Sore after farrier

[Mcl1]

Looking for some input on my TB’s hoof situation. He came to me last August and had just gotten his feet done a week or so prior. His hoof walls were in rough shape and had been built up with epoxy. He lost a shoe about 2 weeks later from the epoxy cracking, and I used the first farrier who could come out to put it back on. She reshod both fronts, and he lost the other shoe about 3 weeks after that. She came back out and didn’t feel like she could put shoes back on him. This is what his feet looked like at that point:

I bought hoof boots for him as he was very sore without shoes. We did the barefoot/boot thing for about 6 weeks - he was eventually sound with the boots on but he has very sensitive skin and despite cleaning multiple times a day, trying every sock combo, etc. he started getting pretty bad rubs. With a new diet and fly boots his hooves improved to a point where he could get reshod.

I wasn’t a huge fan of the farrier who had been coming out - she told me many times that she wasn’t very experienced with shoeing, she was 6-8 hours late each time she came, always forgot tools, etc. so I decided to try my current farrier, who came highly recommended.

First time he shod him, horse was very sore immediately after, particularly on his right front. I reached out to the farrier and he kind of brushed it off and said he wasn’t lame enough for it to be a hot nail and to just give it a few days. Gave bute for a few days and he was completely sound within a week or so. I obviously wasn’t thrilled but given the farrier’s reputation and since it was his first time shoeing him, I didn’t feel like it was a deal breaker. The next time he came out, no issues.

Now, he was out this past Saturday and once again, horse was very sore immediately after, especially on the right front. Gave bute for a few days and he is now looking almost back to 100%. I have never been of the mindset that it should be normal for a horse to be lame after a farrier visit. But - I don’t have many farrier options around here and this guy is consistently recommended and seems to have a great reputation. I also have a mustang who is difficult to work on and this guy has worked with me to get him trimmed which I appreciate as many (rightfully) would not.

Here are what his feet look like now (tried to clean him up the best I could - the clay mud we have around here is brutal to scrub off). Looking for opinions on how his feet look, and if anyone has advice on where to go from here. Does it sound like he is trimming too short? Or is there potentially something else going on to make my horse so sensitive? I have asked my farrier how his feet look and he just says “good”…If I had a choice of quality farriers, I would just have someone else come take a look but it is so hard to get someone to show up.

[Simkie]

It’s time for foot rads.

[Mcl1]

@Simkie This might be a stupid question - but does it matter at what point in his trimming/shoe cycle they get done? I called around last fall when he was first sore but no one local has a portable x-ray. Apparently there is a good lameness vet 2 hours away so hauling him there is probably my best option.

[MissusS]

I got farrier rads for my mare (for very different reason - she is recovering from a hind suspensory injury) and the vet recommended it was best to have them done right after a trim… BUT I have an excellent farrier who works regularly on my horse and has a very good working relationship/regular communication with my vet.

If you have a trusted vet who knows you and your horse I’d suggest asking them or calling the clinic you would plan to trailer to and getting their opinion. Perhaps it’s best practice to get the rads after a trim, but if the farrier you are using is not experienced it may hurt more than it helps?

[RedHorses]

Did you remind the farrier that your horse was sore after the first shoeing? It’s quite possible that his usual trim is a little too aggressive for your horse and he needs to be more cautious, as he probably was the second time. When a horse has a quirk that can be managed fairly easily, it can also be forgotten as it doesn’t show up.

Telling the farrier every time that your horse tends to be sore after a fresh trim can just remind him to be less aggressive.

A fellow boarder had a barefoot horse who was sore for a week after every trim, then totally fine for the next five weeks. The farrier said he couldn’t do anything about it other than put shoes on the horse. I connected the boarder with another farrier who had no trouble doing a less aggressive trim, leaving the horse sound all the time.

I’ve seen it several times with different farriers. Horse has X issue, farrier manages X issue, with Y trim, X issue starts to resolve, farrier forgets to do Y trim, and X issue reappears.

[IPEsq]

Considering the high/low thing has gotten worse than the first pics and the right foot is the high foot, I’d take radiographs. I wonder if it’s actually clubbed?

[ThreeWishes]

@IPEsq

wonder if it’s actually clubbed?

I had the same initial thought.

[Simkie]

@Mcl1

This might be a stupid question - but does it matter at what point in his trimming/shoe cycle they get done?

Not a stupid question! I’ve always done them right after a trim mostly because that’s when I reach the “enough of this let’s figure out wtf is up” point.

But I agree with @MissusS above to ask the vet about when they’d like to target. It’s definitely tougher when you’ve got to haul a ways, and the horse is shod, and those shoes might need to be pulled for the rads.

If the vet that’s a couple hours away has a shoer they really like and work with frequently, maybe it’s not a bad idea to try to coordinate with both and haul the horse out at the end of the cycle, so you can do rads & whatever changes to the shoeing the vet may recommend all in one go?

[Heinz_57]

@Simkie

It’s time for foot rads.

