Talk to me about silks

[Glimmerglass]

A curious question with silks - are certain ones forever protected/retired regardless if the owner has passed away or hasn’t put a horse on the track in decades?

Example, there were silks that were used by a family long ago but after the passing of the owner, prior to 1960, the were never seen again. Would they be prevented from being registered again? Is there a rule akin to horses names whereby if a graded stakes victory is achieved the name (or silks in this case) cannot be claimed by another unrelated person/party/stable?

Some quick searching did show, that the famed Howard stables (Seabiscuit) colors did re-appear in 2004 despite Charles having long passed away. In that case it was at Bay Meadows - and the jockey wearing them aboard, Chief Truckee, was due to the fact he was owned by Howard’s great grandson Kittridge Collins.

However if someone wanted to file for use of the colors of Samuel Riddle is that hands-off?

[LaurieB]

In most states, owners can simply make any kind/color/pattern of silks that they want and use them. I believe there are only two jurisdictions–NY and FL–where silks have to be approved and registered. So in other places, it’s not uncommon to see several owners using the same silks, or ones that are very similar.

Since there’s no central registry, it’s almost impossible to know what colors and patterns have already been used, or are currently in use, so most people just design something they like and go with it.

[Glimmerglass]

[QUOTE=LaurieB;6444451]
Since there’s no central registry, it’s almost impossible to know what colors and patterns have already been used, or are currently in use, so most people just design something they like and go with it.[/QUOTE]

Thanks Laurie. Sounds like another segment the “Horse Racing Commissioner” (or the Government) can have control of

This 2010 article suggests the Jockey Club is the keeper (and registrar) of records for New York State with silks and stable names.

Silks designs generally are not regulated around the country. But if owners expect to race a horse in New York, whether on a cold winter’s day at Aqueduct or in June in the Belmont Stakes, they must register the silks with the Jockey Club. And that will lead them to an office where Lee Weil and Mary Keiser sit.

“Blue and white stripes,” Keiser said over the phone to someone in the Color Room, describing a stable’s design. “White sleeves. Blue hoop. O.K.?”

The Jockey Club has registered silks for more than 100 years. On a recent day, Keiser held the application for No. 31,632. But there is little fear of running out of design combinations.

[i]By registering stable names and silks with The Jockey Club, an owner is guaranteed exclusive use of the stable name and silks design when racing Thoroughbreds in New York State.

However, owners who race horses in other states are welcome to, and often do, register their stable name and silks with The Jockey Club as well. [/i]

http://home.jockeyclub.com/silks.asp

Silks Registration Fees:
First-time silks registration - $100
One-year silks registration renewal - $25
Five-year silks registration renewal - $100

The rules of what you can/cannot do (in NY) appears to be more “tight”

1. Front and back of silks must be identical, except for seam design.

2. Colors must be registered in the name of one person only; NOT a stable name or Mr. & Mrs. (example: Mary E. Jones).
3. Designs are limited to those on the reverse side of this form.
4. Navy blue is NOT an available color.
5. A maximum of two colors is allowed on the jacket and two on the sleeves for a maximum of four colors.
6. These colors will be renewable on December 31st of the year they are registered.
7. You may have an acceptable emblem or up to three initials on the ball, yoke, circle or braces design. You may have one initial on
   the opposite shoulder of the sash design, the box frame, or the diamond.

[LaurieB]

Those JC/NY restrictions you’ve posted are the reason why you often see horses at Saratoga racing in “house silks”. Owners who are only planning to race sporadically in NY usually don’t bother to register, they just use the track colors instead.

[Drvmb1ggl3]

Every year the BHA auctions off the rights to certain “Distinctive and Cherished Racing Colours”, notable silks that have fallen out of registration.

http://www.britishhorseracing.com/goracing/racing/newsweather/features/dynamicImages/bonhams%20cherish%20cols%20ad_024.pdf
http://www.britishhorseracing.com/colours/colours-sale.pdf
http://www.britishhorseracing.com/goracing/racing/colours_auction.pdf

Some of them bring hefty sums of money. Sue Magnier paid something close to $100,000 for the dark blue silks often seen on Coolmore horses.
Godolphin paid a significant chunk of change for the sky blue silks they wear, though they bought those privately. Interestingly, Godolphin horses when running in NY state wear a sky blue with white bands on the arms, so someone else must have the all-sky blue registered with the JC.

[Glimmerglass]

[QUOTE=Drvmb1ggl3;6444738]
Interestingly, Godolphin horses when running in NY state wear a sky blue with white bands on the arms, so someone else must have the all-sky blue registered with the JC.[/QUOTE]

One would think they could convince the registrant in NY to yield - for a price - those colors to Godolphin.

