Like others have mentioned, I would move off of Bute and give his gut some ulcer support to see if his appetite improves and if he starts putting on some weight.
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He’s not as bad as I expected. High 3 or low 4.
I’d go a few different routes here (not all at the same time). If he’ll eat alfalfa, that’s awesome. Start there.
Up the pain meds for a few weeks - either a full gram every morning or Equioxx.
Change the ulcers meds. Try ranitidine instead of omeprazole, and add something for the hind gut like misoprostol or sucralfate. Sucralfate coats everything, so you should see a change fairly soon if ulcers are bothering him.
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I too would place him at a 3.5-4. Free-choice alfalfa is always my first go-to, then changing and/or upping concentrates, adding oil, etc. If you can find ranitidine, please tell me where. Aloe Vera juice is a good preventative that has also shown some help in healing ulcers. I also read last week that Tumeric can help with ulcers but haven’t followed up researching that claim yet.
To answer the big question, I think it is perfectly reasonable to euthanize. It really does sound like pain a is a main contributor to his inability to hold weight.
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Even though he’s thin, 1/2gm Bute isn’t very much as far as pain control. I’d consider trying Equioxx instead. Good that he’s eating the alfalfa!
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Okay so what I’m hearing from a lot of you is my brain is telling me he looks WAY worse than he actually does and that I should probably chill a bit. Thanks guys, that actually helps a lot. He was good over winter, so every time I look at him I cringe a little.
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I will go through with this if it’s clear his quality of life is not able to be improved upon. But he was my first horse and is very special, so I don’t want to just euthanize him for convenience when he has a shot at a few more comfortable years.
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Can I ask what ingredient in sweet feed contributes to ulcers? Any sweet feed I have seen is a mix of whole grains, a mystery pellet and molasses. What is ulcer causing about that?
It’s not necessarily the individual ingredients. It’s high NSC
High sugar and starch meals increase volatile fatty acid production, which directly (ie it’s a contact issue) and negatively impacts the integrity of the stomach mucosal lining, making it more susceptible to ulcers from the stomach acid
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Not going to lie, I f&!$ing hate sweet feed and swore up and down I would never feed it to my horses.
Well, a$$hole mcgee won’t eat anything else so (:
Everyone else gets free choice hay and a handful of ration balancer with some trace minerals. That’s it. One of them is off property right now at my trainer’s place so he’s not even getting the ration balancer since her horses live outside.
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JB beat me to it
https://thehorse.com/19510/feeding-t…ersson%20says.
"Researchers on other studies have confirmed that ulcers form in nonworking horses simply from being stabled and consuming concentrate meals.
“(Cereal grains) tend to be low in calcium and possibly other potential buffering agents, which may also contribute to the increased risk of ulceration,” Luthersson says."
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I fed it for years and never had a horse with ulcers. I don’t feed it now ( not because I feel it is harmful) as my current horses have different needs / options.
Don’t you think that a horse is predisposed to ulcers? Otherwise how do you explain that horses kept on a diet to prevent ulcers still develop them and are a battle to keep from coming back? Then other horses are an ulcer waiting to happen ( diet and housing) and never have an issue?
I think switching off the bute to equioxx, and providing additional hind gut support is worth a try, in addition to the alfalfa.
My OTTB goes off hay when he has hind gut issues. Equishur did nothing for him, but Succeed worked great. If you think he has stomach ulcers, you may want to look into injectable omeprazole. I have a friend with a kissing spine horse, who developed ulcers from the pain. He had bleeding ulcers. 2 shots (one per week), completely healed them (scoped and re-scoped). Sadly, they came back within a couple months because his KS is so severe. She has made an appointment to euthanize him, because she knows he is suffering, and he actually get quite dangerous to handle when he has an ulcer flair up.
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Now when I see a horse that is chronically difficult to keep weight on, my first suspect is always pain.
I might have missed this, but if he is retired for physical issues, have you tried any long-term pain relief besides bute? They are not without ulcer risks, but sometimes they make a huge difference for the horses who are dealing with chronic pain. Something like Previcox or Uckele’s Devil’s Claw comes to mind. Even MSM helps with the stiff oldies. I don’t personally like bute long term.
It sounds like you’ve done most of the things I would have suggested. Other than trying to swap out the sweet feed for alfalfa, I might try adding oil to his food. 1 cup of standard vegetable oil is a very good way to get a ton of calories in a horse. Only issue is if they are picky. But that 1cup is usually around ~2000 calories, if I am remembering right.
Another thing to possibly consider, is doing a fecal transplant. I tried this with a gelding we threw everything at, trying to see what stuck. He was eating fine but had chronic diarrhea and was starting to look thrifty. We tried everything including the vet’s go to metronidazole.
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I actually did kind of ha-ha not very seriously think about this, since my other one is borderline obese. I know my vet has done them before and they’re not difficult, and I wonder if she’d try one if everything else fails. The horse she did it on was dying of an intestinal infection, however, so not same situation.
No…it was all recalled…RX and OTC.
events/press-announcements/fda-requests-removal-all-ranitidine-products-zantac-market.
Susan
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No…it was all recalled…RX and OTC.
https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/fda-requests-removal-all-ranitidine-products-zantac-market
Susan
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Take a look at the grain you are giving him. There are a lot of good choices these days beyond senior and sweet feed. Senior feeds are usually designed to address problems with eating and digesting. Recommended servings are larger because the grain replaces the forage they can’t chew or digest. If a horse gets a smaller serving of senior the nutrients may not be adequate. Sweet feed, my BO said once, is like sitting them down at an all-you-can-eat ice cream buffet.
My 26 year old gelding has always been on pasture board. He’s been the alpha for years but we are starting to see a few shifts in herd dynamics He is still getting his fill of hay and maintains his weight. He’s never gained an extra ounce. His teeth are pretty good, checked twice a year. We still do light-moderate work 5 or 6 days a week. I want to be sure he is getting the nutrients he needs and some extra calories. I added Blue Seal Sentinel LS which is high fat, high fiber, and low in carbs and starch with 12% protein. He gets about 3 lbs per day. All of the Sentinel feeds are extruded like senior, but the nutrients are balanced differently. You can get the nutritional profile your horse needs without worrying about the digestibility factor.
Recent blood work was right where it should be except selenium, which was a couple of 10ths high. He is on previcox for his problem knee. He also gets a joint supplement with soft tissue support, natural vitamin E, and biotin, all from HorseTech.com. I like HorseTech not just for the quality of their products but because Rod, the owner, has been very helpful in setting up a plan with LS and the supplements. At 26 my wonderful gelding is cruising along like a younger guy and, per the vet, has no need to consider retiring.
People ARE getting Rx ranitidine via compounding pharmacies
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Sr feeds can still be fed to horses who are eating plenty of forage, as the OP horse is. Recommended feeding rates are still comparable to regular feeds. TC Sr for example says to start around 6lb and go up or down as calorie needs dictate.
They just CAN be fed at a much higher rate to replace most and even all long-stem forage
If a horse gets a smaller serving of senior the nutrients may not be adequate. Sweet feed, my BO said once, is like sitting them down at an all-you-can-eat ice cream buffet.
6lb of TC Sr is good enough for the forage the hores is getting. Add to that the nutrition from the 9lb of the sweet feed, and that’s pretty well covered.
She knows the sweet feed isn’t great, but sometimes you just gotta get them to eat
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