Separating horses: recommended strategies?

[endlessclimb]

I’d just start in his stall. It’s already a place of quiet and comfort, so it’s a great place to begin. Tie him, ride/work/groom the other one, come back, switch them. Tying is such a valuable and underrated tool. I think a lot of people have somehow contorted it in their brain that it’s cruel, when it absolutely is not.

I tie everything for at least 15-20 minutes after we get back from a ride. I call it their thinking time. It teaches them not to be in such a hurry to be done with the work, because they aren’t going to immediately get to cavort around with their buddies. We untack, hose off/cool off, and tie while I do a few chores.

Heck, think of the western barns. All the colts get saddled in the morning and stand tied at the rail until it’s their turn, and stand there until everyone is done.

[pompeiii]

I’m sure this is just a lesson he needs to re-learn. I suspect he was tied in his stall on the track quite a bit so it may come back to him very fast. I’ll start with the stall and then move elsewhere once that lesson seems to have stuck.

Off to fine a blocker tie ring… that’s something I don’t actually own. Lol

[endlessclimb]

If you have a crappy snaffle bit that you don’t mind murdering, it will do the same thing.

[pluvinel]

@pompeiii

I suspect he was tied in his stall on the track quite a bit so it may come back to him very fast.

I second everything @endlessclimb stated. A race barn I visited had everyone single-tied during the morning workouts. The best stallion handler I know had a barnful of stallions that were cross-tied in the stall for 1-2 hours at lunchtime.

[pompeiii]

Thanks to you both. I’ll have a blocker ring here tomorrow (actually 2 because I might as well make sure both boys are successful, right?) and will start this process this weekend. Nay Nay (the criminal) is super reliable tying (he also can step on his lead rope and just lift his feet one at a time until he releases the pressure if he happens to step on it while grazing with zero panic–for all the things that bother him, that is not one). He more or less lived at the track during his race career so I suspect his trainer did tie him. That definitely will help if that’s the case. I’m actually looking forward to doing this. I’ll get to play with both boys (at home for now) while they each get stall time.

I’ll update on our progress.

[pompeiii]

Nay Nay is tied now in his stall using a rope halter and the blocker ring. He is screaming some (and I’m sure it’ll get worse), but I’m keeping my distance and just listening to him try and have a meltdown) and occasionally kicking the stall (please don’t destroy my barn) but I’m pretty sure he’s waiting for someone to rescue him? The kicking is really annoying though it’s not constant. It’s sort of a response to no one responding?

I’m sitting behind a tree out of sight but if I shift over, most of the time he’s just standing with some moving side to side. Then screaming after being quiet for a couple of minutes. Cairo is truly helping by completely ignoring his calls.

ETA:

You know who hasn’t ignored his screams? My neighbors. They called, concerned, because of all the screaming. Right now it’s ok but ugh. Thanks buddy.

[skydy]

Does he have hay? Is he ignoring it?

[pompeiii]

Yes, he has plenty of hay, completely ignored it all.

He just works himself up to this point of no return. He starts off ok-ish and then it…escalates? He ends up drenched it sweat and completely worked up just from bouncing in place. I wouldn’t call it weaving or even pacing, just a nervous bounce?

[skydy]

At least he’s not struggling with the tie. How long does he last before he gets hysterical?

[libgrrl]

I have one of those. He was uncut until he was 9 (also on the track until 9) and I can take him anywhere and he settles in beautifully. If his neighbor goes away? Postal. He’s 30 now, and he’ll still scream/stallion bellow all night. I board, so he does have a “herd.” At his age, I just won’t ever “stall rest” him again. Similar to yours, he gets stressed to the point that he goes off his food when “left” – and he is a big eater. Can you maybe get him a goat or something and turn him out?

[endlessclimb]

I wouldn’t wait until he goes postal.

Let him get a little worked up, then bring the other horse back and let him settle. Rinse repeat. Each time it should reinforce “you’re not actually alone”.

Also, try and make him a titch hungry, or tired, or both before you try again.

[libgrrl]

I wish I felt that would work for mine, but he instantly surveys his situation (as it has been for close to 20 years) and if it isn’t to his liking, he begins to bellow. That said, he has become accustomed to his preferred scenario, and there is no changing him at this point. Hopefully OP can turn this around before it becomes ingrained. If I could do things over again, I would have kept changing things up, because his “track self” adapted to change so well (but I’m sure that didn’t help gut health.)

[endlessclimb]

For sure some just don’t have the mental make up to handle it.

OP I’d consider hanging old feed bags on the wall he’s kicking. That crunch sound is generally startling enough they will quit that particular protest. If that doesn’t work, I’d put chains or anklets on him. Kicking because you’re pissed is a no.

