Senior Fecal Water Troubles

[MNDressage]

Apologies ahead for the long post. I have a 26 year old gelding that is struggling with FFWS or something similar. Historically he has had a sensitive stomach and predictably gets loose poop for a couple days when hay changes or there are stressors like a new horse moving into his pasture.

Had some issues with fecal water over the summer as clover popped up strong. He has a history of finding things to eat in the pasture that don’t agree with his stomach. At a previous boarding facility every fall he would eat acorns that fell into his pasture and get terrible diarrhea. The last 2 years that I’ve been at this boarding facility I haven’t had any trouble with him eating weird things in the fall and there is not much for him to pick at in his pasture now so I don’t think that is likely the problem this time.

About two weeks ahead of the vet visit a 1st cut round bale was put out and he was able to slowly start to nibble at it but mostly searching for grass still. I can’t remember what day his herd was closed off from most of their pasture but I believe it was shortly after the vet was here. They still had some grass in their dry lot/paddock area but nowhere near as much.

10/7/2024 - fall vet visit, blood drawn for CBC, Lyme, and ACTH testing done, began Firocoxib (generic Equioxx)

10/21/2024 - Prascend arrived and began to get him to half a tab per day for a while and reassess given his symptoms and levels were only slightly above the allowed seasonal rise, he had the tiniest bit of fecal water but figured it was from grass running out and the change to eating more hay

10/26/2024 - last day giving Firocoxib, fecal water became terrible over the last week, trial without to see if it improves, poop has been normal but liquid before and after pooping

10/29/2024 - finished the first round bale and had a 2nd cut round bale go out, a bit of loose poop for 2 days after the new bale went out which is typical for him as bales are switched

11/5/2024 - started ProElite GutBiome supplement, the hay switch or stopping of Firocoxib has left his butt a bit less crusty but there are still streaks down his leg and liquid along with his well formed poop

11/10/2024 - adding 1 tsp salt to his feed

He’s at a boarding facility so I don’t have control over hay but the barn owners were very willing to try the other cutting of round bales from a different supplier that they have to see if that would make a difference. This change seemed promising but only a slight decrease in amount of liquid down his backside.

Current diet:

24/7 access to grass round bale in pasture, don’t know what type of grass.

AM: 1.1 lbs Triple Crown Senior Gold, 0.5 lb Triple Crown Balancer, SmartComfort

PM: 0.5 lbs Triple Crown Senior Gold, 0.5 lb Triple Crown Balancer, 1.5 lbs alfalfa pellets, ProElite GutBiome, and 1 tsp salt wet with approx. 4 cups water

I’d like to put him back on the Firocoxib because I noticed a big difference in his comfort, especially with the cooler weather, but am nervous about doing that until he’s better and I can test whether the Firocoxib makes it much worse or not. Hoping I won’t have to put the poor guy through standing outside to get his butt hosed off with cold water when it’s way below freezing.

I’ve got a message in to his vet but in the meantime I’m hoping to get some ideas for what to try next or opinions on the most likely culprit for his FFWS issues?

[EmilyM]

My horse w FWS has done the best this year on 3rd cutting grass hay. Anything coarse makes him start the FW.

He also gets biosponge daily. He’s down to one cup in the morning. He also gets assureguard gold and platinum balance probiotics. He gets sucralfate 2x a day 30 mins prior to eating his ration balancer. He had no response to misoprostal so I’m not convinced he needs the sucralfate.

For my particular horse, the texture of the hay is the biggest driver of his FWS. I hope that helps.

[RedHorses]

My horse’s excess fecal water was caused by small strongyles burrowing in and out of his gut wall. When was your last fecal count done?

[walktrot]

HorseTech.com has a supplement that solved my 28 y.o. Paint gelding’s fecal water problem. There is not much information on the causes of FWS so thre is not much out there to treat the problem. I think it is basiclly irritation of some sort to the lining of the colon.

HorseTech has a product called WaterWerks that is specficially designed for treating FWA and leaky gut. We were in on the creation of WaterWerks after using GutWerks which helped quite a bit. HorseTech consulted with quite a few clients as part of the development process.

