The "Give & Take" of Riding - GM's Educated Hands

[DMK]

We NEVER mind it when you think aloud Inverness!

It’s funny, because most of my life I have struggled against the exact opposite problem… Miss FeatherLight Hands here…

The good news is that my seat and leg is very effective for it, the bad news is I am forever readjusting my contact levels with my horse’s mouth when jumping or doing any collction work. Of course, a horse will give you a much prettier jump with some light contact (and hence engagement), especially as the fences go up, but I just seem to be a much happier soul cantering along in blissful floppy rein-ness

One thing an instructor recently told me was to think of both arms, the reins and a bit as a continuous electric circuit and contact should always be even on both hands - if it isn’t, you are breaking the flow of energy. For whatever reasons that has helped me with the correct “visual” to help maintain that continuous contact (but let’s not kid ourselves - galloping up on a loose rein to that deep spot at that 3’6 oxer in Asheville did a LOT more for my motivation )

[OnyxThePony]

Awesopme topic, and I’d like to capitalize on the awesome answers by just saying “right on”! and by reiterating a few, and adding my own little pundism.
Try to think of your hands not as ‘taking and giving’ but rather ‘holding elastically’. Your hands never want to be ‘pulling back’ on your horse. Never!! You want your body/legs to be asking the horse to move up into the bit, and your hands softly stopping the flow, as if all your horse’s energy would go rushing out the bit if you didn’t hold the dam gates. You see how you are just holding, and never pulling back? That is the very misunderstood concept of ‘take’. If the water pushes on the dam (the horse’s energy increases and threatens to run out through the bit), you need to ‘take’ a firmer hold on the dam gates, but you don’t need to pull back on those gates. They’re double-doors…if you pulled back, you’d just open the door inward and the water would leak out anyway.
This presupposes you can get the water rushing forward, anyway. For this, you want a lot of lunge lessons, or a tractable horse who won’t run off in the arena with the reins knotted.
Also, if the water does get too strong, know how to back off your pushing it forward. If you’re not pushing the water forward, and yet it seems to want to go forward, try to channel the water, make it go straight, forward and with impulsion so that the water’s not just rushing on like a messy river, it’s creating a beautiful waterfall.
You know…kinda like creating a nice round supple soft horse in self carriage, whose focus is on using it’s body to best do it’s job, not a fast-go-jump-go-get-it-over horse.

[baymare]

I think what drives most horses nuts is the inconsistency of rein contact, not the contact itself. If we have the patience (and control of our own seat and position) in training to teach the horse that the mouth-hand connection is a constant, rather than something that disappears and suddenly without warning reappears in all states and ranges of severity, then we have achieved something.

                            It is just the same with leg;  yes, it may take some ugly moments, and may be accomplished in varying degrees, but when the horse accepts the aids as  things that are always present, then you can both relax and start to  communicate more and more subtly.

How often I have heard riders lament “Oh, you can’t put your leg on this horse”, or “Oh, you have to stay off his mouth”, and yet in that moment of crisis (the big scary oxer, the oncoming schoolbus, the garbage can blowing across the ring towards you) that is EXACTLY what you NEED to be able to do most, and inevitably WILL do whether you “can” or not. How much better in those moments to know that your horse finds the aids reassuring because you have taken the time and effort to get him used to them!

I guess this starts to wander off the original vein of the thread, but you catch my drift. The aids (and the hands are a biggie because the connection is so close and so electric) are meant to be just that: aids. Helps, assists, whatever. Very positive and essential building blocks in ye olde horse/rider relationship. And I think consistency is the mortar that holds the building blocks together.

[This message has been edited by baymare (edited 12-02-2000).]

[Dru]

Inverness:

Your thoughtful post just meshed with something I was thinking about on my way to work this a.m. I’m sure you’ve see the ads in the horse press and the catalogs for
“Rein Aids”, with celebrity endorsements no less. The rein incorporates elastic; the same mechanical principal as the side reins with rubber donuts. And both claim to give the horse the elastic and giving contact riders aspire to develop.
When I was actively riding and training, I found that those donuts encouraged my horses to evade contact, fidgeting with their heads. When I read the German Equestrian Federation handbook on longeing, I went out and bought plain leather side reins. (This was before equalizing Lauffer reins were easily available here in the U.S.) The result was horses who learned to find and accept the contact they were being given.
The famous rider who endorses Rein Aids has as educated hands as any I have seen in Eventing, in all three phases of competition.
Which makes me wonder what they do in less educated hands, or with a rider with a less educated seat ?
Bear with me, I do have a point here ! I think your musing about possible conflicting messages between your seat and hands with your Billy could well be the key to your finding what you so nicely describe as a fluid dynamic balancing act. And I really admire you for being unwilling to bully him or overbit him to obtain your objective of a more controllable horse. That’s the way the vast majority or riders try to do it, and common sense says that the tactful hands of your aspirations will never come from either method.

