I sold a very nice papered black Arab with a common head and knees to the sky, carded as a large… I kept her mane long to give her buyer options, they pulled it and prob burned her papers and called her a Welsh cross 
She was a good mare.
14 Likes
I know an older Arabian hunter mare that either sweeps the ribbons or places dead last. Depends on the show, the judge, what other ponies happen to be in the class. It’s hysterical because she’s an amazing Pleasure pony, save for the occasional, absolutely savage, f-you-and-the-horse-you-rode-in-on glare she levels at the judge when the canter is called. 
The Go Go Pony has a tiny bit of the classic Welsh Bod going on in her belly. But otherwise, there’s no hiding she’s an Arabian kind of girl. She sees the jumps, and the tail immediately goes up into full “ARABIAN IN DA HOUSE’” carriage.
Eta: @tikihorse2, fortunately Pontus Hugosson gives hope to tall pony riders everywhere:
10 Likes
The following isn’t 100% true to the Daily Dumb. But I like the mix of personalities & knowledge base of the group so I’m posting here 
We’re having issues with the hunter coach & the way that coach works with hunter pony. (Not the Go Go Pony, but our other lease.) Historically, I’ve tried to keep my riding separate from my child’s. It’s her thing to enjoy, I’m not a coach, I keep my mouth shut. No one at the current hunter barn has ever seen me ride. While I might sometimes handle things differently, my official party line is that the coach is the coach. If you have questions about why they want something the way they want it, ask them to clarify.
This approach worked out up until this lease arrived. Pony is 12 ish & well-schooled & was more or less back into regular work after a “maternity leave” 2 or 3 years ago. She was a state champion last year for Pleasure Pony. Based both on how she is for schooling/lessons & in older YouTube vids I’ve dug up she is a very technical, careful, but slightly anxious jumper. Her most successful rounds both with us & in the videos come from what I’ll characterize as a more supportive ride than is the classically hunter way of going. I’ve had increasingly frequent concerns about the coach’s approach to the pony’s anxiety around jumping, show management, and riding style needs.
Coach’s approach to behaviors that stem from training holes or anxiety with “let’s do this thing until the horse is board out of its mind”. To that end, coach’s solution to pony’s anxiety about jumping is for us to arrive at shows ahead of the morning schooling (6:30am ish) for classes that start around 2pm. The morning schooling goes beautifully. Any interim classes go well. By the lunchtime schooling break, pony is punchy, & the afternokn classes are a disaster. It totally went south this weekend. Irritated/anxious pony running out on tiny fences, coach screaming “she doesn’t like it when you SIT on her back! Get UP”, and wanting her to get off the pony, and daughter getting flustered. It ended in a fall due to a stop & spin that resulting in an ER visit to check her for a concussion. 
I’d calmed down & resolved to discuss things calmly at some point in the coming days. Then I received the video of coach riding pony unjudged. Let’s just say coach couldn’t get pony around a 2’ course because coach lost their temper at an animal that was already anxious & sour and was riding like chicken poop. It is going to take work to unwind the damage to the pony’s attitude from this. Would’ve been better to just put her back on the trailer, tbh. Coach wants $50 for this. I could’ve done a better job. At the very least, someone else who could maintain control of their emotions should’ve been the one to get on.
This is the first time I’ve ever had a genuine head, meet cinder block wall kind of moment about the skills of one of my child’s coaches. They’re not abusive, the horses are well-cared for, I know that they genuinely care about the students deep down. They’re better than a lot else out there. Good friends from an old barn that we sorely missed have moved over to train with coach recently. Daughter is excited about the social aspects of the barn. Coach is just…a decent rider who has brought along a few nice, uncomplicated horses over the years but aren’t skilled technicians or problem solvers, I guess? And who is rigid about anyone else’s input.
I don’t even know what kind of advice I’m asking for here, lol. Kid is objectively a good rider. She does great on the jumper. The hunter culture of “I will fix this. Clients aren’t to have to deal with training challenges,” makes her feel like she’s a crappy rider. I’m just exhausted from having to deal with everyone involved. Coach and their unilateral pronouncements feeding into daughter’s constant panic around the perception of things not going well and that the clock is ticking down on her Juniors. She’s gotten the message that the problem lies with our budget . I got annoyed last night & pointed out that there are families at the barn who can reasonably afford almost any pony they wanted. And yet their ponies have significant quirks or issues, too. Either money doesn’t fix things as much as she thinks or coach isn’t effective with ponies of any price point. My head literally hurts every time daughter brings it up. And the whole situation is just stupid because the pony’s problems aren’t at all complex or genuinely dangerous ones.
So here I am, wanting to smack everyone with a wet pool noodle . Give me advice, please. I’m trying to be respectful of the fact that no one wants to be told how to do their job. Me not going to lessons or shows is probably the best answer. That would be nearly impossible logistically, though. Any other ideas?
