Talk to me of quitting riding "for now" and financial planning?

[Scaramouch]

I’m at a weird place where I’ve decided to basically turn my two older TBs out to retire on my parents’ property and not immediately look for a new horse.

This is partly because I’ve been stretched to the limit financially supporting them both, and I’m not even riding them lately. They’ve always been quirky individuals and now that they’re 19 and 22 they have enough physical things going on that it’s just not worth pouring money into vetting so I can have frustrating horses to ride.

I think I’m partly burnt out, but I still get excited thinking about putting more of my resources into something younger/fancier. That’ s not something I can realistically afford at the moment, so I’m planning to take at least another six months to a year off, maybe more.

At this point I am not on a career trajectory to ever have a six-figure income barring a significant shift. And while I love big, athletic types I have not had much luck competitively with my TBs for a lot of reasons I won’t get into. So I realize that I am going to have to step back for a while if I ever want to buy the horse I want (vs. the horse I can afford). But the good news is that if I start socking away everything I’m spending on board now, I should be in a position to do that while I’m still in my 30s.

What I don’t want to do is take a few months off and buy an OTTB in a moment of weakness. I may very well end up with another TB, but I want to give myself the option of something purpose bred and well-started.

So I want to set goals to create some kind of accountability. So my question is, for my fellow middle-income folks, what kind of “safety net” did you establish before buying again, or for the first time?

Those of you who have had to save up for a horse purchase that might have been at the edge of your comfort zone (is this a thing or am I insane to even consider it?) did you also establish an emergency fund? Based on expenses for a certain period or based on what you were spending on the horse? Of course I’d insure anything I spend more than $10K on, but there’s still the just-plain-imprudence of planning to potentially spend mid-5s on an animal when a colic surgery would constitute a financial gut check.

I’m also wondering if taking weekly lessons would help or hurt. It might help in terms of maintaining muscle memory, but I think poking around on lesson horses might be more frustrating than not riding at all? Frustrating to the point I’m more likely to impulse buy a horse I can afford vs. a horse I want… So if anyone has experiences making that transition from being “all in” to just lessoning for a while I’d love to hear how that’s worked out for you!

[paw]

Hmm. If your intention is to save up for the horse you really want (and yes, that includes a built-in cushion for emergencies), paying for lessons will only make that process longer. However, you might ask around in your network to see if there are folks who need their horses ridden - you wouldn’t be lessoning, but you could still get saddle time. Just a thought.

[FitToBeTied]

Based on what you are writing, you are in your 20’s. This is the time to really save money and invest, not for the purpose of buying a horse but for long term financial security. When your salary can support it, after saving and investing 10% of your income, then go look for a horse.

[Foxglove]

As the parent/grandparent who has the farm where kids and grandkid send their horses to retire, please be aware of what you are asking of older people. Currently I have two retired and two not retired horses living here. It would be half the daily work and at least half the money to just have my two. Older horses often require special feed, supplements, shoes, blankets and stabling. You are asking parents to do that FOR FREE with no benefit of use of the horses. I do look after the two retired horses because one that belonged to my granddaughter is my husband (non riding) special pet. DH looks after all horses when I am away. Fair trade. Second horse from DD 3Day training program was a strong candidate for a very short retirement stay as he is extremely high maintenance, scared me to death to handle him, and took me six months to finally get the courage up to sit on his back. Had he reacted any way but perfectly under saddle, he would have had no home with me and doubtful he could find another place.

My point is, don’t saddle ur parents with ur retirement horses unless u PAY for the care or there is some possibility parents will enjoy the horse. The 3Day horse and I are doing well together, but he is still expensive and high maintenance. I was content riding my two and competing and hunting with them. Luckily for the 3Day horse he found a place in my heart and in my program.

