Oh, and this is kind of adorable. Another, very high end, full service, boutique barn appears to be trying to poach me. Their pro chats me up, tell me he could put me on all sort of nice horses, get me into the clinics they host with BNTs, etc.
It’s a lovely barn, they do host fabulous clinics, but it’s way, way, way out of my league.
I smile and nod and say that sounds wonderful. At some point I’m going to say, “Dude, you might want to know I have no money; I’m sitting on this nice horse because I body clip, pull manes, teach lessons and do barn work to pay for board, at a fraction of what you charge. So I’d love to come ride with you, but, um, I don’t think I can work that much board off.”
But not yet. Because I’m enjoying being courted.
ETA: I am no great shakes as a rider/client. I am not that desirable. They must assume I have money based on the quality of the horses I’m sitting on. Nothing could be further from the truth.
Maybe you are a better rider than you think you are! lol Maybe he wants you on his horses and everyone thinking you are his product. Making his horses look good - and expensive.
Maybe he needs some in-barn services for body clipping and braiding, too … Yah never know!
I’m amazed that trainers and instructors think they own their clientele. No, they serve their clientele and at any point that client can vote with their feet and should if their needs aren’t being met. I’ve always disliked the term “poached” used in that context - to me it places the blame on the person that did the right/healthy thing and left what wasn’t working for them for something that worked for them. It calls attention off of the trainer/instructor/whoever that was not meeting their client’s needs or expectations.
Like much of the horse industry I do think many people are in need of a reality check.
I think you phrase this pretty well. And yes, that is a part of my discomfort with the discussion. Too much toxic crap, and some folks trying to blame others for a situation they had every opportunity to prevent. Had they chosen to step up, and do so previously.
I worked for a very BNT (eventing) who would do things like this. I am 100% sure that he was not trying to poach clients- he was genuinely offering tidbits of help to people who were struggling. If a couple of hints in warmup is enough to pull a student from one trainer to another, I would guess there wasn’t a strong coach-student relationship to begin with. On the whole, eventers are a friendly and helpful group, and that help doesn’t necessarily have malicious intent buried underneath.
As a trainer, I don’t understand the attitude surrounding students riding with other trainers. Sure, it sucks when a student leaves, but ultimately I want them to be successful- if they can find that better with another trainer, so be it. I encourage my students to ride with multiple trainers, to do clinics, etc. I have agreements with like-minded trainers in the area, so we can step in and coach each others’ students at shows if someone can’t make it, or help do some training rides if someone is injured. Let your students remain in your program because you provide them with a good service, not out of fear or blind loyalty. Good teaching and training speaks for itself.
This. And this was the one thing we could never get across to my ex-instructor.
The problem was that she had a habit of not letting people progress past a certain point. That way, she could always keep her students in a state of perpetual lower-level work. She would tell us that our basics weren’t good enough yet, that we didn’t understand X or Y yet, that our hands or seat or legs weren’t solid enough to move on yet, whatever it was.
She refused to let clinicians come in, because the few times she did, the clinicians would flat-out tell the students that they were ready to move up, and would even start to school them on certain movements to show them that yes, your foundation is solid, and yes, you CAN do this. Then she’d basically throw a hissy fit when students went to those clinicians for lessons.
Trainers and instructors must realize that this is not about loyalty. If clients/students don’t think they are getting their money’s worth, they have the right to move on, the same as in any other customer-service based profession. If other instructors see them struggling with this, and prove to them that they are, in fact, capable of much more than they are currently be allowed to do, they have every right to move on. I don’t think that’s poaching as much as opening their eyes.
I believe an instructor that is wary of you taking lessons with other barns/people is one who is insecure in their own teaching UNLESS they have a very real reason for a specific individual (e.g. that person teaches x and x may not work well for your horse) and it’s explained in such a way that I can make the decision.
The farm owner/trainer debacle I have had happen twice. Essentially the farm owner and the trainer had conflicts which then barfed all over the rest of the people at the barn. It sucked. Would I have followed the trainers? Maybe. Yes, both of them brought me in, but I was close enough to the “action” to see that both parties were completely insane. Ended up finally buying my own place to get away from it all.
The reality of this business is that horses and people come and go. If you get your emotions too close to people or horses (that aren’t yours) then you’re going to be very stressed out. I recognize that everyone is on their own journey, and though I definitely roll my eyes (internally) on occasion when someone moves on from my barn because they think the grass is greener and I’m pretty sure it’s not going to be, I wish them well, hope they continue to thrive and hope I’m wrong.
I have customers that change direction so another trainer is a better fit. Some follow their friends as for many riding is a social endeavor. I had a boarder leave today, taking her horse home. I knew that when she came to me and I also knew she sometimes hauled for a lesson with a past student of mine. Sometimes that does cause problems from hearing more than one way to do something at certain stages but it usually works out fine.
I have also had ones that rode with me, went somewhere else, and came back again. Some only take lessons at certain times of the year then work on their own the rest of the time.
Many times it has as much to do with schedules as anything else. I know I do a good job, my schedule is full for the next month and the only reason it is not booked further out is because I limit how far in advance I schedule.
It was an interesting experiment for me to tell my dressage instructor at the time that I was going to ride in a clinic with a lady who is great with gaited horses. I invited my instructor to come watch, it was convenient, and there was no friction from my POV: I would still need and want dressage help, but my horse’s inclination to get pacey when tense needed help. I was super annoyed that she was visibly stressed by the whole situation, despite my sharing that the gaited lady wasn’t about big bits or stupid shoes or other gaited nonsense, she’s just damn good at helping walking horses clean up their timing.
I am not owned by anyone, my horses are at home and they are MINE. She was threatened by my actions and that’s just not necessary. She wasn’t interested I what I learned or what we did, it was this black hole.
