What is the ideal spacing between the horses or ponies in Tandem, what factors (besides not so close that the wheeler can take a bite outta leaders butt!) should be taken in when putting them to.
Thanks!
I am sure there are formulas someplace, for size animals, amount of distance between. Something for harness makers to figure length on Leader traces!
We want the Wheeler to be able to extend, reaching in front, without a chance of hitting Leader’s hind hooves, who may not be in tight traces. Leader is not supposed to ever be tight in traces for Pleasure Driving, or most parts of CDE competitions. Sometimes you just have to fiddle with the length, in setting up the traces.
I have noticed that our Wheelers always carries themselves more up in the head and neck, than they usually go in the Pair or Single. They can look a bit over collected sometimes, but it is a self carriage, not asked for by the driver. We call it “trappy moving” on our gelding. He is just very square, rolled up, when working as the Wheeler.
In using our Leader Bars, it seems that nose of standing horse, is just a little past the center of second bar, used as Leader singletree. Then Leader point of rump is about 2 1/2ft beyond the bar he uses as a singletree. This is on 16.2 horses, so pony probably would be shorter. Kind of like fitting them to a Pleasure carriage pole with a crab. We measure off their relaxed nose, to aid in length of traces.
This photo is very close to that setting, though they are ponies, not horses. Shows good clearance between.
http://www.drivingpairs.com/TGMain.php?ID=5&pg=2
http://www.drivingpairs.com/TGMain.php?ID=6&pg=2
Here is an excellent photo of a Tandem with no Leader Bars. Nice spacing, traces loose, but Leader reins are tight like he wants to pull. Wheeler has room for his head, neck to go down for pulling, if needed. Leader won’t bump or hit him by accident, even with loose traces.
http://www.drivingpairs.com/TGMain.php?ID=7&pg=2
If you look close, you can see the straps from Leader Traces to belly connection on girth. The straps run from flank area to girth to prevent traces flipping up over Leader rump. Stops some trace swing.
Another Tandem going forward, good spacing.
http://www.drivingpairs.com/TGMain.php?ID=29&pg=1
You MUST have a VERY FORWARD Leader or you are in trouble from the start. Leader has to be brave and GO! Sets up the Tandem for success, Leaders must be out ahead, going, to allow Wheeler to do his job.
Nice pictures!
Hijacking here:
The wheeler is doing the actual job and the leader is looking pretty? from the old day of taking the horse to the hunt meet, the leader was the hunt horse…
nvm…rambling with useless trivia…:lol:
Interesting pics Goodhors… I wasn’t aware you could use a road cart w/ a tandem. Maybe I just have my head too much in the Pleasure rules but I thought tandems were always driven to a gig or a dog cart?? Do people switch to a road cart for marathon??
Actually the CD people switch to a marathon vehicle for marathon. Sometimes they use the same marathon vehicle for dressage and cones, also.
…That’s not what I’m seeing in the posted pics though… ??? Unless they have water hazards in dressage in CA?? 
Goodhors,
THanks for the pictures. I ask this because someone commented that our tandem looked to far apart. From your pictures they probably are. The other thing worring me is the statement that the Leaders traces shouldn’t be taught - well I think ours is almost always taught. At times he is almost pulling the wheeler who gets mad and starts to “sit back” against him. As they get more comfortable (they have only been driven 6 times or so) they are getting better.
Well, I was commenting on what I saw at Katydid and the Tampa trials. Also what I do when I drive tandem. Jay (the gentleman with the grey ponies in the pictures) in California uses his puddlejumper with the tandem in marathon. I am just a beginner in the tandem thing and will have to get quite a bit better at it before I come out in public.
We have used a meadowbrooke int he past, but since getting the PJ it is much easier with the PJ (and safer feeling!) I won’t even take the reins - tandem is a little (okay alot) beyond my comfort zone!!! My pony is the wheeler in the tandem and I go along for the ride!
Most Tandems use the vehicle they own. Tradition shows and describes using a 2-wheeler, often a Dogcart or Gig type. Height is to get you above the Wheeler, so you can see and direct the Leader further ahead.
We used our Roadcart when we did our first Tandem, light, good view ahead, for the 14.2H Arab crosses we drove then. We “dressed up”, for Dressage and Cones with a Battlesdon Cart. Nice painted, traditional vehicle. However it was heavy, made the Wheeler work very hard. We were not using our Leader to work at that time, she was on long traces, no Leader Bars. Kind of the hood ornament, fancy but not doing anything! Having the Leader not work, goes back to the first use as transport system of getting Hunt horse to the starting location fresh. Tandem is also difficult to drive, so the “show off” factor was started real early! Hard to have a forward horse, who is not pulling, keeping them going along together. Does look more attractive than one driven horse with another horse tied to the tailgate of cart.
