Looks like it’s being setup for Starter to be recognized starting in 2024. Year end leaderboard for those with USEA memberships - but not yet required to compete. AEC division. And true criteria for XC & SJ (along with the already provided starter dressage test or BN A).
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That’s interesting to compare to our new Starter (EV60) division in Ontario, that got “official” specs this year. It’s still considered a local division, so it’s not recognized by EC, but we developed provincial specs for it for 2023 to make it more consistent across the province.
Quite a few of our venues opted to run it this year, and it did seem to do the job of drawing new horses and riders into the sport.
Our Starter is .60m (60cm), not 70, and the speed for stadium and XC is currently 250mpm, quite a bit slower than yours. It will be reviewed this off season to see if the speed should be changed, or the time window opened up for more flexibility. The 250mpm is pretty slow unless it’s a kid on a little pony, so by the end of the season the venues were opting to time for educational purposes only and not giving out any speed faults.
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It’s interesting to me that they choose to introduce a lower level to entice more entries, versus address their lower level (BN) that already exists, that was literally designed “to introduce green horses and riders to the sport”.
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At the events I volunteer at BN and Starter are the two biggest divisions.
Not just marginally bigger than the others.
So my thought is this decision is just simple math.
The governing body sees a market to make money by making starter something that they control.
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I’m jump judging today we’re currently delayed by lightning but we have a preliminary division with two riders it’s really a shame that we can’t get more riders but I understand why that is but true to form all the money is in the division and the baby novice and the starter
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I was curious so I took a look. Area 1 Champs at GVRDC last month was a very strong turnout for WNY. Total number of entries broke out like this (total across each division - rider/horse/ch)
Area 1 Champs
Prelim: 9
Modified: 8
Training: 15
Novice: 44
BN: 42
Starter: 41
They ended up shifting the starter division showjumping to Saturday after dressage for timing purposes - doing all 150ish rounds on Sunday wasn’t going to work.
I know there’s a lot of conversation about this but we rarely see more than 3 entries per division above training around here, and maybe 6 per event at Training. Novice and below tend to draw the vast majority. We consistently see 25+ entries per weekend at starter. To me it only makes sense to recognize if the support is strong?
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I think this is an ongoing trend across disciplines though. When I was a kid the local unrecognized hunter shows typically went up to 3’3 or 3’6 for the juniors/adult/working divisions. Now the working hunters jump 3’ and often it has to be combined with 2’6 because it won’t fill. When I have taken (what I would consider green) horses I’ve sometimes been the only one at that height. Now the end goal is 2’6 for most people and it takes them several years to get there. Jumpers are the same way-- the 1 meter division has pretty much disappeared outside recognized shows and sometimes there are only a couple at 3’. The courses are no harder than they ever were and the horses are fancier so I’m not sure what the difference is.
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That is true, but I think that is a little different than what is happening here. BN’s objective is “to introduce a green horse or a green rider to the sport”. Instead of inserting a more friendly level below BN, they should be changing BN’s directive or addressing the level creep that is occurring in that division. Starter exists because BN has become a mini-Training course with bite sized jumps.
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Agreed.
I do like that starter does state that a ditch should have an option as well as the water should have an option. I feel like BN ditch’s should have options, but glad that it is being spelled out in starter. Hopefully course designers will follow the guidelines, since it doesn’t state “must”.
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Well here we are we’ve got 10 horses left after a two and a half hour delay this morning lightning has struck and so we’re on another delay
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Starter exists because BN has become a mini-Training course with bite sized jumps.
Disagree. BN XC is predominately friendly gallop jumps, with an occasional related distance of 5 strides, and sometimes a ditch, sometimes a small step up or down. I don’t see multiple related distances, or turning questions or terrain questions like you would for Training.
I LOVE when course designers use a but of the natural terrain and incorporate it at the lower levels. Great for the horse and rider to do that from the get go.
I had a rider at AECs for BN this year and it was very straightforward and appropriate.
(For reference, I am in Area II, so I can’t speak to what I have not seen outside my area)
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Today, we got through Dressage and Cross Country. There was a deluge at 9 am complete with lightening. It shut us down for about 2 hours. Then we went out and it was bright and sunny, (and humid!) for a couple of hours. Then hell descended on us. We had to stop again for lightning with 10 horses left to go. We all had to go back in and wait. The rain was furious and there was golf ball-sized hail! And you can imagine the mud. But they all got to go xc, and I think everyone was happy. Many more beginner novice and starter horses.
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AECs at BN this year was dumbed down considerably compared to the BN courses we regularly see in area 8.
Turning questions and related distances at 3 strides would be pretty standard.
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You aren’t even supposed to gallop at BN, so I am not sure if that is a typo and you meant canter fences?
I wouldn’t even call Training technical (I consider Prelim where things really get technical)- and FWIW, I’ve ridden both. In the last ten years BN has completely evolved and it has lost its original purpose - which was to introduce horses/riders to the sport. Is it because the level is now included in AECs? I don’t know - could be a part of it.
You used to be able to take a horse who had never seen XC before out on a recognized BN course and finish confidently. Now, I think that would be incredibly unkind to the horse. I’ve brought along every one of the horses I’ve owned and been the first person to school them XC, so I’ve seen how much the sport (and the levels) have changed in the last twenty years first hand. Some of it was sorely needed and for the better of the sport – but the level creep is not.
