The trend against gelding/castration

[anon68314200]

I understand sport breeders or even just devoted owners want to do ‘what is best’ for their animals. But this trend (I see across SM) of encouraging people to ‘wait’ to geld/castrate is not a good thing for the animal industry. Both large and small pet populations have thousands and thousands of unwanted animals destroyed annually. Perpetuating a narrative of waiting to allow muscle/joint/whatever growth is a bad direction for the industry. Very few of the intact animals are in expert hands. And even when they are, it is NOT always the smartest thing to do to encourage “everyday” owners to attempt to follow high end/expert care regimes.

A good surgeon is good with a scalpel. Does not mean everybody should pick one up and give it a try.

[Ghazzu]

Can’t say I’ve noticed any such trend.

[JB]

Are you talking about horses, or cats/dogs too? There IS a lot more discussion on how it’s a good thing to wait a bit longer for some breeds and situations when it comes to dogs. There’s some disagreement even among the pros on how long to wait for bigger breeds, but there’s credible research showing that waiting to 1-2yo to neuter big breeds is beneficial to their long-term health, and avoids some serious short-term health issues caused by neutering too early.

If you’re talking about horses, I see it randomly here and there about waiting until they’re 2, but I can’t say I’ve seen a new uptick as a trend

[Scribbler]

I know folks with non neutered breeding quality digs. It’s actually surprisingly easy to not let dogs have sex. Bitches are only in heat sporadically, less than mares I think. These days most people have their cats and dogs fairly contained. It’s not like the old days where we put the cats out side at night last thing before bed, and packs of friendly dogs roamed the school yard.

And I doubt there’s much dog sex at the dog park.

It’s not like unspayed female dogs and cats get pregnant from parthenogenesis.

I think most of the bad dog breeding these days is deliberate. Let’s cross Mr Pitbull on the Rottweiler/chow botch and see what we get

[SusanO]

Not where I live. There are thousands of unfixed dogs that run loose around here and have litters that can’t be given away so they end up at the Humane Society or dumped in the woods. And these are the dogs that get fed and cared for. I am not mentioning the strays that run in packs and have multiple litters, most of which die of disease or get hit by a car. Containing a dog is considered too much trouble by these folks. And there are LOTS of these folks. And lets not mention the cats.

I don’t think the “trend” of waiting to neuter/spay is what is motivating these people. I can see the argument but even more important is the need to limit the unwanted pet populations in the South. And probably other places too. So better to get it done early.

[JB]

My take on some of that is that a lot of people who are simply against neutering males, or “haven’t gotten around to” spaying females, are the ones who don’t have good husbandry practices, and they’re the majority of the OOPS litters

It’s not the ones who are waiting for health reasons who are the problem. It’s the “that’s just not natural” crowd, which includes a LOT of people who live in the country and think dogs should also be allowed to roam free, who are the problem

[Simkie]

@Scribbler

Bitches are only in heat sporadically, less than mares I think.

Yeah, far less. Every 6 -12 mo depending on breed is pretty “standard.”

I’ve had intact girls for going on 30 years. It’s not hard to keep them from being bred. Never had one covered at all, nevermind an oops litter.

There’s a pretty significant amount of evidence pediatric desexing is not a great thing for them. Yes, by all means, if the owner can’t handle an intact animal, or keep it from being bred, it should be fixed. But plenty are perfectly capable of managing their intact critters.

This is kind of a weird soapbox from the OP, curious what inspired the post.

[trubandloki]

This is in horse care so I would assume the OP is talking about horses not cats and dogs.

I have to agree with @Ghazzu, I have not seen a trend of people not gelding.

[JB]

@trubandloki

This is in horse care so I would assume the OP is talking about horses not cats and dogs.

Since she said

@anon68314200

Both large and small pet populations have thousands and thousands of unwanted animals destroyed annually.

that seems to include cats and dogs. The accidental stallion-jumped-the-fence, or “I didn’t know a yearling colt could get a mare pregnant” breedings, at least in the US aren’t resulting in 1000s of foals being put down, or even likely contributing any large % of horses who end up on the long bus to Mexico

[trubandloki]

@JB

that seems to include cats and dogs

You could be right. I guess they will have to come back and explain better.

