Would like some suggestions on breeding to a proven TB Stallion for the Hunters. Have a very nice, very large WB mare that needs to be refined and sized down (she is over 17 hands). Want a PROVEN TB sire that has produced some nice hunters. Any suggestions?
A Fine Romance
Castle Cove, son of reknowned hunter Castle Magic
www.smallwoodfarm.net/cove.htm
Fun and Fancy Free, son of reknowned hunter Bit of Class, flashy too
www.myfoxfarm.com/
Both have many proven performers on the ground in the competitive east coast hunter circuits
Should also add that I am not looking to breed to do on-line in the hunters, looking for a TB that produces hunters that have won successfully at the AA level. The IHF also does not count.
I have always liked Coconut Grove. He is approved. http://www.octoberhill.com/stallions_details.php?stallion_id=18
Are you trying to insinuate that a tb stallion that is nominated to the ihf would not qualify as a stallion that has aa winning hunters?
Because more then half of the stallions mentioned already have at one point in time been nominated to ihf.
And have winning offspring…
[QUOTE=Samotis;6388560]
Are you trying to insinuate that a tb stallion that is nominated to the ihf would not qualify as a stallion that has aa winning hunters?
Because more then half of the stallions mentioned already have at one point in time been nominated to ihf.
And have winning offspring…[/QUOTE]
No, I think the point was the OP wants a proven sire, and that they don’t consider on-the-line wins or IHF wins are enough evidence of being “proven”. They want stallions who have proven they can sire winners in any and all competition, not just a futurity or on the line.
No tinfoil hat required. 
Look into Rather Well & A Fine Romance. Rather Well has a great jump, not sure if he’s sired any hunters, however, performance isn’t a question with him.
Link to his FB:
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=131395120277764&set=a.131394860277790.34943.131373086946634&type=3&theater
[QUOTE=goodmorning;6388724]
Look into Rather Well & A Fine Romance. Rather Well has a great jump, not sure if he’s sired any hunters, however, performance isn’t a question with him.
Link to his FB:
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=131395120277764&set=a.131394860277790.34943.131373086946634&type=3&theater[/QUOTE]
Typical of these threads.
Op asks for “Want a PROVEN TB sire that has produced some nice hunters.”
Reply says “not sure if he’s sired any hunters”
Really??
Shrug. There are SO FEW 100% TB stallions standing as sport horses, let alone stallions that are proven in one or multiple venues, with multiple get at the top levels. I’ve been working my way through Coconut Grove’s offspring in the USEF database and haven’t seen anything that’s shown hunters and won–are you going to rail against him, too?
Thoroughbreds are out of fashion and good sport stallions are few and far between. Nothing wrong with presenting the OP with as many options as possible, when the pool is so small.
A couple other out of left field options would be Default (standing in VA, and he may have produced some hunters) or Lanciano (standing in Alberta.)
monalisa, if you want something proven, you’re limited to AFR and perhaps Fun and Fancy Free, I think.
Shrug. There are SO FEW 100% TB stallions standing as sport horses, let alone stallions that are proven in one or multiple venues, with multiple get at the top levels. I’ve been working my way through Coconut Grove’s offspring in the USEF database and haven’t seen anything that’s shown hunters and won–are you going to rail against him, too?
Thoroughbreds are out of fashion and good sport stallions are few and far between. Nothing wrong with presenting the OP with as many options as possible, when the pool is so small.
A couple other out of left field options would be Default (standing in VA, and he may have produced a horse or two that’s shown in hunters) or Lanciano (standing in Alberta.)
monalisa, if you want something proven, you’re limited to AFR and perhaps Fun and Fancy Free, I think. Both lovely boys
[QUOTE=S A McKee;6388899]
Typical of these threads.
Op asks for “Want a PROVEN TB sire that has produced some nice hunters.”
Reply says “not sure if he’s sired any hunters”
Really??[/QUOTE]
Well, you are really limiting yourself if you want a TB. A TB that has the jump, and can pass it on - is the other option the OP has. One that has stayed sound enough to compete is a bonus. I made the decision to submit my extrapolations due to the OPs concern for performance vs. on-the-line results. Hence the ‘look into’ - quite possibly not appropriate, but, proven is a difficult thing.
The ‘hunter’ is about the way of going & the jump – both of my suggestions give you a great chance for the jump. Unfortunately, both, probably will not be proven until they pass. US breeders don’t produce the same numbers as the EU breeders.