The very best improvement in my riding came in the three months when a friend and I made an agreement to longe each other without reins three times a week. We both had sensitive, talented, and difficult horses. We both were instructors and judges, but we knew that we needed to go back to the basics of improved balance and secure seats. The results were absolutely gratifying. Both horses became more confident and tractable, because those conflicting aids were no longer confusing them. My friend went on to compete her stallion at a credible third level…sidesaddle ! My antsy mare seemed to forget her difficult history, and although she was still a handful at times, she got to the point where I could put young riders on her to learn how NOT to interfere with her mouth. She stopped rushing and was a much safer ride.
Of course you don’t want to wait a lifetime to develop the feel GM describes. But most of us don’t have the time or talent to make horses our only concern as he does, and there’s no real way to catch up with the experience of someone who’s been in the business for years and years. And I’ll bet that he would admit that there are times even he miscalculates a horse’s tolerance of contact, since you are right that the balancing act never stops.
To me, a far better student, philosopher and instructor than competitor, I found huge satisfaction in several horse world things; the journey of discovery, the slow steady improvement when I kept working, the incomparable personal relationship with the horses, and the great fun of seeing my students surpass my questionable talents and going on to become teachers themselves.
My favorite riding instructor/judge/mentor told me once that he was charging me with handing down the things he taught me to the next generation. Probably the greatest gift I received from him was the knowledge that the horses deserve our deepest respect, if only for their tolerance and forgiveness of our lack of subtlety.
It sounds to me that you already know that lesson, and are looking for ways to improve your dialog with Billy. Don’t let anyone convince you to go for the quick fix !
This may not be the response you were looking for, but please know that someone who considers the horse/human bond to be worthy of our deepest consideration admires your introspection.

[Janet]

<BLOCKQUOTE class=“ip-ubbcode-quote”><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Inverness:
I think I’ve written here before that Billy tends to get fast and strong when jumping. Yet, he hates having a rider on his mouth all the time. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Change the “yet” to a “therefore”, and you will describe the situation more accurately.

Some quotations that might help:

“You can pull as hard as you have to, as long as you don’t hold”

“It is all in the ‘release’.”

“A short sharp tug, repeated as often as necessary, is much more effective than a steady pull.”

“Think about a tug-of-war. If you suddenly yield, it throws the other side off balance, and gives you the advantage.”

“If he starts pulling, drop him.”

[Wicky]

What a timely thread!

Today, my trainer told me that she thinks my horse (a 6 y o DWB hunter-in-training recently bought from Europe where he was doing jumpers with an amateur) needs to be ridden with less contact. “Give the reins away” she says. Now, I can see that a goal is to ride and guide with legs more, but she wants me not to SIT (be in 2 point) and really flop those reins.

This comment came from Thursday’s lesson where my horse showed how he is beginning, to go up and down at the canter, mostly around a turn. She rode him Friday, and found him most pleasant, doing his changes which he’s just learning (I was having problems but the merry-go-round thing wasn’t when we were trying for changes), and mentioned that although it feels uncomfortable to “give up steering” he is happier that way.

He’s been ridden once or twice a week by an amateur who has a great backround in dressage, and likes to ride correctly. I loved it when she trained my TB jumper, because his learning to accept contact made it so much easier for me to ride.

My trainer says that as a hunter, we don’t need to get him to go on contact. I must admit that I’d rather have him able to do equitation too.

So, what’s with the “give up the contact” for hunters??

[Bethe_Mounce]

<<All of mine go in a SOFT rubber snaffle, unless they have NO brakes at all.>>

Brakes and bit don’t really go hand in hand.

[Inverness]

Wow! What a treat to return to the BB this afternoon and find these insightful responses to my morning musings. Thanks to all of you.

Cactuskate - you’ve really struck a chord there. My hesitation in asking firmly is directly related to my fear that I will “ruin” Billy’s prior training because I’m still so remedial in my own. You make a lot of sense. I suppose this is the purpose behind riding a schoolmaster in the first place - to learn from the pro (i.e., the horse).

Dru, your comments are invaluable. Thank you.

BossHoss, what an excellent analogy! Anything to do with water, I can visualize. You’ve no idea how appropriate the dam imagery is to my understanding.

To everyone else – thanx and keep it coming! It is so nice to know I’m not alone!

[baymare]

Wicky, as a hunter your horse may not “need” to go on contact, but he will certainly be a more versatile performer and will last longer if he does.

I am sure that loose reins are meant to indicate that a horse is pleasant and broke, and in order to get that “long and low” step, a lot of people think they have to drop contact. 999 times out of thousand, though, the only thing that happens when you drop contact is that the horse falls on its forehand. What they really mean to do is lengthen the frame and invite the horse to stretch down, which can only happen when the horse is still coming through from behind and is much more easily accomplished WITH rein contact. Argh.

Once again I am struck by the irony of a horse ridden in a performance division in a manner which would be near suicidal if it were applied to the real life scenario which the showring hunter is allegedly based upon! Of course I want my mannerly hack to be able to cruise along on the buckle when I feel like sight-seeing or chatting with my neighbor, but I d*mn well be able to pick up the reins and gallop in balance down a steep hill with a ditch or a coop at the bottom of it when I need to!

This will become a rant if I’m not careful. I think my personal response to the “no contact” theory, is that yes, it is a PART of the training process to be able to ride without contact. But it is the easy part, and if it becomes an end in itself then the horses training will never progress beyond a certain point, and its soundness will suffer from always being ridden on its forehand. I certainly would not hesitate to ask your trainer for clarification on this point, Wicky, and especially since you are already used to the feel of an adjustable, balanced horse, make sure you get an answer you are truly satisfied with. Good luck, and I would be interested to know how things go. It sounds like you have a lovely young horse.