My gelding was soaked from his butt cheeks, down his hind legs. It ran into his inner thighs also. I needed to scrub him daily. Once I got it under control I gave him a 1/2 portion daily and he never showed any signs after that.

WaterWerks

[Foxglove]

It’s been awhile, but like @EmilyM I had luck with BioSponge. My old fellow, nearly 30, had symptoms every fall, though winter, until spring grass came in. I did a weekly “booty wash” involving warm water, Dawn dish soap, drying with hair dryer, then liberal application of diaper rash cream. I kept his tail braided at the bottom and a leg-wrap on the top, dock to braid. This made things easier, although in an unheated barn, doing a booty wash in -3 degrees even when inside was hard at times (for me, horse was good with it as long as water was warm).

As I did the booty wash, I would recall --sometimes aloud --some of his greatest accomplishments. He’d carried my youngest daughter into over 100 3-Day horse trails, probably more than 1000 fences and never once refused and she never fell off him I always told him if he did that, when he could live with me forever after he retired. He was with me for almost 10 years before he moved to a greener pasture where horses have wings and flies don’t.

[MNDressage]

@EmilyM thanks for the info on what worked for your horse! As he gets older I wouldn’t be surprised if the hay is a main contributor to his GI troubles

@RedHorses the last fecal count was done in March and has been done every spring for a while now. He’s had lower egg counts and been classified as a low shedder so I’ve dewormed spring and fall. I last dewormed with Zimecterin Gold on October 13th which I missed adding to the summary above.

@walktrot I’ll take a look at WaterWerks. Happy to hear it worked so well for your horse!

[MNDressage]

Thanks for the tips on cleaning them up in the winter and how to minimize the area to clean. Reminding myself how amazing of a horse he is does help immensely when doing the not so glamorous things like washing his butt

[fordtraktor]

How are his teeth? My senior pony was having a FW issue and it was just a lack of grinding her hay. She doesn’t have much in the way of teeth any more (she’s 31) so I had to put her on Senior feed and hay chaff. In the summer she does fine on grass, but hay is too much and the fiber irritated her colon not chewed thoroughly. She’s fat and happy and has normal poop on her special diet.

[MNDressage]

He saw the dentist in August and I was told he still has fairly good grinding surface given his age. He has all molars except a pre-molar that was loose and popped out easily when he had incisors extracted in January due to EOTRH. Weight has been excellent since his incisors were removed. No signs of quidding or trouble eating hay yet from what I can tell but it’s possible he can’t break it down as much as he needs.

[RegentLion]

My FW old man needed to be on a soft hay and have his teeth meticulously managed every 6 months. Once the vet didn’t get it quite right and had to re-do them. The FW came back instantly.

The other thing that helped was to have him eat soaked Timothy pellets for one meal a day.

Now he’s on a pellet only diet (due to some chokes and then a founder)… and no FW

No supplements worked for us, including bio sponge. We had to discern for him the issue was related to the coarseness of the hay he was eating.

[Pico_Banana]

My 13 y.o. mare gets FWS when the grass dies and she moves to an all hay diet. I can get hers to resolve by adding in 1/4 cup of pure psyllium powder with breakfast and dinner. Last winter that didn’t seem to resolve it 100% so I then added in Mad Barn’s Visceral. That did the trick.

She is on second cut hay.

[BayBondGirl]

I tried a lot of things for my horse’s FFWS and the only thing that cleared it up was beet pulp! If that helps any.

I tried varying hays, supplements, feed adjustments. Discovered the BP solution entirely by accident when we moved to a barn that fed it to everyone.

[SusanO]

My older pony with decreased grinding surface on his molars is starting to have problems with this. I have really fine hay that I am giving him, as fine as I can buy, but it still bothers him somewhat. Now that the weather is cooler I may add in some soaked hay cubes. I am not sure he will eat beet pulp. He hates soaked hay but he likes the cubes if they have alfalfa in them. I wish I could buy a small bag of BP to test him because the other two horses are not wild about it either, including the equine garbage can.

[NaturallyHappy]

I have TC Timothy Natural Balance cubes. Mine doesn’t like beet pulp and apparently doesn’t like alfalfa cubes.