As any horseperson knows, “If he can do that, so can I” makes you try the challanges!
Tandems in CDE are being shown in 4-wheelers. Same advantages for the Wheel horse that any Single horse would have, no weight on back, more stable, better ride for both driver and navigator.
Anything CDE is not traditional, since it was only developed about 40 years ago. They do take from traditional looks, thinking, but may go way off in another direction in the years since starting. Tandems and 4-wheelers, modern metal carriages, are part of that adaptation in thinking. Antique vehicles are not made for the punishment of any rough country driving, Marathons. Doing Pleasure Driving in shows, Tandem expectations would certainly be for using 2-wheeled vehicles.
Here are some CDE Tandems with 4-wheelers,
http://www.drivingpairs.com/TGMain.php?ID=10&pg=1
http://www.drivingpairs.com/TGMain.php?ID=34&pg=1
These are Diane Kastama, who is a terrific driver in any company. She uses her custom carriage to accomodate her being unable to walk. The scores she gets with these two Welsh Cobs are amazing. But she does great with any of her driving horses.
http://www.drivingpairs.com/TGMain.php?ID=28&pg=1
http://www.drivingpairs.com/TGMain.php?ID=26&pg=1
We have been fortunate with our Tandem Leaders, they were forward, brave. Yet they MUST be responsive to let you drive them without being in draft. You can’t let them pull much of the time, the Wheeler will get hurt, pulled off his feet. You sure don’t want Wheeler hanging back!! Leader will just pull harder. May pull Wheeler harness forward on body, can get you in serious trouble!! This was why I commented on the photo with loose traces, TIGHT reins. Horse is pretty heavy on the hands there. Could be just a moment in time, caught on photo. Next instant horse is not heavy.
You need to feel Leader, but are not pulling the vehicle with the reins. Can be hard to get the happy medium feel of Leader mouth. You have terrific leverage with the distance of reins, so twitch is hard pull when it hits Leader lips, so he does a BIG turn, quickly! Ponies are even worse Tandem. You add their speed to the formula, so you could be doing a 180 degree turn when all you wanted was a little bend.
Yet as Tandem drivers admit, going out with the Tandem makes your heart race, keeps you poised on the seat edge ALL the time! Probably really good for your chlorestorol levels!! Racing blood keeps the arteries scoured out!
Lovely pictures!
Thanks for the info on tandems I will relay the info!
I wonder if really a tandem could/should be able to be a pair? The reason the two ponies were put to as a tandem was because they wouldn’t pair up as a team - just moved way too differently. Tandem was suggested so off they went as a tandem - I wonder if the reason they don’t match up a a pair is the same they aren’t/won’t be great as a tandem…
Tandems were not expected to match precisely, as the best Pairs would do. Often the Wheeler did have different action than the Leader would, be a different style animal as well. Sporting Tandem would have a flatter mover, Hunt horse, as the Leader, being driven to the Hunt. Leader wears a saddle, often an open bridle, just has the breastcollar and traces for harness. Wheeler could be the more customary Cob style, or sporty driving animal with knee action, a horse used for a light cart.
People do love to see matching things, so the closely matched Tandems did come into vogue, but were not called a Sporting Tandem. Both animals were more closely matched in gait, Leader wore harness not a saddle.
If ponies are not matching in movement, size, they may not work as a Pair. Some folks can drive their animals as Pairs and Tandems, while some Tandem animals only work as Tandems. Give you a place to use the not-matched animals. They still have to have a similar reach, so one is not dragging the other along, or running into the rump of Leader. Some things Driver can help with, but not if stride length in walk and trot are much too different. Ground covered in each step is what counts. You get unhappy animals if you need to hold one back all the time, or drive one on, to keep up.
Thanks, Goodhors, good to know I actually could use the road cart to start out with! :yes:
I cannot begin to tell y’all how much I still want to see HRH Avery as a sporting tandem leader. I just never could find the right wheeler. 
But geeze, if any horse was BORN to this job it’s HRH.
This thread got me looking around the barn last night to see if we even have anything around that I could try ridden tandem with (he has done that before and once he caught on to what the game was - which took under a minute - he was totally with the program!) and sadly, I just don’t think I do.
It’s such a shame. He would look superb and do the job so very well.
Goodhors,
THanks, that is what I thought/read/had been told to me. I just have a feeling that the two boys are just too different. The leader’s (also a Hackney) trot is faster than alot of horses canter. He had the fastest cones time all day at Tampa Trails, won Hazard for his division, although Magic (the wheeler) was second fastest in cones we cantered the whole course…
I also think Magic may get frustrated at being the wheeler, he is a very dominant, pony…
Of course we get lots of “ohhs and ahhs” because they are soo cute togather and the leader is so fancy…