I have never put it a way that makes better sense!
These two are different concepts IMO: I have an instructor I’m pretty happy with, but she shines in the dressage part of things - I am not nor will I ever be a “dressage rider” though I admit the saddle is danged comfy. I want to jump, it’s where my passion is, and I doubt she would be unhappy if I hauled out for jumping lessons. But she certainly listens to my concerns and needs when it comes to my goals, etc. Heck I’ve had a really shitty past six months and reached out two days ago about whether I could come help her leg up her personal horses because I’m depressed as hell and it would help me get back in the groove if I could combine horses and being social, because I keep mine at home and it’s hard to kick yourself out of a funk all alone, and she welcomed me with open arms, and said “no charge.” So, she listens.
So I will occasionally ride with others (usually a clinic but sometimes not.) It doesn’t always mean that I’m not satisfied with my current instructor. But everyone has their strength and weaknesses and sometimes fresh eyes or someone even saying something different can be a boost. I’m honest and open about it. If my instructor threw a fit about it, I’d be out of there. They can politely guide with who or who won’t work well with their own teaching but any possessiveness is a red flag for me. The most possessive ones tend to come insecure which does make me doubt their own program.
I have told every trainer I ever rode with as part of their program that I do not consider myself ‘owned’ by any one trainer. I will occasionally take a lesson from someone else, just to hear a fresh point of view. I am not trying to undermine the regular, or leave their business. I am just someone who researches, as it were, maybe just a different way of saying the same thing. And sometimes I just want to get myself and my horse to a different property, different arena and new jumps.
Never had a trainer have a problem with that, it was good to clear the air up front. The one remark was a concern over contradictory instruction. I replied that if that came up, we would talk about what seemed to work better.
Probably the best way to do this is through a clinic that the ‘main’ instructor agrees with. Some instructors give clinics to each other’s students, that’s always refreshing. And it’s cool for an instructor to encourage their students to clinic with the person the instructor also learns from. Of course have noticed these clinicians are usually from out-of-state, so no chance of poaching!
Often a clinic really does reinforce what we’ve been learning at home. That’s a good endorsement of one’s usual instructor.
My coach encourages me to explore other options and is always interested in how the other lessons went.
One of the previous barns I boarded at clearly resented if I took lessons with someone else. BM gave obstacle type lessons to me but resented my (above) dressage coach and in fact, sent her a nasty email to limit her coaching to me and one other as she overheard someone else asking about lessons from coach1. Obstacle lesson person couldn’t compare to dressage coach in her teaching but I enjoyed the change .
A friend boarded somewhere that didn’t allow outside coaching - which is quite fair but then added on that you couldn’t ship to a different facility/coach. A friend had paid for a silent auction lesson with an Olympian but was not allowed to use it…
What happens if you haul out to go for a trail ride something else and secretly go to a clinic or a lesson with the Olympian???
I totally get enforcing the no outside instructors rule. For most barns, boarding is a loss leader, lessons and coaching are the money makers and ring time is a limited resource.
But not permitting people to take their own horse offsite for a lesson? That’s crazy.
I have a theory that the people with the most restrictive rules on this stuff are mid level hunter and eq people, and that other disciplines are a little less controlling.
I don’t know how they enforce it - I do know the place eventually wound up closing. Their coach was BS crazy. And jealous. The irony is that if you are a good coach - you may have gone with for such an opportunity and use it as an opportunity to learn.
I also get the no outside coach idea - that’s how you make money and I think to some extent have a bigger influence on the climate of your barn.
You had to use their farrier, vets etc too. No thanks. I am attached to my professionals.
Yeah that’s where you load & go. If you return to find they’ve locked you out of your stall and chucked out your tack room stuff, good enough time to just keep going.
Agreed! I’ve seen many coaches avidly watching their students clinic with a BNT.
I’ve seen clinicians openly endorse the student’s regular coach by name. “I know Suzy has been telling you ___ , well now I’m telling you, too.”
The only problem with the load and go - is that there is a real shortage of space in boarding barns where I am now…
When I went away for a riding experience this fall (I spent a glorious week at Epona Spain), I messaged my coach “what do you think we are working on?” and she laughed and knew exactly…but she also commented on all of my improvements when I came back.
True story.
I kept a horse for a year or two at an A trainer barn. I had been a local pro for years but reinstated my amateur status and had a nice young horse. My own truck and trailer, and trailer is stored at the trainer’s farm.
Trainer went away for a week or two and I told her I might take my baby horse to a local show to school and dabble in the baby divisions. Ok.
For whatever reason I didn’t end up going. Trainer gets back and the barn is planning to go to another show as a group and I want to go as well. The week before that scheduled trip, trainer stops me and says oh by the way, you need to check your trailer electrical hookup. Trainer’s boyfriend told her something is wrong, she said.
I go check it, and the plug to connect the electrical function of the trailer to my truck had been cut off. Not ripped off, not caught in something and torn or damaged, it was quite cleanly and obviously cut off and nowhere to be found.
I go back to the office and tell trainer that I’ll be calling the sheriffs office to report the theft. The look on her face was revealing. Suddenly very nervous.
My horse and I were gone within thirty days.
My assumption is my trailer has been disabled deliberately so I couldn’t take my horse anywhere without the trainer.
New barn was a great fit and I was a happy client there for three years until we moved back to our own farm. Of course I heard all about how trainer at first barn badmouthed me after I left. I never publicly accused her of anything, and I was quite positive in praise to anyone who asked about the level of care at her barn.
I’ll never understand that kind of insecurity about clients.
They must assume I have money based on the quality of the horses I’m sitting on. Nothing could be further from the truth.