4 Likes
This is a tough situation. Go-Go Pony is with a different trainer? Different facility?
1 Like
Also, do you know where’s she’s gotten this idea?
2 Likes
Ugh. I don’t think you not going to lessons or shows is the best answer. I think that you need to talk to Coach and say that her approach doesn’t appear to be working well for pony and daughter, so what does she suggest as a new path forward. If she really doesn’t know any other approach then I think you have some hard decisions to make.
12 Likes
Yup. Go Go Pony resides with my trainer, an eventer with an exceptionally strong dressage background.
Daughter has been taking weekly lessons with her on the Go Go Pony. Hunter coach was out of town for an extended period earlier in the summer. Daughter tweaked what she doing in the jumper lessons to apply to the hunter. My trainer is good about pointing out where things will differ stylistically. They’ve looked amazing together.
Budget thing? Eh, everywhere I suppose. From Big Eq to watching Pony Finals to coach & other people around us. She just stormed out of the room after going around I’m circles for 20 minutes. She & I don’t always communicate very well, as you may have picked up on 
My
-
We knew going in this wasn’t a pony that would pin at Devon. The idea was to have something sane & sensible to go around the 2’ non-USEF rated classes this season. Who cares if she doesn’t go on a looped rein and likes rider butt to be firmly in the saddle the last few strides into the jump? I don’t. Most of the judges don’t, either. So why is this not working?
-
Daughter gets mad when I say anything less than neutral re coach. I try not to. I really do. She watched the videos of the rounds coach rode. “It wasn’t bad. She got her around! It doesn’t look any different from how I would’ve done it.” Yup. That’s my point, kiddo.
-
Of course a big budget helps. Yet when I’m seeing kids limping along on unsuitable ponies despite their parents being practically in a financial position of handing the Fuquas a blank check? Well, it doesn’t seem like budget is the main issue here. This pony isn’t some rank, backyard breeder experiment. She’s a nice, solid, pony that is nice enough that she won the Pleasure Pony of the year last season in her home state. Jumping division heights ain’t her jam. We should be able to get around Hopeful Hunter in one piece.
5 Likes
So, as a non-parent, but someone with non-horsey parents who competed as a junior and is now a re-rider, here are some random thoughts:
-
First, your daughter is so lucky to have you. Two leased ponies! So awesome that you are taking her goals seriously and supporting her.
-
Second, hunter trainer sounds . . . well, like a hunter trainer. Maybe not the worst, but someone who, as you put it, is not going to encourage your daughter to take ownership of training or think outside the box for solutions. And that’s a real bummer.
-
Third, you’ve done something amazing for daughter - the Go-Go Pony, with your trainer! It sounds like daughter is very emotionally tied to hunter trainer at the moment, which is also a bummer, but not abnormal. But, while your daughter is figuring all that out, don’t cut off her access to Go-Go Pony or your trainer. That’s a positive, better learning environment that she needs access to.
-
Fourth, re: the money thing, that sucks. But it sounds like you’re giving the daughter the right lesson - money does not lead to beautiful, seamless rounds. Hard work, developing a connection with the horse/pony, studying different alternatives when things aren’t working . . . that’s what works.
Of course, I recognize that none of that might seem very worthwhile to your daughter right now. But just wanted you to know, from a stranger on the Internet, it sounds like you’re doing the right things.
8 Likes
Yes, yes, yes! You phrased that far better than I ever could. And are spot on regarding the emotional connections at play. There’s some anxiety about going back to school & not feeling like she got enough out of the summer wrapped up in there as well.
May step back from going to shows with her for a while. I hung out watching the jumpers by myself for most of this one. 
May ride the Go Go Pony in a dressage clinic this weekend (need to find a saddle) & might convince myself to jump soon if I find a show with an XTreme Puddle Jumpers division
Eta: @Gardenhorse, absolutely. It needs to mainly be a conversation between daughter & coach. A) I just want her to do what makes her happy even if it isn’t what I want. B) I get reactive talking to coach despite being a pretty chill person 3) As is typical of one’s own offspring, daughter is less than convinced of my competency as a subject matter expert: “You’re being disrespectful saying that! Are you saying you ride better than coach & [amateur parent who functions as coach’s assistant ]??” As a$$hole as it makes me sound, yes, I am.
5 Likes
You have a lower level hunter trainer? The locals have not gotten the message that it’s not 1984. You probably recognize that real hunters now go on a collected step and the half seat with the loopy rein looks regional and dated. It sounds like your trainer has not gotten this message, and they have a chip on their shoulder about the bigger money levels, which has rubbed off on your daughter.
The problem is that local-level instruction is often not great, and is combined with an overall atmosphere of bad examples at the local show level, but the only alternatives available usually are very expensive and require a commitment to an extensive show schedule that may not be feasible or appealing.