[SusanO]

I will check out TSC to see what they have. If I add in alfalfa pellets he may eat it. He is a long way from starving.

[RhythmNCruise]

I’ll echo those saying stemmy hay can be a culprit for sure. My heart horse developed FWS later in life and I think it had to do with him frequently being on NSAIDs and antibiotics throughout his life (especially when hospitalized for nearly two months for a severed extensor tendon). He was never formally diagnosed, but he also had some pretty clear signs of metabolic issues/Cushings. He started out only having the FWS issue when on stemmier hay. Softer, finer hay was no problem and it always cleared up when he was back on pasture. Eventually he couldn’t eat any baled hay at all without having problems. He also was a voracious water drinker and hay dunker (which I think now was probably due to metabolic stuff). He drank a LOT. What finally cured him of the FWS was pulling him off of all baled hay and only giving him soaked hay cubes. This suited his older “brother” as well, who was starting to have trouble chewing hay. Their little “brother” had no issues with hay, but they all ate together so he got soaked hay cubes too. Those were some expensive years feeding the horses! Labor-intensive too! But it cleared the FWS in my one horse and kept weight on the other oldie.

The FWS gelding started losing condition the longer it progressed (years). I know now that was due to his metabolic issues (common sign). He also started shedding his entire coat out (like raking handfuls down to the skin) in February while it was snowing. I knew then something was amiss. I got him relatively healthy though with the hay cubes and I fed him Renew Gold Senior which really seemed to help his condition. He was never on medication, always allowed to go out and graze to his content, and when he broke his leg on Labor Day in 2019, he was gorgeous and otherwise healthy. Ge crossed the rainbow bridge with a clean bootie at least.

A friend of mine is dealing with FWS with her mare now and is so frustrated. I’ve suggested that the hay she’s eating could be the culprit. She’s IR/Cushings and lives in a dry lot 24/7 so she’s fed hay in a slow-feed hay net three times a day along with some TC Safe Starch packaged forage and her soaked alfalfa pellets with supplements. She’s on Prascened as well, I believe. She has a history of ulcers, so her owner is understandably hesitant to remove long-stemmed hay from the mare since she has nothing else to graze on. She buys her tested hay that is very low sugar but also tends to be more stemmy as well. It’s very good quality hay, the provider also provides for NCSU vet school. But I’m a believer that with these FWS horses, it’s the texture that is the issue.

Anyway, that’s my experience. I tried BioSponge and a few other things with my gelding and it didn’t really do much until I eliminated the baled hay completely. Not an ideal situation, but it stopped the FWS.

[Pico_Banana]

For those horses who don’t like beet pulp, have you tried speedi beet? All of my horses love it with just a handful of something (usually TC Senior) added in for some flavor. As for cubes, none of mine love straight alfalfa cubes but they all love the Timothy/alfalfa mixed cubes. So it’s worth experimenting.

[SusanO]

I have found that the straight alfalfa cubes do not soak as soft as the alfalfa/grass hay cubes. I think the strictly alfalfa ones have more leaf which compresses more densely and thus does not soak up water as well. I have had two horses have a fractured tooth when feeding alfalfa cubes. This may have just been a coincidence, but I try to just feed cubes that soak up soft these days.

[MNDressage]

The longer this goes on the more likely it seems that the hay is the problem… I’m going to start to incorporate beet pulp and some more hay pellets (or possibly cubes). I’m not able to take away access to the round bale due to the setup at the barn I board at but hopefully more calories not from the hay bale will help.

Any suggestions for how much beet pulp or hay pellets/cubes to try to feed if restricted to two feedings per day? The barn will feeds once a day in the morning in a feed bag/nose bag whatever is prepped and set out for them to grab. I feed in the evening.

[RedHorses]

You might try a different brand if you want to feed alfalfa. My senior is particular about his alfalfa cubes, and there are a couple of brands he will not eat, a couple he loves, and several he eats and leaves the rest once the cubes have been reduced to chaff.

In eastern Ontario Dehy is a no (smaller particles compressed very hard), while Huron and Pestell are preferred choices. Both of those are easily broken apart by hand and soak nicely.