Talk to me re torn ACL UPDATE below

[2tempe]

My smaller dog (26 lbs, not fat, active) was just diagnosed with a tear in acl. He is somewhere around 13, and part dachshund with some maybe border collie thrown in.

Vet is suggesting a 3-4 week conservative management to see how he does - NSAIDS, house arrest, leash to go potty. Then reevaluate. In all my years of dogs, have never had this. Have done some internet searches and am wondering if anyone here has dealt with this in a smaller dog. What did you do, what were the outcomes, and did the dog ultimately have a problem with the other leg as well?

[Bonnie2]

Smaller dogs generally cope better than larger dogs. I admire your vet for recommending conservative therapy before surgery. Surgery on a 13 year old would worry me. He needs to not jump or run or slip. Try a ramp for his chair and if you have slippery floors it’s time for a rug! Be careful with the NSAIDs. It’s good to keep the inflammation down but you don’t want him feeling too good! If it’s once daily dosing, give it at dinner. The good leg likely has the same conformational issues that led to the injury in bad leg and now if he jumps the good leg will have to do more of the work. As hard as it is, he can’t play and run crackerdog. Once cleared with your vet, moderate exercise will help keep up his muscling. Good luck!

[masConfetti]

I work for a vet who does these surgeries and he has a similar approach as your vet. He prefers to wait and rest them for a month and see if some scarring will occur and give enough stability to not need surgery. If during the rest phase the leg is re-injured again then often times surgery will be required so rest is key.
They can be more prone to tear the 2nd one but plenty of dogs don’t.
We see these incidents alot and the fact that your dog is a good weight, normally active, and generally smaller are all positives for his recovery.

[Kyrabee]

My 88 yo Mom’s 22lb 12-ish cocker spaniel tore hers. I took her to two different vets and both pushed for surgery. We (Mom and I) just were not in a place to do surgery…either monetarily or for the rehab protocol. I had just had back surgery and Mom sure as heck couldn’t lift the dog so there you are. We altered the dog door so she could not launch out of it…that is how she did it in the first place…and kept her quiet and she recovered quite well. I am pretty sure she did have some arthritis but not to frank lameness just stiff when she first got up from laying down.

Susan

[endlessclimb]

Our 6 year old Vizsla had a TPLO last year around this time. She is back to 100% now. Surgery was really the only viable option, as she is a full-out hunting dog.

We did all the things for recovery - small x pen when not supervised, water treadmill, rehab with PT specialist. For awhile, even after being fully released, she would be 3 legged for about 12 hours after a training session. Now that doesn’t happen, she’s fine.

All that said - I don’t know that I would spend the big money on TPLO for a dog that’s 13. Could you ask your vet about the bilateral suture surgery, cost and recovery wise?

[2tempe]

Yes, with a full out hunting dog and young, I can see that would be the option. I am fortunately able to handle the surgery, both financially and timewise. But I am comfortable with the vet’s recommendation for now. I suspect we would go with the suture version if it gets to that point. From what I’ve read, it works well on the smaller dogs.
My worry is that my guy THINKS he is a full out hunting dog in our 1/2 acre back yard and has the squirrel carcasses to vouch for some success. I’m going to have to reprogram his little brain… When your dog did go back to work how did you handle the 3-legged thing? How did you know it wasn’t a system fail? I would panic, lol.

[2tempe]

Thanks! Fortunately I am able to do surgery if it gets to that but hoping not to. He is a smart dog and I’m working on convincing him it is not necessary to take a flying leap onto the couch or bed, so learn the new way. I feel bad for him when I leave to walk my other dog.

[endlessclimb]

We just observed. Since it was only 8-12 hours worth of 3 legged, it didn’t raise the red flag. A little previcoxx/deramaxx/rimadyl depending on how hard the training session was, and just wait until the next morning.

It was nerve wracking to start, no doubt.

[HorseLover65]

Our 12 1/2 year old beagle/shepherd mix ruptured her right hind CCL two years ago chasing a deer in the back yard. Vet recommended surgery. We opted to give it a month. She already sleeps a lot so it got plenty of rest. After the first 7-10 days, I took her out for very short, controlled walks. She has done just great. You would have to look closely to see the very slight hitch in her giddyup.

We do have to chase the deer, bunnies and squirrels off before we let her out in the back yard. She will still give chase and then come up lame for a few days.

Good luck with whatever path you follow. She loved the Dasaquin soft chews and I think they helped.

[2tempe]

Thanks for your story! We are at exactly 21 days today. He has been a pretty good patient ex the day he sneaked out beside my larger dog and took a short run. Sometimes looks sound, sometimes slight limp, much improved. My current challenge is that because he feels better, he’s a bit busier; hates to miss anything. But only outsides have been to backyard on a leash for “nature calls”. I’m going to check back with the vet later this week. I’ve read it takes a long time for scar tissue to fully develop.

[CuriosoJorge]

@Bonnie2

Be careful with the NSAIDs. It’s good to keep the inflammation down but you don’t want him feeling too good

Please provide the logic, and the references, for this statement. Pain impedes healing. The end period full stop.

OP give the meds your veterinarian prescribed.

[Bonnie2]

The logic is if it is an injury that can be worsened by use, and the dog does not have discomfort to limit use, and dogs cannot understand the concept of staying quiet to allow an injury to heal, NSAIDS can be counter productive. I recommended evening dosing when the dog will tend to be quieter. I did not recommend contravening veterinary instructions. Sounds like the patient is making a good recovery.

