Talk me through the buying process

[Miss-O]

Hi everyone,

I’ve been a horse owner since I was a teen, but I’ve recently entered the horse market to buy a new horse, as my mare is now older. This is my first time being in charge of the buying process. I’m going to go look at a new horse soon and I’m wondering what the buying process looks like if I end up liking it. I realize I would have to put down a deposit to do the prepurchase exam. There would be a trial period and then pay the full purchase price if that works out. The owner is willing to refund the deposit if it doesn’t work out. How do I pay the deposit to give me the best chance of getting the money back if it doesn’t work out? (ex Cash, cashier check, personal check??) I realize we would need a contract. The owner doesn’t have one but is willing to look one over if I find it. Any suggestions?

With a trial period, is it better to do a lease and then buy? I found a contract that looks like it would work for us, but it has lease to buy language, not pay a deposit and then pay in full after a trial.

[conniemary]

Deposits are normally not refundable. The seller is taking the horse off the market for you to do PPE and trial, so the deposit compensates them for that if the sale falls through.

Trials are tricky. If you have ridden one horse most of your life it may take you a while to adjust to a new one. This could take longer than a trial period.

[OfCourseItsAnAlter]

It is increasingly rare these days to be able to do a trial. I’ve got a horse for sale right now and I would never allow him to go on trial unless it was with a trainer I know well and trust. The risk just isn’t worth it.

I’ve had a couple of PPEs done recently and in neither case did the seller ask for a deposit to hold the horse. However, I scheduled the PPEs immediately after I finished riding the horses and the vet was able to come out the following day, so maybe that was why.

Whether or not the deposit is refundable is between you and the seller and whatever you agree to in the contract you sign when the deposit is made. If you asked me to hold a horse for more than a couple of days so you can get the PPE done by some specific preferred vet and you then decide not to buy for a reason other than the discovery in the PPE of some significant issue unknown to me previously, I would not be inclined to refund your deposit.

[IronwoodFarm]

The market is going to be different from when the OP last purchased Used to be that a buyer would look at several horses. Maybe come back for a second ride or have the trainer ride. Do an off property trial and a PPE. Then decided whether to buy or return the horse. Oh and little travel was involved.

It has changed a good bit especially if you want a specific breed or level of training/experience. Supply is short for many of these type of horses and prices are up significantly. The search can be regional if not national. You need to ride once and make a decision if you want to PPE. I sell horses. Generally I don’t bother with a deposit if the PPE is scheduled quickly but the horse is not off the market… I will take back-up buyers. No trials off property and if on property it will not be a long one. I actually do like a PPE because I can’t see everything but the PPE is a take it or leave it deal. There is not going to be lots of haggling.

My only caveat is that I don’t know what the war in Ukraine will have on sales. When the stock market and the economy get bumpy some buyers drop out. There might be more motivated sellers. I primarily sell foals and I’m savvy with a mid-range price point that keeps the bottom feeders out but allows “regular” folks to purchase. I am not aiming for the top end of my market. When I do get a trained adult horse that horse goes super fast because the breed is uncommon.

When it comes to contracts; it’s my contract not the buyer’s contract. The buyer can negotiate but no way will I accept the buyer writing the contract. Deposits are negotiable, just remember it can’t be all one-sided. Don’t expect to tie a horse up in a sale and ultimately say no without the seller wanting compensation her time and effort.

Personally I never want to sell a horse to someone who doesn’t want it. I have had buyers change their mind and I have refunded deposits in the past. I always put the best interest of the horse first. No horse goes to someone who does not want it. However the converse applies too. I will decline to sell a horse to someone who wants it because I think the fit is bad. I have had more than one person angry with me for saying no.

[Vyce]

I’m guessing trials are rather rare/ uncommon these days? I’ve never owned. I’m on my second lease horse and looking to purchase my first horse hopefully in a year or so, so I’m interested in this thread. Sorry I don’t have any helpful info OP, but I’m learning a few things from this thread so thanks for posting. The only buying experience I have is one of the barn trainers telling me when I’m ready to buy come talk to her and she’ll help me. And several boarders telling me to go see Trainer when it’s horse shopping time since she helped them. (And I know there’s fees involved but I’d like a more knowledgeable eye than mine when picking out an equine).

[fivestrideline]

As above, trials are exceedingly rare. A lease to purchase deal is a more common way to achieve the same goal. I’m surprised a seller considering a trial is insisting on a deposit to do a PPE, but maybe I’m missing something.
These days if you don’t buy off the ad sight unseen it’s 1. go test ride horse 2. decide if you want to PPE or pass before leaving the barn THAT DAY 3. schedule PPE, potentially place deposit (usually check form with a contract saying “deposit refundable only if horse fails PPE” or something similar, sometimes it’s not refundable but you can always ask) 4. have PPE done and pass or purchase horse

[soloudinhere]

I have a horse in right now that came to me for a very affordable price because in the course of a 5 day trial, someone basically ruined him. He came back headshy, completely afraid of people, and refusing jumps, totally not trusting of people. The owners ended up having to firesale him because they were not equipped to deal with a horse who now had trust issues. Too bad, sweet horse. And basically no recourse for his owners.

so, that’s to say - trials are rare. Maybe between people who know each other or in the same barn where the care can be supervised. But I’d never send one on trial to someone else’s barn.

So the process is: book trial ride as soon as is feasible. Try horse. Decide whether to place deposit. Place deposit and make agreement on what the terms of deposit refund are. Schedule vetting. Decide on results of vetting within a reasonable time after receiving results/reports. Wire funds to complete purchase.