Agreed, something is hinky with that RF. I wouldn’t immediately throw the farrier under the bus, especially when options are extremely limited.

Otherwise, in general - they don’t look obviously “too short”, but there is flaring that needs to be dealt with and probably isn’t being done any favors with the shoe’s full-fit placement.

[fordtraktor]

I would do them whenever in the cycle the problem is most obvious. In this case, right after a trim. Last time I had them done it was right before a trim because it was an issue of cracking late in his cycle.

[beau159]

@Mcl1

Looking for some input on my TB’s hoof situation.

Are those pictures of both his FRONT feet?
They are VERY assymmetrical, different angles, different heel lengths.
I too wonder if one of them is a club foot.
If each foot isn’t take care of accordingly, think about how “crooked” your horse must feel when he travels. Make sense he is lame after a trim. It might not be that the farrier is trimming too short - he just might be trimming wrong. However, you can’t force a club foot to look normal (if that is what he has) and that’s where you need to rads to balance things out.

So I agree with @Simkie that you need to go get some xrays and find out what’s going on inside the hoof. Go to that GOOD lameness vet 2 hours from you and get a full lameness exam on top of it.

[stargzng386]

X-rays! I had a similar issue with my pony I switched farrier twice. She would only be sore every 6 months or so if they took her sole too short. I had X-rays taken and she has an old coffin bone fracture. It’s invaluable information for my new current farrier. It also has changed how I manage her. Her toes were super long from the prior farrier and more breakover takes pressure off the old fracture. It was well worth getting a look into what was going on inside.

[Mcl1]

First, thank you all so much for the reasonable advice. I have my horses at home in a rural area, it is so helpful for me to be able to get another set of eyes on them.

I think my plan will be to schedule an exam with the lameness vet in ~6 weeks as long as he gets back to 100% in the next couple of days. If they may have to pull the shoes get the x-rays, I am concerned that if they are already sore from being too short, having to pull them now and reshoe immediately could make him way more uncomfortable. If he is not back to 100% when I get back from a conference next week I’ll make an appointment for as soon as possible. (Unless having his feet out of balance the way they are is potentially going to be harmful over the next few weeks, in which case I’ll just make the appointment ASAP).

Is it vital for the farrier and vet to be present at the same time - or has anyone had luck with relaying X-rays and instructions to a farrier later? I will definitely see if the vet has any farriers they work with and would recommend, but ideally I could work with my current farrier to implement the changes long term.

My friend who got him off the track didn’t have any lameness issues with him (she had him for about a year I believe) and his feet look so much better now in terms of growth and hoof walls that aren’t crumbling away - so hopefully just adjusting his farrier routine gets him back on track.

Yes, those are both his front feet and for everyone suggesting it may be a club foot - I was thinking the same thing. Would that have long term implications for soundness, or just something that needs to be taken into account when trimming and shoeing?

[fordtraktor]

I would wait until you get films to worry too much about a club foot. What I thought was clubby has several times turned out to not be and I worried myself for nothing. You have to have x rays to determine if it is a club foot or not.

[Kyrabee]

@Mcl1

has anyone had luck with relaying X-rays and instructions to a farrier later?

I haven’t. Discussed with the farrier. Got the x-rays and he refused to look at them and did what he wanted to with no input from the vet. To say I was miffed….

I am sure not all are that way but this one wasn’t .

[Pico_Banana]

Ideally, your vet and farrier would be there at the same time. Rads before trim so farrier can see what they have to work with and discuss with vet. Trim. Then more rads to confirm trim has accomplished what was intended and not too much. Walk horse to see if he is sore. Further consultation as necessary.

If that’s not possible, I’d still do rads before and try to have vet call farrier and have a direct conversation. My vet has done this for me before.

[Mcl1]

Well as an update to this and another dilemma - I made an appt. with the lameness vet for the soonest they had available which is this coming Tuesday. I have not been riding the horse but he has been sound in turnout. He did have pretty nasty thrush which I got cleared up.

Today - he comes in having sprung his RF shoe. 3 of 4 nails are still in and he is sound but the shoe is definitely bent. No clips on his shoes to worry about. I don’t want to get him reshod (if the farrier could make it out) and then have to pull them in a few days. I could pull the shoe myself and try a hoof boot but I’m not sure if that will complicate his lameness exam…I was hoping he could show up “sound” so we could accurately assess him… I will call the vet tomorrow to confirm whether he wants to pull the shoes for X-rays. Otherwise I am not sure if I should just pull the shoe or leave it on and/or wrap it.

[ParadoxFarm]

I would pull the shoe at this point with the bent shoe making it hard to walk soundly. Plus, with only a few nails, it will come off on its own with maybe more hoof wall than you would want.

[steelerino]

Willing to put money on it that he has white line in that L front

[IPEsq]

Could the farrier just straighten it out and tack it back on? If he doesn’t get trimmed, then he should be the same as he was.