Stubben Imperator?

[Blueeyedroan]

Check out this dinosaur of a saddle I just bought sight unseen!
I can only assume it’s an Imperator, due to the colour scheme. There’s no billet guards left on it and the padding is rock hard. I thought these were a “jumping” saddle but it seems like a pretty long and not so forward flap. Almost more AP?

My fat chunky horse and my thoroughbred are sharing a CWD with pro panels which does surprisingly well at working across both but if I take both to a clinic or show I can’t be switching saddles. I do not have the budget for another CWD or an Antares with the coveted AO tree.

So for the high price of $420 delivered I scored this cool old thing.
It’s rock solid. And the hard flocking isn’t great but I’m a hardcore half pad girlie with ever sheepskin you can imagine.
Going from a CWD to this is going to be painful but …… at least it’s cool looking?

Does anyone know much about these? It has the energy of being substantially older than I am.

[Posting_Trot]

I owned an Imperator (that I bought used) when my son was taking riding lessons on my horse and my saddle didn’t agree with him.

Imperators had the reputation at the time (this was 2010 or so) of being used as field hunt saddles by men in particular. I don’t know if that reputation was really justified or not, but I do know that my son (who was 13 at the time and about 5’9" and 140 lbs or so, all leg) found it comfortable for w-t-c, some trail-riding, and going over crossrails. I, on the other hand, found it not very comfortable.

I sold it when I son stopped riding at age 15, and I think I got more than I paid for it.

It’s one of those saddles that used to have a following such that, people who wanted a Stubben Imperator really wanted a Stubben Imperator and were willing to pay for it.

[NancyM]

As far as I know, from 50 years ago, these were considered the Rolls Royce of saddles… at least around here. I had a few friends who had one. “Rich friends”. I have a friend now who also has one… she was using it recently on a QH who jumped quite nicely. Too much padding for my liking, I like the old flat saddles, and have a collection of those. They also were built to last.
One thing about these older saddles… they were built to last. They do not “wear out” or “break” like so many of the expensive newer ones do. Anything that needs to be replaced or fixed is usually easy and affordable to do for a saddler with the knowledge.
If it suits you and fits your horse… you now own a classic treasure of a saddle.

[lolalola]

I have one, and I love it! I bought it on eBay 20 years ago and it was probably 20 years old at the time. Besides being rock solid, it doesn’t require as much cleaning as other leather saddles - it was designed that way. It’s one of my three Stubbens, the others being a Siegfried and a dressage saddle whose name escapes me.

[cayuse]

This is THE saddle I coveted back in the day. I hope you have many good rides in it.

[betonbill]

I remember when I bought my Imperator new from Miller’s back in the day (1970s) for a whopping $400-something. Rode in it for years and years, then mistakenly sold it. Same thing for my Parzival dressage saddle. Found another one at a used tack sale, barely used because the seller had another one that she rode in. The one I bought had been a trophy from "AJQHA Finals, Tulsa OK, Jumping, 1974). Rode in it until both the horse and I retired several years ago. Still have it.

[Kimstar]

I have one in my basement that is 52 years old this month. I believe it cost $450. Cdn. when bought new in 1973, just as major price increases were coming through due to inflation. I haven’t ridden in it in 10 years but it’s the last saddle I rode in before ceasing to ride due to my physical infirmities.

The Imperator has the same tree as the Sigfried, Parzival and Wotan models of that era and was termed an “all purpose with a jumping tendency” design. The leather of the brown inserts is called “sella” leather and is supposed to be extra grippy although I never found it much different. (The Parzival also used sella leather over its seat and flaps.) You have to be careful with the sella leather though as it will water spot very easily (eg: rain) but that’s easily rectified if you clean it carefully afterwards.

After I discovered “flat” saddles in the later 1970’s, my Imperator became a “back up” saddle as I too found it over-padded and a bit too bulky. I hated the calf rolls but they are easily “deflated” by a good saddler as the filling is only regular flocking. Also, I always found the flaps difficult to feel the horse through due to the inlaid padding in them. Difficult to really break in too. And if the panels are really too hard, you can always have them re-done but that costs a bit.

(For the record, the saddle you will have to pry out of my cold, dead hands is my Crosby Equilibrium - first generation that is pushing age 30. Beautiful leather and built to last like the Stubben, but much easier to get close to the horse when riding in it. LOVE that thing!)

ETA: I just remembered the other thing I wasn’t crazy over about the Imperator, and really many, many Stubbens: it puts you in a chair seat, even more so than many other jumping saddles.

[Equestrian24]

Yes, it’s an Imperator, and those are gorgeous saddles! I don’t know a ton about these, but I’d definitely say it’s likely '70s era, either made in Germany or Switzerland. Definitely extremely high quality!

I’d definitely call it a jumping saddle, though an old school one. My definition of “all purpose” has always been the more dressage/jump combo types with the long, straighter flaps, like the Crosby Lexington T.C. or Collegiate Senior Event, though it seems anything with a round cantle that isn’t a dressage saddle is typically referred to as an all purpose now. Kind of like how there are plenty of “close contacts” with tons of blocks and padding, though in my mind, “close contact” means just that, close contact, which I think of as a rather flat, minimalist saddle.

Personally, I’ve never ridden in a French saddle or anything like them, and have ridden in older saddles my entire life, so I’m used to these and find them comfortable. My experience is that as long as the twist and general shape and width of the seat are right for the rider, a saddle can still be comfortable without the extra padding. I have old Courbettes that are a lot like this saddle in build that I find very comfortable (though I do layer ThinLine and Mattes seat savers for longer trail rides since I don’t have much padding of my own and can get sore seat bones after sitting long enough in just about any saddle), but I also have an ancient Crosby PDN with a very narrow, flat seat that unfortunately really bothers me if I do much sitting in it. My late '90s Crosby Sovereign is not like that, however. The seat and panels are wider, and it has just a bit of padding in the seat.

I’ve noticed that these still go for quite a bit on eBay, even more so than other Stübbens of a similar era. I’ve never ridden in one, but like the Siegfried-type saddles that are similar in build to these a lot.

[Blueeyedroan]

If you ever want to part with it I’d be interested!

[Kimstar]

I’m in Canada, so that might be difficult right now!

ETA: It’s also an 18" seat.

[Blueeyedroan]

I’m in Canada too!!! Haha .