"They Must Know What They're Doing ... "

[RPM]

“… because they’ve been doing it for years.”

This is what a friend of mine just told me while telling me about some special Amish-made harness leather that keeps a horse from lathering (foaming) when he sweats.

I responded that the way to keep a horse from sweating till he lathers is to not overwork him. Friend responds that when you are 20 miles from home you don’t have a choice but to keep going.

I mentioned the old days of inns and relay stations when if you were driving a long distance you would either change horses or stop and give both your horse and yourself a rest.

Friend responds, laughing, “Well, they’ve been doing this for so long I guess they know what they’re doing.”

I figured I’d bring it to COTH for opinions and feedback. I often see posts on here to the effect that just because a person has been treating horses a certain way for a long time, that doesn’t mean the person knows what they’re doing. “That’s the way we’ve always done it” doesn’t necessarily make it right. I’ve also seen a lot of threads about the use of equipment to affect the horse versus proper treatment and training.

So, what do you say? Is it better to invent a type of leather that can keep an overworked/stressed horse from sweating till he lathers, or to just not overwork him to that point?

And what about the “that’s the way we’ve always done it so we must know what we’re doing” idea?

[GotMyPony]

[QUOTE=RPM;7759273]
“… because they’ve been doing it for years.”

And what about the “that’s the way we’ve always done it so we must know what we’re doing” idea?[/QUOTE]

I’d have to amend it to “that’s the way we’ve always done it AND IT HAS WORKED WELL WITH NO PROBLEMS so we must know what we’re doing.”

Not to mention with horses, every one is different so it’s hard to apply a hard and fast rule.

[merrygoround]

Stick around, it’ll get better!

“I’ve had horses for forty-fifty-sixty years; I have been riding since I was five; my grandfather who had race horses says; my 3rd cousin 8 times removed was farrier to the Queen; and I’m still an ignorant fool”.

:D-somethings never change. It’s part of horselife.

[Lynnwood]

Isn’t lather in sweat simply a by product of the protein Latherin?
"It significantly lowers the water surface tension of their hair coat allowing for evaporative cooling in an otherwise water proof coat. "

If the horses is working and there are friction agents chaces are you are going to get lather .

Lathering depending on the work / environment isn’t necessarily a sign of over work

[merrygoround]

Lynwood your quoted post is,although difficult to read, accurate. Harness or a new type of leather that can prevent lathering on a well worked horse on a hot, humid day sounds just a bit like ocean front property in Arizona.

Merrygoround-I think you’ve got it ! :yes: :yes:

[HorsesinHaiti]

On hot days here it is really easy to work a horse until it’s gasping with no lather involved (one furlong of good hill will do it if the humidity is high/ the horse isn’t fit). On humid but less hot days, the pony can show some lather around his new breastplate that keeps his saddle from giving him issues while not working unto gasping - just working the lard off his butt per vet orders! I bet many of us have live experience or at least seen youtube of horses going cross country that had lather around their breastplate - but were still Horsezilla when the rider pulled them up at the end.

Lather isn’t the best signal of overwork or not. Ideally it gets monitored and dealt with, but my first though would be to look for the context of the exercise they are doing and then monitor tack fit. Gasping, heart rate recovery, or rubbed hair would be bigger signs of trouble for me.

[clanter]

[QUOTE=merrygoround;7759300]
my 3rd cousin 8 times removed was farrier to the Queen.[/QUOTE]

small world as my 3rd cousin only 7 times removed was the Queen

[mvp]

I have no tolerance for people who start into a conversation about animals’ well-being and then get bored part way through and blow it off. If I read right, OP, your friend was someone with that kind of attention span.

If you are an a-hole and don’t care about animals, fine. If you know me, you know that’s not how I roll and we can both agree to STFU on that kind of topic. But if you venture in as a callous ignoramus, you’ll get a correction. If you object to that, I’ll be done, thanks. I won’t stand around and co-sign the mistreatment of animals. I have spent too much of my own time, money and effort doing well by them. If I can do it, anyone can do it (or not own animals they can’t afford).

Sorry to get all ranty-face on you. Did it answer your question, OP?

[Lynnwood]

[QUOTE=vicarious;7759315]
Lynwood your quoted post is,although difficult to read, accurate. Harness or a new type of leather that can prevent lathering on a well worked horse on a hot, humid day sounds just a bit like ocean front property in Arizona.

Merrygoround-I think you’ve got it ! :yes: :yes:[/QUOTE]

Thanks Vicarious should teach me to try to quote anything from my phone!

[J-Lu]

First clue about friend:

This is what a friend of mine just told me while telling me about some special Amish-made harness leather that keeps a horse from lathering (foaming) when he sweats.

OK, your friend is suggesting that the Amish have a special laboratory where they developed a high-tech polymer coating that prevents a hot horse from sweating/the horse from producing skin secretions where the leather meets the skin? Are they funding their farms by producing high-tech exercise gear to prevent sweat dripping when people work out?

The Amish view their animals in a very utilitarian way and they are not technologically advanced. Horses sweat! I doubt your friend’s whole story!

That said, the Amish in the US have descended from 200 people and have a lot of birth defects from inbreeding, typically rely on folk remedies and have no health insurance, and discourage education after the eighth grade level. Would your friend be better off living like this because “that’s the way it was done” and “The Amish have lived like this for centuries, they must know what they’re doing?” :lol:

[goodhors]

Well, we are into driving horses, and have not heard of any “special” leather or other material in harness that prevent lathering.

We condition our Driving horses to compete in Combined Driving. They go short and long distances, work in arenas, all pulling a carriage.

How much lather, if they get any while working, will depend on a number of factors. First would be fitness, with the less to totally unfit horse, being the worst to lather, and they will lather the quickest in work. First several hitchings in the Spring will have horses lathered with LOTS of suds, even just walking down the road a mile or two. Even that little bit is way more work than horse did all winter! Lather may be pretty dirty, cleaning out his pores, cleaning the dirt off his skin, hair, which you can’t get off with the brush.

Second would be the unhappy, maybe upset horse, showing lather while working. If this horse is fairly fit, then gets lather showing, there is SOMETHING going on that needs attention. He may go from watery sweat, to sudden suds in a certain road location, on just one body place or all over himself. We usually stop and check harness, hooves, or Driver will remark that horse has been stiff to one side or resistant while working, that is where lather is coming from.

The horse who is pretty fit, happy in his work, cooperative, is going to sweat, but it will be clear, runny water looking sweat while he goes along. You won’t see lather. Harness moving on sweaty horse is not making lather, just sliding back and forth on the muscles.

Sorry, I think someone was feeding your friend wrong information or friend misunderstood what was told to them about Driving horses. Synthetic harness, the matte finished biothanes look much like leather, don’t absorb sweat, and are getting more common among the Amish for easy care. One of their fit horses is not going to lather in work. The unfit horse is going to lather, even doing minimal work, getting his pores opened out, dirt off his body. He is not ALWAYS being overworked when horse shows lather in use.

Horse might also be upset when he starts showing lather, upset at surroundings, stiffness when he should be bending. Horse reaction seems to make a chemical change in his body causing lather, even when horse is extremely fit. Our horses have done that to us, fit to go 15 miles, suddenly lathered for no visible reason in a short work or when asked to do a new exercise.