[2tempe]

UPDATE
on my torn ACL dog. Four weeks of NSAIDs, “stall rest” and hand walking outside to do his dog business. Tried my best to get him to use help getting on couch and bed (moderate success), made ramp from garage to house. Cut back meds about 10 days ago to small daily dose, did 7 days of 2-3 5 minute walks in the real world or around back yard. Now on day 3 of 10 minutes. 2x per day. He’s doing quite well, only see a limp when tired or when he first gets up from nap. VERY happy to be out in the real world. He will go off meds all together in another week. Optimistic but know we still have a ways to go.

[fourfillies]

Great update! My Corgi was about 6 when he tore his. Repaired it with a number of complications. When he tore the other side a year later I followed basically your “stall rest” protocol. He returned to full “soundness”/ball chaser crazy and I always struggled to remember which side we repaired.

[2tempe]

coming on 4 months since ACL tear. Didn’t see much change in Nov, was a tad concerned. About 2 weeks ago started letting him off leash in large back yard - supervised. He’s been really good except for a few running spurts, but no ill effects. Got him a small neoprene brace from a company called Tailwinds. It covers the bad joint and gives it some modest support; using it when he goes on his daily walks - he get so excited, lol. Have been doing rehab exercises to rebuild the muscle in bad leg - I could easily feel the difference between the two. And I massage the leg when he seems “off”.
I can now feel the improvement in leg muscle, he looks much more sound. I’m feeling pretty optimistic going into Christmas!

[M_al]

Just saw this and would chime in a lot later … we opted to do a TIGHTROPE surgery on the (then) 11.5yo Shiba Inu (full rupture, non-weight bearing). She is a smaller, older and relatively sedentary dog, so a perfect candidate for this one. I didn’t want to do TPLO since it involves shaving down the bone, inserting hardware and changing the joint angle. For my dog, that’s way overkill … I don’t need a surgery to make her ready to return to flyball. That’s a huge amount of healing to do after for a geriatric who now needs to re-learn how to use the hip.

My little fat dog got tightrope instead … it’s a replacement synthetic ligament with no reshaping of the joint. It’s simply a replacement of the failed structure. This will surgery has a pretty big fail percentage on larger and super athletic dog so very few vets in this state do it, only CSU and the one I went to - a 45 min drive away. (Everyone/vets were pushing me to do the tplo, but it was discovered they recommended it because it’s all they know. Apparently that’s the only procedure taught in vet school. Very few learn tightrope because it has a limited target success demographic. Because the vets know how to do tplo they push that as the only option.)

Anyway, it was SO worth it! More than a year later she’s chugging along like a champ! (Also, she went on a diet despite her protests.) Shiba Inu breed life expectancy is 12-15 so we’re already doing great. Every year is a bonus. I am glad to not have done a more structure-altering procedure on a geriatric dog. FWIW.

[2tempe]

Thanks for this info. This is the surgery I would look into if I have to go that route. For much the same reasons. Can I ask how long the recovery was and what rehab?

[M_al]

Looking back at my calendar, surgery was Nov 18 and she was cleared for all activity by Feb 9. So like … 9 weeks? It started off a follow up visit every week, then every couple of weeks, then a final visit to sign off.

** She came home in a cast, which is one reason small dogs are more successful. I carried her out the sliding glass door and down the 4 deck stairs multiple times a day while she was in her cast. We put a plastic bag over the “foot” so she could go potty in the snow. Also, she held her poo for a really long time (like, until the cast came off) and I think I have a thread on here freaking out about that. But, all went well in the end.

I carried her in and out for a few weeks while we were making sure that “no jumping, no stairs” was adhered to!

Once she was cleared for “hand-walking” we did a little bit around the neighborhood based on her increasing strength. Also, when she was just cleared to begin outdoor walks, I set up a small obstacle course to walk through (step up on a mat 2 inches high, walk across and step back down. Step over the cute draft blocking tube that normally sits by the basement door. Little slow stuff to make sure she was pushing off that leg, not favoring it. My favorite part of the walks was that I could hear her pushing off her back legs evenly as we progressed - a nice square gait. At first she could only do a little, then she got stronger and stronger and we were cookin’ around a pretty big route through the neighborhood.

I did little dog version of carrot stretches (cheese!) by getting her balanced on all 4 legs and scratching in different places to move her little fat ribs so she stretched through the new repair. I even used a red light soft laser (so did the vet, but hers was WAAAY more powerful than my home version!) every evening.

I rehabbed her more like a version of horse recovery and human PT … the vet’s instructions were pretty much to increase walk length. But, having rehabbed so many (human) orthopedic injuries over the years, I did a little extra, just 'cause. Overall, it was a great result but soooo stressful during rehab (as it always is, when outcome is unknown.)

[pompeiii]

Thought I’d jump in on the ACL discussion. My now 13.5 year old (33lbs) dog tore BOTH her ACLs. The first in September 2022 and the second in the spring of 2023. She has had a transient heart murmur. Needless to say, we did not consider surgery.

My vet actually suggested that we go the brace route through My Pets Brace and they’ve been fabulous. We’re lucky enough to live locally and for the second brace actually got in same day with a cancellation appointment (I think they’re 6 weeks out schedule wise). But I highly recommend this (there are other custom braces out there too plus mail order options) if surgery isn’t an option.

The only issue we ran into was she re-injured her first leg after being brace free for about 7-8 weeks. While that leg is looking pretty good, we’ve all agreed she’s going to just wear both braces until both legs are healed so she doesn’t put extra stress/strain on one leg.

[2tempe]

Thanks for this information! I pondered a hinged type brace, my vet only said that some dogs do fine, others get sores/irritation from the brace. I made the personal decision to do the little neoprene thing and he only wears it when we go for our daily walks. He has been mostly loose in the large back yard the last few weeks, and has been quieter than I expected. I live in fear that he will tear the other and if that happens I’m definitely going to get a more significant brace.