I came into this thread with experience that you asked for.
I had three posts in this thread (which had 52 replies this AM), up until you responded to one of my posts with a personal attack. I responded back, because this is a discussion forum.
I would hardly call that “relentless”. Are we only allowed one post per thread, or…?
Well this escalated unnecessarily 
I think @beowulf makes an interesting point about the lack of diagnosis. I would not be comfortable with doing essentially an experiment on my horse if there isn’t a diagnosis that indicates spaying. Maybe I missed the diagnosis in the thread. I have read with some interest as I recently started a thread about trying to figure out what’s going on with my seasonally grumpy and situationally aggressive mare - so my interest in this thread is around the details about diagnoses & how they were reached that lead to the recommendation of spaying. Most threads seem to meander a bit like that and offer kernels that lead to more reading for me 
I guess where things are getting not useful is when someone asks for experiences about a specific procedure (spaying a mare), provides a fairly good idea that the mare has and is being seen by several vets, some of whom are repro vets, provides a picture of a horse who is Jekyll and Hyding in and out of cycles, and then runs up against someone who wants to diagnose the horse and clearly believes the owner hasn’t gone down the correct path, and keeps saying this, in different/same ways.
That would irritate me, too, and I would take it personally as it is essentially a random internet stranger telling me my vets are all doing it wrong, when all I asked for were any experiences with spaying a mare.
I NEVER ask for advice on this forum because it often turns into a lot of silliness, but OP didn’t actually ask for advice…and here we are, with silliness.
I understand, but I did not insinuate anywhere that the OP did not go down the right path.
I only shared that in a similar situation about this very specific procedure, it did not work with a horse in my care. Who was also seen by a team of veterinarians and a big vet school.
OP asked for experiences spaying a mare. I provided it. The problem was OP did not want negative experiences with the procedure.
A tangential question (out of curiosity) for the people with the mares with challenges…
How are they during anestrus over the winter months? Do their symptoms disappear?
I have multiple mares, and do find the last cycle before winter each year seems to be the absolute WORST, behavior wise.
My mare was great over the winter. Fresh when turnout was limited due to weather or staying in for pulled shoes, but just normal freshness that a quick lunge took care of. She never had a buck or anything like that. Just energy. Things that would get me killed now (snow falling off the indoor roof in loud crashes) were non-issues.
She cycled into December last year, and we actually showed while she was in heat. She was great. More vocal, but down to business when it mattered. When she started having issues with her first heat this Spring, we assumed it was that she has really tough transitional heats. Then her heat lasted 6 weeks before the vet brought her out of it with a shot…and every heat after has been progressively worse.
Her improvement over winter? That’s really key information I think. The fact that she continues cycling into December though… it sure seems like she has hyperactive ovaries. Are you in a more southern location with less significant daylight changes? Or was it a warm winter? I’ve had my mares have minor heat like behavior in December, when temperatures fluctuate dramatically and it’s unseasonably warm (I’m in Virginia and sometimes we have warm weirdness in December). They seem to generally go into anestrus when daylight dramatically shortens in late October/early November though.
From what I understand from other folks, winter anestrus is a decent approximation of what the mare’s behavior might be like once spayed. Maybe go through the winter this year again with her, and see what you think? Hopefully winter at least gives you a break from her problem behavior, and some extra time to talk with your vets
Yes, the improvement over winter, the fact she cycled so late (we are in Upstate NY - its consistently cold and dark early on), the frequency/duration of her cycles, and the escalating intensity of her heats are why my vets recommended spaying. She actually is at Cornell now being seen by their repro specialists and the surgical team and they agree with that course of action based on her vet records and history.
One thing the repro specialist at Cornell noted is that some times you can’t get a diagnosis until you spay and send the ovaries to pathology. Her ultrasound yesterday was normal, but I was encouraged to submit the ovaries for further testing as there can be abnormalities that will not be picked up on ultrasound. I definitely plan to do that, as it is clear to all of us something is wrong reproductively and it would be great to pinpoint the specific issue.
Upstate New York - wow. She definitely shouldn’t be cycling all the way into December! That’s nuts.
If I were in your shoes, I definitely would send ovaries to be examined by a pathologist post op. Ultrasound is a useful tool, but a pathologist can see many things that ultrasound just can’t find.
Good luck with the mare! If you do the surgery soon, you should update this thread with what pathologist finds.
Right? One of my vets said she had repro clients whose mares she was struggling to keep cycling through August. Then there is mine…
And yes, I definitely am plan to send them to be examined and will update if there are any findings! Thank you
Not that it matters at this point, but is she kept in a barn with the lights on for hours after dark? Keeping mares under lights is frequently used to bring mares into season earlier in the season and I can see how it would affect them in the fall as well.
Nope…last fall she she was out 24/7. This Spring/Summer she was on night turnout. Either way, barn doesn’t leave lights on at night.
It has to be a certain type of light, not just your run-of-the-mill fixture.