[pompeiii]

I can try most of this (tired, not hungry as I free choice hay outside). I’ll definitely play around with it.

[pompeiii]

I think I’m going to have to take it back a step. My boy was super stressed in his stall overnight and he wasn’t alone. He more or less went from unhappy to melting down yesterday. Last night? He wasn’t alone. When I turned him out he didn’t even see his buddy so I’m now not 100% sure it’s being alone…

I’m going to change course and work him in the round pen (just a bit) then leave him for 10-20 min and see how that goes. If it goes well, I’ll just increase.

[pompeiii]

We’re about 7 minutes in on today’s experiment. Did some work in hand (he’s not entirely unsound so that’s good?) then I left in in the round pen. While he’s not thrilled (he’s not and that’s ok), my goal is to let him spend some time alone before he melts down.

He’s mostly pacing around, some trotting, some grazing. He just called once (9 min mark). But he’s not galloping. Or rearing. Or screaming enough that the neighbors are calling to check on us. Most of his exertion is at the walk and even now he is still thinking about grazing.

I am within his sight line but I’m mostly ignoring him. I don’t trust the fencing (it was never intending to be used as turn out) but this horse is the most trustworthy of any horse with fencing. I do have some welded wire that I can use if this ends up being our solution.

15 min update. Still only one scream. Still pacing, not a lot of grazing (a sniff and bite here and there) but 1000% more successful than the other 2 attempts.

Final comment. We made it to 20 minutes with 1 scream only. Calling it a day here. Good boy Nay Nay!

[Feliz]

I had just two, a mare and a gelding, on the property for over a year and they live in the same paddock.

My approach has been to always keep them under threshold. I guess some will eventually settle after getting worked up but my experience is they just got more anxious about everything.

I leave them in the paddock with alfalfa hay (they only ever get it for this) and started really small, going further away or out of sight once they were ok. If they start getting wound up I’ll just go back closer until they are ok again. On the odd occasion I’ve messed this up they become blithering idiots and the mare has run herself into a lather once.

Now I can ride out of sight or take them off the property for a full day and the other one is fine, maybe the odd neigh, but no running or pacing. I do load in the trailer out of sight. If I’ve been away for a bit, so they haven’t been separated for a week or two, I just start small again and within a few days it’s back to business as usual.

I do think it depends a lot of the horses and property set up. I have some small paddocks that they become ridiculously clingy in (who knows why! horses ) and I have the luxury of not having to use those paddocks.

Good luck

[pompeiii]

I think you’re definitely on to something. Once he’s worked up, there is no salvaging anything. So keeping him below his threshold is important. Everyone was fine in their stalls this morning so Saturday had no long lasting effects (other than a mangled bucket holder) for which I am grateful!

Before I turned him back out yesterday I did a few walk half transitions and a couple of backs and he was fine. Then he walked like a gentleman back to his paddock (we did graze for a few minutes because the best grass is in my yard). That alone showed how calm he was. He did call a little bit once he saw me approach him but I suspect that wasn’t out of anxiety but out of “let me out now” which is why I did the extra mini lesson.

I’m going to try to do a short session today (much shorter than yesterday) as we’re expecting rain AND I have to work. I’ll pick up a bale of western alfalfa soon for this purpose too.

[Libby2563]

I’ve found that this Warwick Schiller focus work is amazing for separation anxiety: https://horseandrider.com/horse-health-care/warwick-schiller-horse-with-separation-anxiety/. I have three horses at home and only one of them naturally doesn’t get worked up being left alone. I spent time with the other two doing this exercise, and the results are fast and dramatic. They sometimes need touch-ups but it worked soooooo much better than just letting them “cry it out” and much faster than progressive increments of separation (though you can integrate that as well and you don’t really want to start this when they’re panicking).

[pompeiii]

Thanks! I’m going to take a look at this today.

Yesterday didn’t go as well as Sunday. I am thinking it’s less about being alone and more about not keeping his brain busy? He was never bad or worked up to the point of no return. But much more trotting (and he’s definitely nqr so I have to figure out if he just needs muscle or if it’s something else. Ugh EPM did a number on him). He didn’t scream it out though and only called when my other gelding called (thanks Cairo, not helpful… Cairo called a few times and didn’t once move his body from the hay lol). I did keep the solo time short and ended up walking in the round pen with him (he immediately started grazing for a minute) and then put him back to work. I actually got some lovely work out of him that was better than before. I never would have gotten that if he was too stressed so who knows. I’m in the office today and it’s going to be pouring rain tomorrow and I’m at a funeral on Thursday. If I’m back early enough we’ll do something otherwise, Friday.