Spinoff: Prelude by Mozart Trakehner and being SLAMMED on the H/J forum about Trakes!

[tuckawayfarm]

[QUOTE=PineTreeFarm;5820356]
Fair enough. But you said rated circuits so there must be some Canadian website I look up his offspring’s performance records on?

About Tobasco: No doubt that this is a nice horse but it showed 4 times this year ( hasn’t been seen since WEF) and is in 50th place in one of the four way split Junior Hunter sections.

Just me but that’s not ‘highly successful’. Not to pick on the Tobasco fan but far too often posters make claims on this forum that turn out to be feed and lead, DHSB or 2’ Hunters with 3 in the class and the horse has been doing that section for a bunch of years.
I do agree that just to be a competitive 3’6" horse is an accomplishment.[/QUOTE]

Wow, you’re tough!!

I didn’t even know he was still showing.

I’ve just never met anyone before who would not consider being Small Junior HOY to be “highly successful”.

YMMV :lol:

[acottongim]

@findeight;5819949

I
Unfortunately, their names are secret and USEF only lists 6 with results since 2007-none jumping anything. And he is a 1993 product and should have offspring ranging up to…oh, 12+ or so-plenty of time for enough crops to make an impression as a stud.

This was what I was referring to. He is a 1993 product who has only been in the states for 6 years, oldest offspring in the US is 5 yo so you won’t find him on the US lists. Not saying that you said that he was bad - this is where the written word can be misinterrpreted instead of the spoken word.

Trust me, I agree in that the OP should not have said that he has sired mult winners and all the other things that he/she posted about Prelude. Hopefully some of the youngsters will still make it into the ring and prove that they are good hunters and jumpers.

[TatteredDaydreamer]

Um…what about Zarr and Hennessey? In fact, wasn’t there a Zarr baby that placed very well in the HB at Warrington?

[Lynnwood]

[QUOTE=TatteredDaydreamer;5820645]
Um…what about Zarr and Hennessey? In fact, wasn’t there a Zarr baby that placed very well in the HB at Warrington?[/QUOTE]

^^ Hennessey, Zarr , Zealous all HB and performance Trak sires.

[3TBS]

[QUOTE=PineTreeFarm;5820356]
Fair enough. But you said rated circuits so there must be some Canadian website I look up his offspring’s performance records on?

About Tobasco: No doubt that this is a nice horse but it showed 4 times this year ( hasn’t been seen since WEF) and is in 50th place in one of the four way split Junior Hunter sections.

Just me but that’s not ‘highly successful’. Not to pick on the Tobasco fan but far too often posters make claims on this forum that turn out to be feed and lead, DHSB or 2’ Hunters with 3 in the class and the horse has been doing that section for a bunch of years.
I do agree that just to be a competitive 3’6" horse is an accomplishment.[/QUOTE]

Absolutley, several of Ashers offspring are always in the top of the OHJA standings…

Ashby: 2nd of 74 in 2010
http://www.equiman.com/ohja/points_display.php?point_code=CHILDHUNT&div_type2=H&year=2010&button=Submit

Wilby: 4th of 34 in baby greens 2010
http://www.equiman.com/ohja/points_display.php?point_code=BABY&div_type2=H&year=2010&button=Submit

Ashby: 6th currentlyin Junior Hunters 2011
http://www.equiman.com/ohja/points_display.php?point_code=BABY&div_type2=H&year=2010&button=Submit

Those are just 2 of his offsprings records. I dont think Canadian horses are set up to search as easy as USEF horses…couldnt figure out a way to search by Sire.

[Prime_Time_Rider]

I own a Trak/TB cross (grandsire is Abdullah), and while he is a kind horse and was zone 3 champion children’s hunter, I wouldn’t go out of my way to buy another Trak for a hunter prospect. Why? Well, 95% of the time he’s great and 5% the time the mental wheels fall off. Plus he jumps flat. I think the Traks have a lot of Arabian blood, which isn’t my first choice for a hunter.

[Pennywell_Bay]

[QUOTE=TatteredDaydreamer;5820645]
Um…what about Zarr and Hennessey? In fact, wasn’t there a Zarr baby that placed very well in the HB at Warrington?[/QUOTE]

And Unmistakable. By Zarr cleaned up on the Florida circuit as well. Out of a t-bred mare.

No one based Traks. It was a poorly disguised advert? My personal experience w Traks is they can lighten up a heavier type, mine ( only speaking for mine) are superb movers but they can be hot.