[clanter]

@Scaramouch

did you also establish an emergency fund?

well that is sort of like the construction quote for a barn as what it actually comes to is two to three times what the actual cost will be…and even so that could be short. (last fall we had a horse break a leg, upon reviewing the xrays the upper cannon bone was shattered vet said if it could be repaired the lay up would be at least a year, they just released one who had a similar fracture… vet said the cost was over $100,000

We have set aside what many people could retire upon (at least that is what our finical advisor said three weeks ago) but a $100k vet bill was not in the cards

[chestnutmarebeware]

I wish I could like this post more than once! I’m older than you, but also have two horses, both retired. I still full-board them, but even if my fragile flowers could thrive in a pasture-retirement situation (they couldn’t) I would still be paying more every month just for their feed, vet bills and other special-snowflake needs now than I did when they were younger.

Expecting others to take on that work costs money, and I hope you’ll be paying it. And I hope your relatives are up to providing the daily care your horses will need.

[Displaced_Yankee]

@Scaramouch

So I want to set goals to create some kind of accountability. So my question is, for my fellow middle-income folks, what kind of “safety net” did you establish before buying again, or for the first time?

Those of you who have had to save up for a horse purchase that might have been at the edge of your comfort zone (is this a thing or am I insane to even consider it?) did you also establish an emergency fund? Based on expenses for a certain period or based on what you were spending on the horse? Of course I’d insure anything I spend more than $10K on, but there’s still the just-plain-imprudence of planning to potentially spend mid-5s on an animal when a colic surgery would constitute a financial gut check.

So in reading this section, it sounds like you are exclusively talking about “horse expenses”. What about you? Are you well established in housing, vehicle, and a career that you plan to stay in for the next few years? Or are waiting tables through school or want to buy a house or need a vehicle upgrade?

Most personal financial planning articles, classes, etc suggest you maintain at least 3 months of personal expenses in an emergency fund. 6 months would be better, but isn’t always feasible. I include my horse’s feed, board, farrier + a little extra for routine vet calls in my emergency fund budget. I wasn’t always able to do that. When I started it was food, gas, rent, and utilities. That’s all I could save at the time.

I have my emergency fund account (where funds are easily accessible) and a second savings account where we are putting all of our extra funds. We were planning on using this for a down payment on a house…but you know…the housing market and all. But two separate savings accounts would give you a clear standing of “emergency funds” and “savings”, instead of keeping everything in one account. The same concept could apply to you. Instead of “house funds” you have buy-a-horse funds"

But seriously…if you are going to take a giant step back from horses then use this time to get yourself organized first. Then the hobby.

[Jackie_Cochran]

Regarding lesson horses.

Lesson horses are wonderful horses. I used to have my own horses, can’t now because of my MS, and I found a hunt seat barn with lesson horses.

EVERY lesson horse I’ve mounted has had gaping holes the size of the Grand Canyon in their basic training. If I was just plodding around on these horses at their preferred 2MPH walk I would not have lasted long because of boredom.

So I work on filling these gaping holes in their training, I call it working on the ABCs. Basic things like taking good contact, correct responses to a single leg aid, three speeds withing a gait, practicing turning using different turning aids each time, working the horse at a slight diagonal, responding to the action of the bit, etc… Because of my MS I only walk and trot right now.

Yes I miss my more finely tuned horses, but as long as I am humane and I time my leg, hand and seat aids accurately I find that even jaded lesson horses can start to take an interest in our rides. I have to carry a crop or it is a 2 MPH trudge, but I mostly use the crop on MY leg, it is the sound that gets the sharp response. Wearing spurs also helps, I use the Spursuaders which are very gentle, humane spurs that the horses don’t seem to mind but listen to quite well.

[Scaramouch]

@Foxglove

My point is, don’t saddle ur parents with ur retirement horses unless u PAY for the care or there is some possibility parents will enjoy the horse.

I wasn’t even considering this until my dad replaced all the post-and-rail on his property (no livestock on it currently) and started asking when I’m sending the horses home, since he knows I’m not riding, every time I talk to him. He did recently have a knee replaced and I guess he feels like a new person. I will continue to handle and pay for vet/farrier and senior feed for the hard keeper gelding. Of course holding off on adding a horse for now gives us room to reassess in a few months if it isn’t working out on either end. Both horses are easy to handle on the ground and live out 24/7 year-round. I worked off the gelding’s board at another barn until six months ago and the mare is on self-care so I am far from unaware of what I’m asking.

