Should he run?

[LaurieB]

@snaffle1987

do you think that his other owner, an investor, willing handed over an eclipse winner, a 2x breeders cup winner… for pennies? especially the owner who wanted to retire the horse? If he handed over the reins to the owner wanting to continue running the horse; the likelihood of the want-to race owner having to pay to do so is pretty high. Be real with yourself.

:lol:

Unlike you, I’m being very real.

I don’t know how much the co-owner paid. Neither do you. This difference between us is that I don’t pretend to know things I don’t.

[On_the_Farm]

@snaffle1987

same partnership. Hartunian didn’t “majority own” Stormy Liberal and control what happened to him; specifically. Why would you think it would apply any different to the other horse.

The Paulick Report article stated that Bernson’s interest in Stormy Liberal was thought to be 10% before the buyout.

[Where_sMyWhite]

@Mara

I am not privy to the legal paperwork defining the partnership between Rockingham Ranch and David Bernsen, LLC. It’s worth mentioning that Rockingham is listed first as Roy H’s owner, which SOMETIMES indicates a majority ownership.

Mara, you obviously don’t run in the same inner circles as snaffle as she certainly appears to believe she’s in the know with ‘facts’. :lol:

Perhaps Stormy Liberal does just need a break but after looking at his stats in Equibase with earnings 2017-2019, he’s definitely tailed off this year over '17 and '18.

He is a gelding so no $$ in the shed. Doesn’t mean he has to keep running either. Even if he likes life at the track, he can play Lava Man and be a lead/exercise ‘pony’ which Lava Man seems to enjoy.

[Palm_Beach]

@snaffle1987

Let is also be known that Peter Miller was set down by the CHRB board and fined for prohibited drugs being found in Stormy Liberal’s system (Bute)

Perhaps there is bad blood here.

But still… greedy ownership. Sad for the horse.

Wrong. He got fined, not set down. No one cares about bute overages.

[Palm_Beach]

Most tracks allow horses to run until they are 10 to so. A 7 year old with only 37 starts, and how many on the turf? That’s hardly a huge workload. I have no inside information on this situation, but looks like he has been carefully managed. What is it that people want? Carefully managed horses who have good, long careers. How many times do we hear that?

[Where_sMyWhite]

@Palm Beach

Most tracks allow horses to run until they are 10 to so. A 7 year old with only 37 starts, and how many on the turf? That’s hardly a huge workload. I have no inside information on this situation, but looks like he has been carefully managed. What is it that people want? Carefully managed horses who have good, long careers. How many times do we hear that?

But how many horses run at the top level until they are 10? Not many. a few, but not many… most, as their on-track performance “declines”, they are bumped down in conditions and tracks where they can stay competitive.

While I do acknowledge and respect the hard-knocking claimers and other lower level racers (loved the Claiming Crown, I think it was, that Gulfstream Park has this last weekend), for a horse like Stormy Liberal with his earnings and record, would I want to see him running in $5k claimers in a few years??? No.

[On_the_Farm]

Not to get too off topic and to be a little selfish…who says an 8 year old can’t do special things?-- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QL7Rp8zJs9o

[Palm_Beach]

@Where'sMyWhite

But how many horses run at the top level until they are 10? Not many. a few, but not many… most, as their on-track performance “declines”, they are bumped down in conditions and tracks where they can stay competitive.

While I do acknowledge and respect the hard-knocking claimers and other lower level racers (loved the Claiming Crown, I think it was, that Gulfstream Park has this last weekend), for a horse like Stormy Liberal with his earnings and record, would I want to see him running in $5k claimers in a few years??? No.

I don’t know any horses that are running for a nickle that are graded stakes winners. there are a few steps you can take in between and then consider retirement.

[EventerAJ]

I highly doubt Bernsen bought put the partnership to run the horse in 5K claimers (rolleyes).

Looks to me like Bernsen wants OUT of the Peter Miller barn, but his partner Rockingham Ranch is a big Miller supporter. It seems buying Stormy outright was Bernsen’s only option, if he wanted another trainer.