There- I just described 90% of stallions out there.

[TaliaCristianna]

As someone who personally knows both the stallion Prelude and his owner Karen I am now compelled to chime in.

I am very saddened by these posts. Karen and her stallion are undeserving of the criticisms generated by the OP’s threads.

Karen is an honest and extremely kind person. She is everything a stallion owner SHOULD be. She would NEVER promote her stallion as being something other than what he is.

Prelude spent a large portion of his life being used as a dressage horse. He was never really promoted by his former owner and he produced a very small number of foals while in Canada. His first “real” foal crop is just coming to be 5 years of age this year I believe.

He IS a capable jumper. No, he does not have the textbook “pretty” hunter form. Yes, this is not unusual among Trakehners here in the US.

With that being said, Karen has not had any trouble moving her Prelude foals to a variety of different homes all over the country. She has been very successful as a stallion promoter and Prelude continues to be on the ATA’s top sire list year after year. This would not be the case if his foals weren’t finding homes and being used/enjoyed by their owners.

I bred one of my mares to Prelude. I originally purchased a breeding to a different stallion that had been owned by Karen. When that stallion couldn’t fulfill his duties Karen allowed me to transfer the breeding to Prelude and also allowed me to switch to a different, more “Prelude” appropriate mare.

I focus primarily on dressage. After researching Prelude’s pedigree I thought he would work quite well with this particular mare of mine. When you meet Prelude in person he oozes quality. He has a unique and rare Trak pedigree. Prelude is also a horse with a FANTASTIC work ethic and disposition. He is a lovely and correct mover. As for jumping, the old cliche truly applies: what he lacks in form he makes up in heart.

He has the ability to produce versatile foals which was extremely appealing to me. They can jump, they can also go the dressage route. He is a great choice for a refining stallion as he has a very “thoroughbred-like” build. I am very very happy with my Prelude foal. In fact, she was exported to Germany as a yearling. Something I am quite proud of.

http://silverspringfarm.net/sales_61_1477005514.jpg

http://silverspringfarm.net/sales_61_2596858276.jpg

http://silverspringfarm.net/sales_61_3634136653.jpg

http://silverspringfarm.net/sales_61_3758668484.jpg

So, that is my take - as someone that knows the horse, knows the stallion owner and bred/owned and sold a foal.

[stoicfish]

[QUOTE=Prime Time Rider;5821917]
I own a Trak/TB cross (grandsire is Abdullah), and while he is a kind horse and was zone 3 champion children’s hunter, I wouldn’t go out of my way to buy another Trak for a hunter prospect. Why? Well, 95% of the time he’s great and 5% the time the mental wheels fall off. Plus he jumps flat. I think the Traks have a lot of Arabian blood, which isn’t my first choice for a hunter.[/QUOTE]

Arabs are one of the breeds (besides Tb’s) that can be added but the vast majority of Traks go 200-300 years before you find Arab in their pedigree. You find Tb more frequently but that is true of any WB. I would guess they jump flatter because they were bred for Eventing and that is a lower faster type of course.

[cherham]

Hey don’t forget about my filly ASHANTI by Asher. Her hunter record speaks for itself in the A hunter rings too… not to mention a pretty impressive line career. She will be out showing in the childrens next year and competing in the new Hunter Derby division up here as well.

Also Wellington this winter (fingers crossed for time off work for that one).

[Rio_Blanco]

So, as mare and stallion owners, you guys see no issue with these threads? If I was Prelude’s owner (which OP is NOT) I would be mortified the find that she had been mis-representing my stallion and arousing the negative publicity that she has on these forums. Has anyone even considered that “Trakes” were not being “bashed” on the other thread, but rather the ridiculous comments OP was claiming is what she was actually being called out on? Take a look for yourself: http://www.chronofhorse.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=77

There’s no doubt that there are successful “Trakes” in the hunter world, nobody ever said that they weren’t. However, having shown in the Junior Hunters as a kid, there is no way that I would breed any fancy hunter mare to this stud in hopes of a fancy hunter foal. His jumping style isn’t something that I would want reproduced on my hunter foals, plain and simple. That’s not breed bashing, that’s an assessment of this particular horse’s jumping style AS A HUNTER. As a jumper? Possibly. But a hunter? No way.

[PineTreeFarm]

@Pennywell Bay;5822190

And Unmistakable. By Zarr cleaned up on the Florida circuit as well. Out of a t-bred mare.