I still think there would be visit from MI5 if someone tried to run purple body with scarlet sleeves and gold braiding, with a black velvet cap having gold fringe. at say Monmouth Park (HRH The Queen is the only owner, in England, permitted to have gold braid on silks and cap.)

[CVPeg]

There’s also a lot of restrictions in NY. I looked into it last summer when registering a stable. We had lovely ideas, but they limit you to just two colors on the body, unless you wish to place your design within a circle on the body of the silks, but then the design is hard to discern IMO. And of course, the JC still has to approve the silks. I had the impression they’d rather you not be too close to well known or identified silks.

[Linny]

The late Paul Mellon had gold braid on his silks.
I tend to see more colorful silks (and tack) in Florida than any other venue. California also seems to allow more colorful patterns.

[Drvmb1ggl3]

Paul Mellon had different silks on either side of the Atlantic. The Grey with Yellow sleeves and braiding used stateside, and the Black with Gold cross seen on the likes of Mill Reef.

[equine08]

I’m dating myself here but I thought the Jockey Club when it was still based in NY allowed permanent registration of silks for a substantial fee. I recall that Mr. de Kwiatowski (who purchased Calumet) was allowed to purchase the right to use the Calumet colors as his stable silks.

In searching for the answer for you, I came across pix and info re some Calumet racing memorabilia which was for sale after trainer Jimmy Jones death. There are pix of training and race bridles. Most unusual is the “Mexican Bit” used on colts. There is a 1959 pix at Arl Park with Ben&Jim Jones on horseback accompanying an exercise rider who appears to be about 12 years old, riding a colt depicting this bit. Unknown to me was that Ben & Jim Jones both raced at the track in Juarez. There is a short anecdote of how the wiley Jim was able to save his best horse at the time when Pancho Villa and his men were
ride into the track seizing black horses. Jones outfoxed PV by making his horse appear dead lame.

Almost everything on the page is marked “sold.” My intent in posting the link is in the historical significance and I hope does not violate the TlOS for commercialism.

Page with links to specific memorabilia.

http://www.racehorseherbal.com/Memorabilia/memorabilia.html

Page with pics at Arlington 1959 & Mexican Bit:

http://www.racehorseherbal.com/Memorabilia/Bit/bit.html

[Glimmerglass]

[QUOTE=equine08;6445647]
I recall that Mr. de Kwiatowski (who purchased Calumet) was allowed to purchase the right to use the Calumet colors as his stable silks.[/QUOTE]

This has been a relatively interesting debate as of late. There were widespread articles this spring suggesting that Brad Kelley, who had just bought Calumet was going to run his horse, Optimizer, in the Derby with the famed devil red silks. He didn’t and I’m rather confident in saying because the stable didn’t have the rights to the Calumet silks.

Following the bankruptcy - and prior to deK’s purchase of the farm - the Calumet silks were purchased by Brazil-based TNT Stud. Both parties appeared to use them although on the track only TNT Stud used them. I suspect NYS/Jockey Club only recognizes TNT Stud having the right unless Brad Kelley has worked out a deal since his farm purchase.

The Brazilian-based stable Stud TNT acquired them (actually Gonzalo Borges Torrealba purchased the rights) and when they do race in the US they’re used.

Per Equibase Stud TNT’s last US runner was in 2010. They have a partnership - Live Oak Plantation and Stud TNT - which just announced 4-18-12 that Drosselmeyer, winner of the 2011 Breeders’ Cup Classic (G1), will stand at TNT Stud in Bage, Brazil for the Southern Hemisphere season.

[Elly_Mae_II]

“4. Navy blue is NOT an available color.”

Why no navy blue?

[CVPeg]

[QUOTE=Elly Mae II;6449330]
“4. Navy blue is NOT an available color.”

Why no navy blue?[/QUOTE]

My memory has been known to be faulty, but seems to me this came up last year when I was chatting with them in their office at the Spa, and they said something about it being so close to black you couldn’t tell the difference.

[jennywho]

There is an exception to the NY rules in stakes races, not sure if it’s just graded races or all of them. Some friends rn a mare there a few years back thinking they would have to run in house silks, but because it was a stakes they were allowed to use their own even though they didn’t meet the rules.

[Bacchus]

CVPeg is correct about navy blue – too close to black.

[Las_Olas]

[QUOTE=LaurieB;6444451]
I believe there are only two jurisdictions–NY and FL–where silks have to be approved and registered. [/QUOTE]

None in FL. We can use whatever.