Tips on Riding High Level Horses

[celine.eq2023]

Hello! I am now riding more advanced horses because I am moving up the levels in this sport. I used to ride more simple horses who could take me around a course no problem, and I mastered those types of horses who had only a few things I had to do in order to keep us rythmic and together.
I am having a hard time being organized on these more advanced horses who have more complexities and buttons. I will have a really good round one time, and then completely mess it up the second time just because of my off timing and being disorganized.

Does anyone have tips on how to stay organized and remember to do everything?

I’m trying my best to remember to add leg but then collect and keep the rhythm constant, as well as keeping my back straight and shoulders back and hip angle closed and leg long, etc. Then adding more leg and moving up to a distance then trying to add more impulsion at a different jump. It’s a lot!!

Is there any tips for moving to more advanced horses?

Thank you!

[kenyarider]

Be a more advanced rider. The horses only do what you tell or don’t tell them to do. They aren’t going to figure it out for you. I”m not being mean, just telling that that’s what you have to do. Your trainer can’t dumb the horse down for you if you’re going to do higher level stuff, that could get you or the horse hurt. One time when I was doing a particularly dismal round, I looked over in desperation at my trainer who yelled, “you do have to ride the horse”. hahaha.

[dags]

Sorry kiddo, this one’s just saddle time that’s one of the things we were discussing in your other threads (if I have my OPs straight). You can only control so much of the move-up process, the rest of it is simply how much time you can spend in the saddle.

I had a feeling you were probably in for a bit of a surprise about what the “next” level of horse feels like, and how different that would be from what you were used to. That whole leg-to-hand thing begins with flatwork, where you learn to power up the engine without going faster. Hopefully you have a trainer that’s working with you on the flat and not solely over jumps.

For position issues, designate certain spots in the ring to do a “position check” during your flatwork. Like, every time you pass the sprinkler you run down a mental check list of eyes, back, hands, etc. and reset everything back to where you want them to be. Then it’s just establishing the correct muscle memory which, again, takes time.

Glad to hear you’re on your way though! It really hasn’t been that long (I think?) since you started this new journey. I’d give yourself a bit of a break and see where you are come summer when you’ve got a solid 6+ months on the more advanced ones. The difference in gaits alone can be a lot to get used to, and will make all this other stuff seem twice as hard.

Gosh, I hope I have my OPs straight

[RAyers]

Miles. More miles. And did I mention miles?

After 55 years I’m still figuring out how to ride advanced horses. And the best advice I can give is miles of dedicated concerted practice focused on knowing what is happening under you with no dictation from you.

The higher level you get the less you actually do. You stop looking for distances. Fence height doesn’t play anymore. It becomes all about attitude and timing.

[Scribbler]

@celine.eq2023

Hello! I am now riding more advanced horses because I am moving up the levels in this sport. I used to ride more simple horses who could take me around a course no problem, and I mastered those types of horses who had only a few things I had to do in order to keep us rythmic and together.
I am having a hard time being organized on these more advanced horses who have more complexities and buttons. I will have a really good round one time, and then completely mess it up the second time just because of my off timing and being disorganized.

Does anyone have tips on how to stay organized and remember to do everything?

I’m trying my best to remember to add leg but then collect and keep the rhythm constant, as well as keeping my back straight and shoulders back and hip angle closed and leg long, etc. Then adding more leg and moving up to a distance then trying to add more impulsion at a different jump. It’s a lot!!

Is there any tips for moving to more advanced horses?

Thank you!

Guaranteed you don’t have a true “high level horse.” You have a higher level horse than the quarter horse lesson horses at your old barn. And yes, once the horse gets bigger and hotter, all the holes in your developing abilities become more obvious.

You need more time, and you need a good coach that can prioritize your skills and get one thing nailed at a time. You may benefit from longe lessons and from also scaling back and maybe riding poles until you can reliably keep your seat and rate the horse.

It’s always a learning curve moving up on horses.