The farm owner where the gelding is pasture boarded is older than my parents and I had to talk her into raising board 25 percent because I could do the math and know she was losing money. Also I think recent threads on this forum will bear out that many people boarding their horses are in fact being subsidized by the barn owner so it’s hard for me to feel to guilty about the prospect of my dad helping me since he seems more than willing to do so.

@Displaced_Yankee

What about you? Are you well established in housing, vehicle, and a career that you plan to stay in for the next few years? Or are waiting tables through school or want to buy a house or need a vehicle upgrade?

@FitToBeTied

This is the time to really save money and invest, not for the purpose of buying a horse but for long term financial security. When your salary can support it, after saving and investing 10% of your income, then go look for a horse.

These are solid general questions and advice, but I feel reasonably well situated. My investments are valued at 3-4x my annual income (granted, that isn’t much), my husband and I own our home and we intend to remain childfree. So I have the luxury of devoting most of what I do make to my hobby. We may also be relocating in the next year or two when DH leaves the military, so I will almost certainly be doing some career reevaluation at that point. In the short-term I want to put myself in a position where I can get back into riding, wherever we end up, in a more comfortable financial position.

[clanter]

@Displaced_Yankee

and a second savings account where we are putting all of our extra funds. We were planning on using this for a down payment on a house

suggestion only but look into US Treasury I Bonds… current interest rate is 9.62%

https://www.treasurydirect.gov/indiv/research/indepth/ibonds/res_ibonds_ifaq.htm#:~:text=NEWS%3A%20The%20initial%20interest%20rate,that%20rate%20through%20October%202022.

[clanter]

@Scaramouch

Both horses are easy to handle on the ground and live out 24/7 year-round.

having just come in from spending two hours cleaning my daughters horses pastures, just because they are outside does not mean there less to do

Being a Dad of horse crazy girls I accept their horses as it makes them (the girls) happy but moving 140 pound bales of hay around does make wonder if they just stuck to cats it may be easier (we have their two cats also)

[Calvincrowe]

I’m a middle-income (well, now near the end of my teaching career, that has risen but for my area, let’s call it middle) amateur. I think you should take a break. Send those boys to retire-- your costs will drop dramatically! Support your parents financially for their upkeep, as you plan. Put aside a veterinary fund for them, as well.

Now, your own finances for future horse purchases: Do you want young and lots of potential or are you thinking of buying a more going horse? What level and frequency of showing are you considering? What price point are you considering-- $20K or $80K? Hack winner/Derby horse or solid brain, but not fancy?

I’ve always been able to buy and then sell well, as I moved up the ladder. I’ve never been one to show on the A circuit-- one to three A shows a year with lots of fun B or C shows thrown in are good for me. Happy to be a little fish swimming successfully in the smaller pond, thanks. I’ve also worked with my trainer as they’ve found me some real gems who weren’t cutting it at some big A show/traveling show barns (some minor maintenance issues, stepping down, etc.).

And if you do find a horse, buy insurance! It will be well worth it. As to an emergency fund, I always have a credit card with a zero balance ready for such events, as well as keeping no less than $10K in savings for emergencies of any kind, house, health or horse. Keep building your personal savings/investments. I recommend working with a financial planner now, while you have time to create those funds for your future.

[anon40672407]

When I was younger, and had actually changed jobs in order to accommodate a competition schedule (only to have that competition horse go south!) I had, at one point, a handful of money that I could spend on the next horse: one with some training and experience, even. It was exciting to shop up and down the coast for my next partner, but when it came right down to it, I couldn’t make myself pull the trigger.