@anon68314200

Both large and small pet populations

I read it to be more - in both places where there are many pets and not so many pets.

[Walk_N_Gal88]

Same here except I’ve only had two oops litters. One technically wasn’t even my fault as she was at the dog sitter’s for the week while I was out of state. The sitter didn’t follow my instructions at all. She also didn’t tell me until I woke up to surprise puppies on my clean laundry and called her fussing. Said it wasn’t a big deal and didn’t see why I was upset

The other bitch showed no signs of being in heat at all prior to her being locked. She was in our fenced in back yard and the male jumped the fence to get to her.

[QuestionMark]

@Walk_N_Gal88

I’ve only had two oops litters

2 oops litters is still (potentially) a lot of dogs. Not saying you didn’t handle the situation well in the end, but a lot of pet owners would not, which I think is at least partly the OP’s point.

[Simkie]

Yikes, why on earth did you not do a terminal spay, at least with that second one?

How did you not realize the first bitch was even pregnant?

I can’t imagine letting two accidental breedings go to term. I do hope you spayed after both, since it seems challenging to keep your girls from getting covered.

There is certainly a place for altering animals. Not being able to keep them from being bred is 100% one of those places.

[Walk_N_Gal88]

First bitch showed absolutely no pregnancy signs whatsoever. No behavior changes, no weight gain or shape change, no appetite change, and never got a full teat until after birth.I was also never told she had even been covered until she whelped. That happened at the dog sitter’s place like I said. Her whelping resulted in only two pups, one stillborn and one that I kept until she died years later.

The second bitch, the vet refused to terminate. I don’t remember why as it was years ago.

I haven’t had any issues in the time since then with any dogs. First bitch was 14 years ago, second was 10 years ago. Everyone since has been fine and fixed save the bitch I have now. She’s never out in heat off leash and I’m waiting for her appointment for surgery.

[Texarkana]

Seeing as how this is in the horse care forum, I can only imagine the OP is referring to horses.

In which case, I’ve seen no such trend.

Where are you seeing this, OP? With a certain breed or discipline?

[candyappy]

From the prices that some area vets charge to geld, I can see why some are not too quick to get it done. Same goes with spay and neuter of family pets.

There are a fair number of posters here who wait to spay/ neuter their dogs . As long as you can 100% guarantee they won’t acccidently get bred or impregnate someone else dog , more power to you.

I choose to do it as early as possible because male dogs come from miles around here.

[Jealoushe]

I saw someone posting online CRYING they had to fix their dog. Actually crying and boo hooing for multiple posts.

[DMK]

I’ve seen exactly ZERO people waiting to geld their colts for any other reason than they have black stallion disease (he will be beautiful and talented and love only me). Unfortunately Black Stallion disease is as prevalent as it has ever been, which is to say it’s not terribly common but only the worst possible horse owner contracts it.

As for unspayed, unneutered cats and dogs, there has always been and always will be plenty of those around (I foster kittens for the humane society, we are smack in the middle of “babies having babies” season). All the “waiting for health reasons” people I’ve seen are shockingly responsible, although I’m sure there are oops out there, but they probably aren’t even a statistical blerp in the “idiots with animals” numbers.

[Texarkana]

@DMK

Unfortunately Black Stallion disease is as prevalent as it has ever been, which is to say it’s not terribly common but only the worst possible horse owner contracts it.

True statement. Generally only contracted by those who are the least capable of handling it.

I grew up with Arabians and Black Stallion Disease was rampant. But I think overall nunber of cases of BSD has decreased in that population only because Arabians aren’t as popular as they were in the 80s & 90s.

During the same time period, BSD seemed very common with dressage riders importing warmbloods (and to a lesser degree, H/J riders) because warmbloods were still “new” and no one understood how the European registries and stallion testing/approvals worked.

[Caligirl83]

Hahaha. Black Stallion Disease. Amazingly well stated.