I wasn’t even referring to terrain in my post, but I am in Area 1 where terrain is plentiful and most people are used to it. What I’m referring to when I say “mini Training” is there are fence types and combinations at that level that aren’t always available to school at that level. Which is why riders get caught by surprise in championship - things like pseudo half-coffins, corners, fences or drops within 3 strides of water. These are things that are not easy to find in my area at BN height to school; if you want to jump a corner, you better be prepared to jump Training height at most venues here.
If posters wonder why I kvetch so much about this, it isn’t because I find BN difficult to navigate. It’s because I’m inceasingly seeing how difficult it is for first time eventers to get their toes wet and have a successful first outing without feeling discouraged or losing interest in the sport. If we want to keep the sport alive, we need to make the lower levels accessible to anyone and everyone who wants to try it, not just the well-off that can afford to buy a seasoned Novice or Training horse ready to step down that find BN a breeze.
For what it is worth, I heard the AECs this year for BN were much softer because of the carnage that happened at last year’s BN, which was a championship course to remember.
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I’m in Area VI and one BN course has a down bank 6 strides to a ramp. It is labeled individually, but I feel it is a huge ask for a pair just being introduced to eventing (which is supposedly what BN is). At another event you have a log (jumping into the Woods so it’s pretty spooky) going down relatively steep terrain to a max pile of logs. This is not inviting at all, in my opinion. I’m sure if I picked my brain I could come up with a bunch more examples, but the point is is it’s not all straight forward gallop fences with just one ditch related distance question.
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I think it’s a good path forward to standardize starter-here in Area 8 you have one organizer than runs it at 18” and untimed. Then those riders show at other shows where it is a mini-BN at 2’3 and brush to 2’7 and its carnage. But leaderboard standings and AEC qualifications seem a bit over kill.
I did BN at AECs this year and once I got over my “OMG MY FIRST CHAMPIONSHIP LEVEL COURSE” panic, I thought the course was very straightforward and didn’t ask anything particularly hard. Spring Bay was harder. No banks, nothing tricky, and not even a real ditch (which was the thing I was most worried about bc my horse had never seen a fake ditch until fence 6 at AECs). Weirdly right handed if anything (it felt like we kept turning right). There was one question that was quite unfair but the TD changed it. So I’m not sure how much simpler starter championships could be….
A few other things to consider why the lower levels are so much bigger is than the upper levels are a)at least here, run during the week which can be a challenge for those with careers or families and b)-the stakes get much bigger as you climb the levels. I’ve got two little kids, I’m not sure I want to ride at a level where my mistakes can have deadly consequences (yes I know anything can happen at any level but a miss at 2’7 is much different than a miss at 3’7 c) not ever horse can run the upper levels. Those horses are harder to find and are more expensive than your average lower level horse. I’ve got one in my barn-kind, willing, cute but not going to ever run anything above T (if that).
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If you repeatedly have obstacles less than 5 strides before the entry to water at BN your area needs new CDs and officials as not doing their jobs when they check courses. And you need a new rider rep if this has been brought up and nothing has changed. Appendix 1 of the Rules clearly state it is a must. I would be filing event evaluations with USEF.
Three strides (well as long as it measures at least 54’) out of the of the water is legal. Less than that, I’d also be chatting with the TD.
For what it’s worth, there was still carnage at AECs at BN on both XC and SJ even if the course was dumbed down. XC warm up for my division was downright scary at times. Unprepared is unprepared.
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As a permanent lower level rider my feelings have changed about this a few times. Do I appreciate the money grab at “just Starter”? No.
Do I appreciate Starter being more standardized? Yes!
Because Starter is unrecognized, shows can vary wildly. From 18 inch XC fences to a solid 2’ 5." You can’t always rely on the Omnibus, some are set to what they say, others are not. I’ve seen riders coming to different shows being very shocked that the fences are set to the height the Omnibus said they would. Were the riders unprepared and should they have believed the Omnibus? Totally. But it can be hard when other shows aren’t set to their Omnibus to make that call.
I’ve seen Starter fences 3 strides out from water (even if the water is an option, this can be an interesting “question” at the level.) BN has had level creep, SOME Starter has had level creep, with some trainers calling shows “starter Olympics” because it’s essentially a slightly smaller BN course. Starter is often the biggest division at shows so there is clearly a need and I think that a standard will help Organizers deal with a class of people they might not be familiar with who are spending the money. I’ve seen a level below Starter (my personal favorite) for those of us who just want a leisurely trot around some logs which shows more need, and evidence of Starter becoming more “legit” at some shows.
Today it’s hard to read the omnibus and make a decision, it seems that every show is “inviting for a first time out at the level” and the definition of this can really vary.
Regarding Starter AEC I don’t necessarily have an opinion about that one way or the other.
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Next there will be a lead line division.
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I think it’s easy to ignore the fact that the entry fee of lower level riders is the only reason many shows can afford to run Training and above. Make those riders feel unwelcome and you won’t have anymore shows.
Level creep, access to trainers that teach eventing, access to courses to school on, access to affordable horses with experience at the level, and the climbing expenses to even own horses have all lead to lower level divisions having a huge need.
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