I’d had enough horses go lame or prove unsuitable in some way prior to my financial windfall that I just couldn’t make myself spend that much cash on a fragile hay burner because it was too risky. I wound up spending half on a green bean with excellent gaits, and working on him. He competed with my daughter, but I never wound up getting to take him anywhere personally (self fulfilling prophesy some would say).

So, there’s one country heard from.

On the other subject of schoolies and lessons: Now, over 30 years later, I have kept my hand in by riding at some barns that offered many different mounts with different problems, which widened my tool kit. I have been lucky enough to find a couple fabulous competition horses available for half lease if I wanted (I’m no longer interested in competitions). My point being – if you are going to be ready when the made horse comes along, whether lease or purchase, being in sharp riding shape is always a good idea.

And lease is always better: you don’t own the risk anymore.

[Bluey]

Those looking at buying or selling, if we go into a troubled economy, for whatever reason and most predictors are going there now, sellers are better selling now, buyers holding up a bit.

If inflation makes prices higher for much, it may not for luxuries like horses are.
If things get tight, horses should drop in price, inflation or not.

It is smart for OP at this time to wait it out, chances are of cheaper horses more than lost opportunity to buy at a reasonable price for whatever may happen.

[Displaced_Yankee]

@Scaramouch

These are solid general questions and advice, but I feel reasonably well situated.

Ok, that makes your original post make so much more sense. I hope you know that I wasn’t trying to be nosey…I just think that many people put their passion before important things like…health insurance lol.

I still advocate for a horsey emergency fund, then save for a purchase. Even just the bare minimum of a few months’ board, supplements, farrier. You can continue to build it up at any point if his care or training requires more $$$.

On the subject of lessons: as one person noted, it will slow down how much you are saving. However, before I had my horse I took a few lessons at a reputable barn. After two lessons the trainer said “I can already tell you have maxed out the capabilities of my lesson horses but let me connect you with Jane. She has a nice horse but doesn’t ride as much as she wants to. Maybe she will let you take lessons on him.” It worked out. I pitched in for farrier or chiro and took lessons. These sorts of informal half leases are much easier when they happen organically IMO. But you have to be “in” at a barn to get there lol.

[Displaced_Yankee]

@clanter

suggestion only but look into US Treasury I Bonds… current interest rate is 9.62%

One of the partners at the CPA firm that I work for also manages the investments for our high net worth clients. As a perk, we get financial planning for free.

We discussed mine and Mr Yankee’s plans and I asked “where can I put $XX dollars to maximize earnings, but keep it safe at the safe time?” His response: “If I knew where to put $10,000 to earn money and not lose value, don’t you think I would tell all of our clients? Keep it where it is”

I am going to stay the course with the plan we developed with him. He knows our goals and plans.

[Scaramouch]

@Calvincrowe

Now, your own finances for future horse purchases: Do you want young and lots of potential or are you thinking of buying a more going horse? What level and frequency of showing are you considering? What price point are you considering-- $20K or $80K? Hack winner/Derby horse or solid brain, but not fancy?

Ideally I would like that kind of “unicorn” that everyone wants. 5-8 years old, schooling if not competing at Novice/Training (eventing) fancy enough to be competitive in dressage with potential for more. Right now the horses I lust after window shopping range from around $35-50K with the higher end being imports. Of course who knows what the market will be like in a couple of years.

@anon40672407

I’d had enough horses go lame or prove unsuitable in some way prior to my financial windfall that I just couldn’t make myself spend that much cash on a fragile hay burner because it was too risky.

It’s definitely occurred to me that when it comes down to buying at that level I might be constitutionally incapable of spending that money on a horse… but if I start thinking too far down that path I circle back to “if that’s going to be the case I might as well just get something off-the-track.” That’s part of the reason I want to realize a savings goal before horse shopping is even on the table. Hopefully as saving (and not blowing money on board every month) becomes habitual I’ll eventually be emotionally invested in keeping that going vs. buying a horse in the short-term.

[horsepooramateur]

Following this with serious interest as I am in the EXACT same boat (plus the added complication of wanting to add a human baby to the family in the not-so-distant future) and I feel seen!!