No one based Traks. It was a poorly disguised advert? My personal experience w Traks is they can lighten up a heavier type, mine ( only speaking for mine) are superb movers but they can be hot.

There- I just described 90% of stallions out there.

I’m sorry but you’ve done a good job of making my point.
Unmistakable may very well be a nice horse but it showed ONCE this year in a non TB division with 6 horses. That show was in Florida but not WEF.
Previous to that he did show in Florida in 2008 in Jacksonville, Tampa and Ocala in Baby Green Hunter, Training Hunter. He did do well in PreGreen in a 3 horse field.
In 2009 and 2010 he continued to show in PreGreen in smaller FL shows in small fields.
Perhaps my definition of ‘cleaning up’ is not the same as yours? USEF results are public records, available to all.
Usually when someone says ’ on the FL circuit’ that implies WEF or at least Ocala and that’s not the case here.

Zarr DOES produce performance horses but primarily his get are shown HB. He is somewhere around 50th place in Hunter Sires this year on the strength of two nice 3’6" horses ( either of which would have made a better case for Traks).

I do agree it was a poorly phrased advert but the new ‘norm’ seems to be that the Mods have been very liberal with ‘congrats’ posts by the stallion owners in the last few months.

[Rio_Blanco]

OP isn’t the stallion owner. I have come to believe that she has purchased a mare with a breeding to Prelude and is now upset because she didn’t get the responses that she wanted re: Prelude as a champion-producing hunter sire.

[tuckawayfarm]

[QUOTE=Rio Blanco;5823154]
OP isn’t the stallion owner. I have come to believe that she has purchased a mare with a breeding to Prelude and is now upset because she didn’t get the responses that she wanted re: Prelude as a champion-producing hunter sire.[/QUOTE]

Thanks for clarifying, I wondered what the point of the OP was

Perhaps my definition of ‘cleaning up’ is not the same as yours?

Just curious, but what IS your definition of a successful hunter?

I watched many Tobasco rounds because I had sold a Sm. Jr. Hunter into the same barn and loved getting to watch him with his kid whenever I had the opportunity. I thought it was too bad my guy had to ALWAYS compete against such an easy going horse. (mine was 100% TB) Since you don’t consider Tobasco, who was in the top 10 in his 3’6 division in 2004, Horse of the Year in 2005, and won multiple championships at WEF in 2006, to have had a successful career, what are your requirements for “success”?

I will readily admit that I am no expert on upper level hunters, but I am interested in learning since my jumper mares occasionally produce huntery foals.

[DMK]

@Ridewithnopride;5818963

So, I know I recently put a thread up in this forum about Prelude by Mozart and people SLAMMED (not just Prelude) but trakehners in general.

Oh sweetie, I think you are confused. I think they were mostly slamming you, not trakehners, not the stallion or the stallion owner, just one lone poster… You come on a board and just flat make stuff up, chances are you will be called on it.

[Pennywell_Bay]

[QUOTE=PineTreeFarm;5823138]
I’m sorry but you’ve done a good job of making my point.
Unmistakable may very well be a nice horse but it showed ONCE this year in a non TB division with 6 horses. That show was in Florida but not WEF.
Previous to that he did show in Florida in 2008 in Jacksonville, Tampa and Ocala in Baby Green Hunter, Training Hunter. He did do well in PreGreen in a 3 horse field.
In 2009 and 2010 he continued to show in PreGreen in smaller FL shows in small fields.
Perhaps my definition of ‘cleaning up’ is not the same as yours? USEF results are public records, available to all.
Usually when someone says ’ on the FL circuit’ that implies WEF or at least Ocala and that’s not the case here.

Zarr DOES produce performance horses but primarily his get are shown HB. He is somewhere around 50th place in Hunter Sires this year on the strength of two nice 3’6" horses ( either of which would have made a better case for Traks).

I do agree it was a poorly phrased advert but the new ‘norm’ seems to be that the Mods have been very liberal with ‘congrats’ posts by the stallion owners in the last few months.[/QUOTE]

I was not commenting on your point, I did not even read it. I referred to someone who asked about a stallion. I did not say anything of his ranking as a hunter stallion. Nor did I say anything about WEF. The horse did “fine” at shows in Florida- is that more to your liking?

I don’t know who put a lemon in your cheerios. Another person to put on Ignore. Love that little button.