My advice is what I do for my local kids, I drag them to the nearest and best real shows I can find to spectate, and constantly bombard them with live feeds or video examples. Then at least when I’m yelling “sit down and use your outside rein” and every one else is yelling “wiggle the bit and arch your back” they don’t automatically assume that I’m the outlying idiot.
18 Likes
Agree here, bummer but not unusual. Is hunter trainer closer in age to daughter than you? That will affect this dynamic as well, as long as the person is either younger more like a “this could be me” peer or older like a reliable adult who isn’t the dreaded Mom… And use Go Go Pony as a connection to keeping her from being a hunter trainer groupie.
Firstly, you can totes do the clinic in a jump saddle! Secondly, do it! And post ze pics.
9 Likes
Does the budget remark come from someone saying that DD needs to buy or lease another pony via the coach?
Remember being a teen. Remember feeling like I hadn’t accomplished enough and that I was trapped in a world of mediocre adults (true enough) that were holding me back (not really true).
The ethos of the times, the place, and my situation meant that I didn’t look to cash to buy accomplishment. But I can totally see how today’s teens would equate spending money with gaining goals, whether in sports or personal appearance.
I can also see the lure in a hunter coach who over promises but is not that rigorous in their teaching or expectations. That is tailor made to appeal to insecure teens especially if coach undermines them enough to keep them dependent.
What’s funny but sad is that the buy more horse! mantra is unrolling over doing the 2 foots.
There’s probably something about the lease culture that makes the relationship to the horse more transactional. You pick a horse on the basis of whether it can help you reach your goals this year. That gives the illusion horses are infinitely replaceable. It’s different than having My Precious Fluffy that is your horse forever, or at least until you go to college.
2 Likes
In some ways, I am very glad I grew up in group #2. I think it makes a better horseman.
Edit: I bet better riders come out of Group #1 though. Just a guess, but I was the typical barn rat that would ride anything with 4 legs, so I got on hundreds of horses as soon as I could reliably stay on. 
7 Likes
Ehhh, like a my 22yo friend’s FB relationship status, it’s complicated. 
Not Beacon Hill level fancy. However, we do live in a prime area for hunters – arguably the most famous hunter show in the country is a 15 minute drive. Coach’s show schedule is a split between locals and A rated, with the occasional thing like Pony Finals thrown in. But, absolutely. Imo there’s a combination of slightly out of date equitation style + coach getting to an age that they tend to be disproportionately reactive while in the saddle as a protective mechanism. (Coach is about 12 years older than me). Coach produces occasional sale pony in the low-mid 5 figures. Barn owners - whom I’d characterize as pro-level without the USEF designation-- own horses in the upper-5, low 6-figure range.
Rereading what I said about budget I realized I’m a goofball. What I meant was that there’s families also with coach for whom leasing an A/AA division packer-type pony would be no big deal. I get the impression that’s what they want. Somehow they’re ending up with…not that.
I’m some ways, yes. Having spent more hours than I care to swell on watching hunter shows, imo 2’ or thereabouts is the height for showing where sh-t starts to get real. It’s about the height where most horses begin to have to use their bodies and pick up and stride out down the lines. With ponies & smaller horses, more precision is demanded of the pilot’s ride. It’s also the height cutoff for a lot of people’s show nerves to kick in with a vengeance. To be fair, you see it in the jumpers as well. Just more in the form of horses/riders flying around the course at Mach 5, with no rhythm or impulsion to speak of.
How could she not know how much horses cost, really? I’ll give coach credit – they’re realistic about budgets and have never once pushed to go beyond the range we discussed. They moved heaven & earth to find pony & the lease is about as inexpensive as you can find for something well-schooled & with show milage.
1 Like
Ok. But I’ve always thought 2 foot, at least for full size horses, was just beginner, the next step up from crossrsils. And 3 foot was where things get serious and you need a much more expensive horse.
Now with ponies it may be different!
Most horses don’t really use themselves at 2 feet.
5 Likes
It’s me. I am the Daily Dumb.
Yesterday, I was anxious all morning about my MRIs scheduled @ 11. I did my morning horse chores in a daze. I returned home after being gone @ 4 hrs and went down to the barn to check on horses.
I discovered I had left Norm’s gate unlatched…Norm’s gate opens to the whole wide world! He could have gotten in the gd road!!! But! Since Norm is a good horse, he stayed in his area only pushing the gate to the wide open position to improve his view.
I am the daily dumb
22 Likes
Good boy Norm! I hate that “anxious haze”. I end up doubling back for stuff constantly. It’s like my efficiency goes from the normal 70-80% to the negatives.
6 Likes
It was a miracle I arrived at my destination in one piece and dressed lol
I’m usually sharp with safety but NOT THIS TIME.
Thank goodness it was Norm’s gate. My other gelding would have been gone and wreaking havoc.
3 Likes