I have had to retire my last two horses after putting everything I could into them and knowing when to call it quits - one is comfortably and safely retired, the other was put down recently. I struggled with the same debate on leasing/lessons and haven’t ridden for 8 months now. The urge to not buy a cute, TB that I know I’d really enjoy on a whim is REAL.

I too feel discouraged about the potential for real progress by taking just a lesson a week and not having any sort of connection to that horse. I had the opportunity to lease a really lovely horse I otherwise couldn’t afford, but in my area a half lease is what most people would consider full board…yay!! So at that point, why not just put that money towards an eventual purchase? But on the other hand, I don’t know how I could justify buying a 5-figure horse when the time comes if I haven’t ridden in 2 years and am totally out of shape…I would be embarrassed to even go try said horse!

Similarly to you, I feel lucky that my husband and I have most of our basics squared away, but feel like we have reached a turning point where I need to decide to buy something NOW and put the miles on it before we start a family, or if I save save save and try to buy something more “made”…which will be a while as I’m in the same boat of probably never quite reaching the six figure range given my profession (which I really love and also don’t want to give up for something with higher earning potential!). All this to say…I feel you and thank you for posting this so I didn’t have to!!!

[Scaramouch]

@horsepooramateur

I too feel discouraged about the potential for real progress by taking just a lesson a week and not having any sort of connection to that horse. I had the opportunity to lease a really lovely horse I otherwise couldn’t afford, but in my area a half lease is what most people would consider full board…yay!! So at that point, why not just put that money towards an eventual purchase? But on the other hand, I don’t know how I could justify buying a 5-figure horse when the time comes if I haven’t ridden in 2 years and am totally out of shape…I would be embarrassed to even go try said horse!

My feelings exactly! I did take a handful of lessons one summer a few years ago (there’s one lesson facility local to me that regularly takes adult students) and it was frankly a waste of money So if I were to go that route I’d try to find a dressage trainer who has a mid-level schoolmaster.

I am also kind of reluctant to redirect my career, at least at this point, because my job gives me a ton of flexibility to ride, haul out for weekday lessons, meet the farrier, pick up hay as I need to. So the last thing I want to do is take extended time off to go back to school or get into a more lucrative line of work (that might chain me to a desk?) in the hope of maybe being able to buy a nice horse in 5-10 years.

I do not want to be one of those adult amateurs who gets back into it after career-building and kids, then buys a fabulous horse only to have to pay for training board because either they’re too busy to ride more than a few times a week or they just can’t ride one side of said horse. I am not about that life!

[BatCoach]

@Scaramouch

I’m also wondering if taking weekly lessons would help or hurt. It might help in terms of maintaining muscle memory, but I think poking around on lesson horses might be more frustrating than not riding at all? Frustrating to the point I’m more likely to impulse buy a horse I can afford vs. a horse I want…

I can relate- about two years ago I had to face the financial music and realize that due to several factors (moving to a higher COL area, husband losing job, and off-on soundness issues) I could not afford to own my horse.

Fortunately I was able to give my horse back to his original owner, who gave him to me for a $100 due to aforementioned mystery soundness. But it still broke my heart. It still makes me sad and there is a big ole horse-shaped hole in my heart.

Every now and then I get the itch to investigate lesson programs, but I actually think it’s better for me to stick to the “all or nothing” approach. I am focused on paying off debt and building a future horse fund, and working on my off-horse fitness before I put money into lessons. Right now, with current job schedule &demands I could only ride on weekends, which really would not be enough to justify the cost when that money can go into savings or investments to put me back on the track to future horse ownership.

So I have to try to be content with window shopping the CANTER sites, reading horse blogs and dusting off an occasional Breyer. Horses are a lifestyle for me, but I’m temporarily taking a back seat/spectator role now until I’m back in shape enough to get back on the field. I will most certainly start up lessons when my fitness and financial goals are met and get back on the path to ownership.