’t sound like the case here!

[ReRustica]

Pony owner is delusional unless you signed a yearlong lease or something, and aren’t completing it. Doesn’t sound like that is the case. They don’t get to have you pay the upkeep on the pony indefinitely, and then keep the proceeds themselves from a sale. 30 days from now, this becomes an issue between pony owner and your BO, and you are no longer involved. If they keep insisting “pony belongs to you now,” they must sign over ownership now and you keep the sale $$. Something tells me they aren’t going to go for that. Stand firm.

[Pocketpony]

Is there anyone active on Coth who can give unofficial legal advice?

[4LeafCloverFarm]

I am so sorry @Pocketpony that you’re having to deal with this. What a mess. Please don’t let this “friend” of yours continue to try to force you to pay the ponies bills. Give a written 30 day notice, sent certified mail with signature required to the PO. Take a copy of your signed notice with the signature proof of delivery to the BO. In 30 days, it won’t be your problem anymore.

[HungarianHippo]

No real attorney will ever give legal advice over an internet forum. Any “unofficial legal advice” you get from non-lawyers should be considered completely invalid and following it puts you at greater legal risk.

You clearly have a real legal issue, so get a consult with a local attorney ASAP. Print out any / all written communications you have with the PO, and write down a timeline of everything you can remember that you’ve discussed with her, with approx dates. Do not try to present facts to the attorney in a way that makes you look good – they can only help you if they understand the full risk you face.

ETA: with attorneys, time literally is money, so make sure you are well organized and have the information in a clear and efficient format before you have your meeting.

[Pocketpony]

I’m am sick to my stomach about this. Some more detail in case anyone has other opinions to offer. Earlier this year we agreed to buy pony on a lease to own basis and to pay the purchase price within 12 months. We moved pony to boarding barn. Within the first 2 months we started seeing problems but thought we would give it time since he was good 90% of the time. Each time we worked through whatever issue there was and he was fine again for a while. Kept PO informed of issues whole time but said we would keep trying to work through the problems. 6 Months into the lease-to-own something really scary happened and that is when I told the PO to take him back. At that point the PO said he is ours but that they will help sell him in order to get the paid.

PO is telling me that he is mine even though we have not paid anything yet and that I need to pay for his care until he sells. At the time he sells the PO will get all the money.

My SO thinks we owe the PO for the 6 months that we leased pony even though we have paid all the bills. There is no contract only verbal and text message communication. PO wants me to find a suitable board situation since I already gave notice at current facility.

[IPEsq]

Your SO may be right depending on what the terms of the lease-to-own you verbally agreed to. But generally, in a lease-to-own, you don’t own until all the terms are met at the end of whatever period. It’s hard to tell what the terms actually are here, and you shouldn’t be more specific–save that for your attorney.

Because you are dealing with contract law and possibly lien issues, you should really consult with an attorney in your state.

[ReRustica]

It’s definitely time to consult a lawyer (in person), even if only to have them draw up a response letter to pony owner. This may only cost you a couple hundred dollars. Well worth it. Gather your texts and emails and draw up a timeline. A “free lease to own” seems like an odd situation - typically I have heard of payments being applied to purchase price - but I’ve never heard of a situation where the pony’s ownership changed before the payments were completed, regardless of the monthly payment situation. And if the ownership did change, you’d be entitled to the sale money. In no case would you be in the situation you are in now, unless you specifically signed an agreement to this effect. And you didn’t.

PO’s “life changes” may be challenging, but they aren’t your challenge to solve. It’s not fair to pawn off their inability to care for the pony right now on you.

[vxf111]

@IPEsq

Because you are dealing with contract law and possibly lien issues, you should really consult with an attorney in your state.

This.

[trubandloki]

Jingling for you Pocketpony!
This sounds miserable.

Curious…does PO insist on a certain price for the pony?

[Mango20]

IF you were to go along with the PO’s point of view, it would seem that she should only get the previously agreed upon price for the pony, and if the pony sells for more than that, the extra should go to you.

Personally, I disagree that this is the way it should work, if you were leasing the pony. However, it seems that she thinks you bought the pony, but had a 12 month payment plan. If you can’t get out of this, I think it would be way easier to just pay the PO what you agreed to pay for the pony, then work out how to sell him on your own and with no further input from the former PO.

[trubandloki]

@Mango20

Personally, I disagree that this is the way it should work, if you were leasing the pony. However, it seems that she thinks you bought the pony, but had a 12 month payment plan. If you can’t get out of this, I think it would be way easier to just pay the PO what you agreed to pay for the pony, then work out how to sell him on your own and with no further input from the former PO.

The way I understand it, the agreed on price is more than the OP thinks that the pony can sell for with the issues it is having that were not disclosed up front.

[findeight]

@Pocketpony

After gaining courage here from you folks, I had a chat with owner. They are on board and told me to give 30 days notice to end board. They are coming with a trainer to assess the pony, etc.

Do you have any kind of proof she told you to just give them 30 days 2 weeks ago? Have you given them that 30 days notice? How about the BO?

Asking this not for me but for you to gather up to take to a lawyer. It’s time. That doesn’t mean you will end up dragging her to court or she’s sending her legal team after you, just you need a lawyer to advise you on your rights and how to deal with this situation.

You say it’s a verbal lease agreement but then so is her more recent agreement to let you out with 30 days notice since rescinded. You need some help here and an initial consult isn’t that costly if it costs anything at all. Just bring everything you have including texts.

Old saying, if you don’t know a crazy horse person, it’s you. I think you found your crazy person.