Furthermore, when breeding, just because it is ‘proven’ as a sire in one ring, doesn’t preclude it from succeeding (as a sire) in another. Particularly when it comes to jumping.
Rather Well  And yes - he is not “proven” yet, but based on his way of going and his jump and what he has produced thus far, we as well as the clients breeding to him feel that he will be a very important hunter sire in the years to come
Here is one of his oldest youngsters (he is 4 or maybe 5?) at his first show over fences, showing some excellent hunter form
[IMG]http://i1180.photobucket.com/albums/x413/TrueColoursFarm/Panoramic/Panoramic-ArticBlue-May12.jpg)
Both stallions can be seen at:
Good luck in your search!
Thank you for the suggestions. My mare is full Hanoverian. Very large (over 17 hands) and I need to refine her, insure or try to get smaller. I would prefer breeding her to a WB but I want smaller everywhere and refinement. I guess I could try to find a WB that is small and very refined. Any suggestions there?
I don’t like the IHF - too young to get the babies out doing 3’0 jumps and don’t feel that it’s a great predictor of long-term success - many of those horses don’t make it in the ring as they age - they break or they just don’t shine with the older horses. That is my beef with the IHF as a predictor of long-term success. Just my opinion so please don’t blast me.
OP, what are the bloodlines on your mare?
Just off the top of my head, here are a few approved WB stallions that might work -
Shine (reg. name Alési) is smaller (16.1, I believe). He is often recommended for downsizing bigger mares for the hunters.
Cabardino is around 16.1h and typically produces smaller horses. I don’t know if he has any offspring out there old enough to be doing much in the hunters, but he himself has a good hunter record.
Escudo II is also around 16.h and is often used to downsize bigger mares. His full brother Escudo I is currently in the USEF top 10 for hunter sires.
Regazzoni is a smaller guy and is used for downsizing WB mares. He has offspring showing in hunters and dressage.
A Fine Romance is a great TB suggestion for refining and a proven sire in several disciplines - including hunters - but I believe he is on the taller side (almost 16.3 or so).
My mare is out of Rio Grande by my own Han/Dutch mare who is out of Graf Goetz. I have shown against Shine but don’t like some of his babies. He is a very nice horse, just not convinced that he produces horses that are as nice as he is.
I don’t need to improve on my mare other than refinement and size. But I want a good jumper. The dam (my old show horse) has dressage horse breeding but she had a great career as a hunter at top AA shows. Both mares are registered with the AHS.
Will take a look at the others.
Jones Hall was proven but passed last year. His owner posts here, I forget her user name. I would email her and see if frozen is available. Other than that, I am head over heels for Castle Cove and AFR.
I am hoping to breed my own mare to AFR next year for an Eventer. I looked at tons of videos of offspring, and they all had a lovely canter. And I know he has some that have competed in Hunters (as did he), some even with beginner riders and children.
Agree that Jones Hall was a very nice horse.
You want a really nice refining web with a great pedigree?
Chaleon. He produces beautiful head and neck sets, great canter and with refine a big mare.
I love him, but I was trying to do the opposite with my mare. She is too refined, so the matchnwouldnt work.
He himself showed in the hunters with John French and won. He is ridden by his owner now in the jumpers and is an amazing horse.
He is in Colorado. He also has offspring winning in the conformation hunters as well as jumpers out there.
You want refinement and good breeding that’s who I would choose in a second!
(if I had a big mare)
Crooked willow farm is the website. You can see his offspring on there too.
Good luck!
I understand what you mean about ihf, but for me, I found my foals dad going that route. Roc USA is a great stallion, most don’t participate much in ihf, but the option is there and I love my 2 guys. I have no doubt they will both be doing the derbies some day! 
[QUOTE=monalisa;6389262]
My mare is out of Rio Grande by my own Han/Dutch mare who is out of Graf Goetz. I have shown against Shine but don’t like some of his babies. He is a very nice horse, just not convinced that he produces horses that are as nice as he is.
I don’t need to improve on my mare other than refinement and size. But I want a good jumper. The dam (my old show horse) has dressage horse breeding but she had a great career as a hunter at top AA shows. Both mares are registered with the AHS.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, I can see how a mare by Rio Grande out of a Graf Goetz mare could be big! Those are some old style genes!
Are you wanting to register the foal?