From the PPs, it does seem like Stormy tailed off in 2019. Perhaps Bernsen felt the trainer was partially responsible; makes sense to me that he would send the horse somewhere else for another opinion. As it stands now, I’m not concerned that the horse will be “run into the ground.” The horse is going to a nice farm, probably get some sunny, grass turnout (less available in CA!), and will be evaluated by a good vet team.

Peter Miller’s comments seem sour grapes, to me, lashing out at losing a good horse…perhaps truly concerned about his welfare, but possibly also worried that the horse may have success elsewhere…

[jvanrens]

@snaffle1987

if its so bad then why does the same ownership who owns Roy H keeping Roy H with Miller.

Guess you didn’t read this part of the article posted:

[I]Together, Bernsen, Rockingham Ranch and Miller have enjoyed several wins at the highest level of the sport, including a victories in the 2017 and 2018 GI Breeders’ Cup Sprint with Roy H. (More Than Ready). Bernsen said he has been in the process of ending his ties with Miller and now has just two horses he co-owns with Rockingham Ranch, Roy H. and Wrecking Crew (Sky Kingdom).

“We will see what the fall out from this whole thing is,” he said. “It might be in everyone’s best interest if I take the high road and get out of those two horses. I’ve got plenty of other good ones. There’s life after Peter Miller.”[/I]

[On_the_Farm]

@jvanrens

Guess you didn’t read this part of the article posted:

[I]Together, Bernsen, Rockingham Ranch and Miller have enjoyed several wins at the highest level of the sport, including a victories in the 2017 and 2018 GI Breeders’ Cup Sprint with Roy H. (More Than Ready). Bernsen said he has been in the process of ending his ties with Miller and now has just two horses he co-owns with Rockingham Ranch, Roy H. and Wrecking Crew (Sky Kingdom).

“We will see what the fall out from this whole thing is,” he said. “It might be in everyone’s best interest if I take the high road and get out of those two horses. I’ve got plenty of other good ones. There’s life after Peter Miller.”[/I]

Snaffle was too busy answering emails from trainers seeking advice on their work tabs for today.

[Mara]

@On the Farm

Snaffle was too busy answering emails from trainers seeking advice on their work tabs for today.

Dammit, On the Farm, you just made me void the warranty on my iPad!:lol::lol::lol:

[findeight]

Or she was Fox Hunting .

[On_the_Farm]

@Mara

Dammit, On the Farm, you just made me void the warranty on my iPad!:lol::lol::lol:

Sorry about that. Good thing I didn’t use the line about Snaffle putting Bramlage on hold for over an hour.

[Where_sMyWhite]

@On the Farm

Sorry about that. Good thing I didn’t use the line about Snaffle putting Bramlage on hold for over an hour.

Ok, now you owe me a new iMac :lol: :lol: :lol: :applause: :congratulatory:

Or calling Baffert to tell him what 3YO races he should put his up and coming 2YOs in next spring…

[Mara]

@Where'sMyWhite

Ok, now you owe me a new iMac :lol: :lol: :lol: :applause: :congratulatory:

Or calling Baffert to tell him what 3YO races he should put his up and coming 2YOs in next spring…

And instructing Darley on planning their 2020 matings…

[Palm_Beach]

@Mara

And instructing Darley on planning their 2020 matings…

Riding ponies with QE2…

[halo]

@snaffle1987

do you think that his other owner, an investor, willing handed over an eclipse winner, a 2x breeders cup winner… for pennies? especially the owner who wanted to retire the horse? If he handed over the reins to the owner wanting to continue running the horse; the likelihood of the want-to race owner having to pay to do so is pretty high. Be real with yourself.

the money is an irrelevant factor in this. the horse should be retired.

Id be interested to know how much exactly you think a coming 8 year old gelding is worth, who won a couple of Breeders Cups in the past, who hasnt won a race in over a year, whos speed figures have been steadily declining.

[findeight]

@halo

Id be interested to know how much exactly you think a coming 8 year old gelding is worth, who won a couple of Breeders Cups in the past, who hasnt won a race in over a year, whos speed figures have been steadily declining.

Now, now, don’t let IRL facts cloud the issue.

[snaffle1987]

Stormy Liberal has been retired to Old Friends today