[IronwoodFarm]

Another reason trials are rare is because horses act like horses. A new setting can be very disruptive to a horse and the chance of injury or worse is significant. Not saying it happens all the time, but it happens enough and especially when care instructions are not followed. I tell people wanting a trial that is fine but I want a mortality and a loss of use policy purchased by them with me being the beneficiary. That way I am protected. If they keep the horse then cancel the coverage for a short rate refund. Or change the beneficiary to themselves. Can’t afford to buy insurance – then you can’t afford to take the horse.

[clanter]

@IronwoodFarm

Another reason trials are rare is because horses act like horses. A new setting can be very disruptive to a horse and the chance of injury or worse is significant.

we had one horse that it took three or four weeks of loading him into the trailer then drive around some (by the end his favorite stop was the doughnut shop who always had an apple fritter waiting for him)

This horse had been rapidly though several flipper owners hands, he just assumed he was here temporally until we proved to him that when loaded on the trailer he was coming back to his paddock

[soloudinhere]

Sadly, after experiencing this horse and his behavior, I probably wouldn’t even allow mortality and loss of use - this horse is still rideable and usable, but he is no longer competitive in his original discipline. A loss of use policy probably would not have paid out.

[IronwoodFarm]

I agree Soloudinhere. I have never had anyone willing to purchase the insurance. Basically nothing leaves my property unless paid in full and sold. I also buy the same way - no trials; just pay for the horse and take my chances I bought 3 horses that way last year.

[Punkie]

The only trials I see these days are lease to own deals where your lease fee goes towards the purchase price of the horse but is 100% non-refundable.

I recently purchased* two new horses more or less on the same day. I posted an ISO ad in my (very horsey) area with specific criteria and a very reasonable budget for the ask. I had about 20 replies within the first few hours and by the end of the day, I’d made 3 days worth of appointments to see my top 6 contenders. I knew within 5 minutes of sitting on the first horse that he was the one, but I kept an appointment to see the second one because his video was extremely promising. I was not disappointed with horse number 2 and decided that I was going to bite the bullet and vet both. I did not put down a deposit on either though I offered as I was able to book vettings within 24 hours. Findings on horse one were on par with a horse of his age and experience level and I signed the check and the bill of sale at the clinic. Findings on horse two were very unexpected and while it didn’t put him out of contention, I had a very frank conversation with the owner and ended up having a 120 day “out” contract if a specific intervention that was deemed necessary either a) failed or b) caused significant behavioral changes (hence the asterisk). I would not recoup any of my costs to care for him or provide this intervention, but she would hold my check and I could return him at any point within those 120 days and get my check back. Very, very unusual but then again so was the situation. We’re about halfway through the contractual period and so far, so good, so I’m very hopeful.

In a nutshell, know your budget, have a vet in mind (particularly if you’re looking in an area outside of your home base), and be prepared to move on the horse quickly. The horse we bought almost immediately met a very specific niche (dead quiet, puppy dog personality, happy to do the x-rail job, but competitive at the 3’ level in all three rings to go to a forever home) and I knew the farm he was from and the reputation of the trainer so I had zero questions about suitability and his show record spoke for itself. The second horse was a total wildcard that piqued my interest solely based on breeding and I was gobsmacked by the video. Total freak of nature and an obscene amount of raw talent. I had no need to see either horse twice, but the offer stood with both owners if I wanted to try either a second time. You may or may not find this to be true.

Good luck, it’s a wild shopping world out there!!

[clanter]

@Punkie

I knew the farm he was from

we have a nearly twenty year relationship with a breeding ranch that is over one thousand miles away … we know each other through the horses purchased which makes buying less problematic for both parties, all horses have been more than what was expected.

[Tha_Ridge]

@Punkie

The only trials I see these days are lease to own deals where your lease fee goes towards the purchase price of the horse but is 100% non-refundable.

Yep. I have one out on a six-week deal like this at the moment. Luckily, they love her (and it’s with a trainer/program I trust) but I made sure they paid a decent chunk that still makes it worth my while if she comes home.

On the lower-priced horses (sub-$15), I will ask for a deposit, applicable to purchase price, to hold for PPE. Reason being that I’m more likely to have a buyer come along and buy off video or sans-PPE in that price range. For my horses in the upper-five figures, they get tried less often so I don’t mind holding them for a week while waiting for a PPE.

[Spudsmyguy]

I sent my horse out on trial when I was planning to sell him and asked for the full purchase price in a cashiers check that I would hold for the trial period. I also sent along my tack and took plenty of pictures of it so just in case it was damaged they would reimburse me (in the contract). I even delivered him down to their barn for free which was about 1-1/2 hours away. I got an update the next day that they had a good ride on him and posted a picture that showed a smiling girl and a relaxed, happy horse. The next day I get a text that he wasn’t going to work for them that they had a terrible ride and girl was upset. I went down there to pick him up and they were evasive about what it was that he did so horribly wrong. Never did find out and the trainer wasn’t around to ask her. So in about 24 hours they determined the horse was not for them instead of calling me and asking about this behavior. I was completely honest with them from the get go so it would have been helpful to know what was happened so I could address it. No more trials from now on. They can come ride twice and then either have a PPE or not with intent to buy.

As an aside, I don’t know where any of you are that your vet is available to do a PPE within 24 hours, my vet would have to be scheduled out at least a week.