I’m still in the early parts of figuring out what is going on with my mare but we determined via ultrasound today that she is still ovulating despite being on Regu-mate. No signs of tumors or anything else unusual on ultrasound. I’ll be curious for an update from the OP about how things go with her mare as she sounds similar to mine. For now I have more reading to do 
Quick update. My mare’s ovaries were removed late last week. It was a standing procedure that took about 3 hours from start to recovery, and she was home within 48 hours. She is doing well and seems to be feeling pretty good. Even on the day of discharge she seemed much less sore than I anticipated. She can go back out next week in a small space alone, then back out as normal and start under saddle two weeks after that.
I received the pathology results yesterday which were normal - unfortunately no answers there. The surgeon thought she could still have some abnormal hormonal levels going on that she is especially sensitive too (either from her ovaries or possibly from her pituitary gland) and the large follicles she produced as a result could have caused pain, but as of now no concrete explanation for the extreme duration, frequency, and intensity of her cycles. I did speak with the repro vet who examined her at Cornell who said that while the exam was normal (no noted abnormalities) it wasn’t what he would expect to see for a mare as far along in her cycle as she was. I’m hoping to speak to him soon about the pathology results as well.
I was of course hoping for a concrete explanation for what exactly she had been dealing with - it feels odd to be disappointed by normal test results. Basically now we wait and see how she is once she is back in work and over the next few months/next Spring. Repro vet thinks if the behavior was pain related to ovulation there is a likelihood I will notice a significant difference. Otherwise, the impact could be more moderate.
As an aside, the discharge instructions noted 30% of mares continue to experience behavioral issues after spaying (which was actually lower than I thought). And adding synthetic progesterone (Regumate) even after the spay was mentioned as an option as needed, which I think someone asked about.
Thanks for the update, and that’s great news that your mare got through surgery well, and is home now. Fingers crossed for a good recovery.
@Rel6 Thanks for the update!
I have a mare whose follicles more then double in size (ultrasound) on both sides in the fall.
( Sorry if I misuse some terms… as I am having my first experience with a mare like this and openly accept my ignorance as I have owned mares for 40 years and never had a mare like this… learning curve has been steep).
Bought her at 4 unbroke but through PPE. She was good until her 5yr old year when we found this and I kept her on regumate until last Christmas (she’s 7). She was off of regumate this past spring and summer and I thought I had her managed well since I haven’t seen any of this type of behavior.
Well last week she was coming into season and a complete land shark in the barn to other horses… during a ride she got sort of stuck over offering haunches in and I was trying to tactfully get her out of it when we got to the corner (which increases the engagement) and she just exploded.
Had the vet out that day to ultrasound her and confirmed her follicles were more then double normal size both sides. The vet gave some drugs to bring her into cycle… she literally laid down for two days and just slept and she’s a very Alfa mare who doesn’t lay down often when people are around. No one can tell me she wasn’t hurting from her cycle and probably hadn’t slept well for days.
I have owned many upper level mares who I evented who never had these types of issue. This mare does dressage shown thru third level and schooling p/p and more; she is 7 and has no issues as we have checked, yes for ulcers, kissing spines, saddle, joints, farrier, all the whole issues anyone will toss my way….and I am very big on preventative care anyway…and will do anything to confirm but as of right now all is pointing towards fall ovulation causing extreme discomfort.
Started her again on regumate. Currently my vet is recommending her go on it in the fall and maybe the spring but doesn’t think it’s necessary during winter or summer since she seems fine during those times.
I do think I can manage this going forward but would love to hear your outcome @Rel6 with the spay as well. Thank you for starting this topic
It sounds you made the moves but I wanted to offer another success story. My friend did it for her mare maybe 5+ years ago. At the time she definitely could not afford it but they vet convinced her it was the only option. She put herself in some debt to do it and is now so happy with her decision. I only know the mare after and she is really lovely to be around, still quite spicy and mare-ish, but a great horse all around. Anyway, in case you’re still carrying any anxiety, for her it was totally transformative in a positive way.
Question: Pre-spay, did you try a bute trial, and did bute help your mare? (I am wondering if bute helps hormone related discomfort).
Please follow up with the eventual outcome. I am curious if your mare’s behaviour resolves or if it is potentially habitual now?
Sorry you’re going through this! It is very frustrating for sure. I almost think having everything else come back normal makes it a little easier though. We also went through ruling out a bunch of other diagnoses (kissing spine, Lyme, etc) and my bigger fear was a borderline finding. I dreaded my vet saying “well she has some findings in her titer/x-rays that maybe could be part of it or maybe not…” Especially with kissing spine where you can have findings that may be asymptomatic. So if you’re able to definitively rule out things that is helpful! Good luck
By submitting your email, you agree to our Terms of Service and Privacy Policy. You may also receive promotional emails from The Chronicle of the Horse. You can opt out at any time.
For Customers
Company
Terms of Use