[chocolate_chip_in]

Agreed, saddle time and listening to your trainer is the only solution here.

If it’s helpful to hear a personal story from an adult re-rider…I could have practically written your post when I left the hunter barn where I started riding again, for a lease on a very fancy former upper-level event horse in his step-down job. He has all the buttons you could ask for, but isn’t the type that gives it away–you have to ride him correctly. Every. Single. Stride.

Bless that animal, he shone a floodlight on every single hole in my training and every single thing I needed to improve. And bless my trainer for her patience in helping me learn how to give his eminence the ride he required. This all started on the flat; we did a lot of changing gears in the trot and canter, and fixing my positional issues. My homework outside of lessons was to canter courses of poles to work on tempo and rhythm.

Once I had the canter and connection right, everything got easier. That took us about six months. I know, because that’s when I can watch video of us jumping without wincing. Even after I dragged myself up the steepest part of the learning curve, there were still days I wanted to shake him and demand to know why he couldn’t just be easy, there were days I cried on our cool-down hack, there were days I’m sure he would have rather launched me over the arena rail than continue dealing with my inability to balance myself correctly to hold the counter canter. But I couldn’t have asked for a better horse to make me a better rider.

You’ll get there, too. There’s nothing for it but time, patience, and hard work, though. My biggest tip is to be coachable–listen and do your best, even if you aren’t able to execute everything yet and even if you’re having a rough day. There are lots of things with horses that are outside of your control, but you can control your attitude and how willing you are to be resilient when things get tough.

[Scribbler]

I’d add, be willing to take a break if you feel overwhelmed or are getting *worse" over the course of a session. Coaches dont like letting you stop until you’ve mastered a skill, but I learned long ago that a bit of a walk break is a huge help for me

[NichtNixen]

Good advice above, and I’ll add - cross-train. Do some strength training and some HIIT or other exercise that helps improve your response time and athleticism.

[dmveventer]

I agree with what everyone else has said so far but I’ll just add that this is a totally normal part of growing as a rider. Cut yourself some slack and trust the process. We’ve all been there. It also doesn’t ever go away really, you just move on to struggle with new things instead. Our sport is very humbling that way. If you want some entertainment, there’s a recent video of Boyd Martin struggling to get flying changes on one of his wife’s dressage horses - this is a man who has done flying changes on the Olympic stage but even he still has things to work on.

My advice would be to stop trying to do everything. Your brain can only really focus on so many things at once, so pick one or two things to address in a ride and work on really committing those to muscle memory. As you practice they’ll start to become automatic and you won’t have to think about them as much, freeing up your brain to focus on new skills. This won’t be a linear process, so don’t get discouraged if you feel like you’re going backwards at times. That’s pretty much a requirement before you can make real progress.

You can talk to your trainer about this too if you feel like her instruction is piling on too much at once. When I get into an overthinking spiral and start feeling like I can’t do anything right I’ll ask my trainer for a lesson where we just focus on one skill the whole time as a kind of reset. She should be incorporating specific exercises that help you too - gymnastics to help with your position, trying to get different # of strides between poles to learn to adjust the canter, etc.

[celine.eq2023]

Yeah that’s me the OP on the other thread. Ive been doing leg to hand and stuff for easier horses but its really different on these advanced level horses, its more balancing.

thank you for the tips!

[celine.eq2023]

Oh my gosh this is exactly my story! Bless my horse, he’s a really fancy big guy who did the big EQ but right now im riding him as a step down type of job for him. He has every button imaginable, he’s so awesome. It seems like he accentuates my bad habits sometimes, which im really grateful for because I can see when I need to correct something. I have to ask everything really precisely and confidently, which is hard for me because I am a pretty apprehensive person overall.

Thank you for the advice, I need to remind myself that the process is not always linear!

[celine.eq2023]

Yeah, it is definitely a lot of learning. My guy is a fancy warmblood (im riding as a step down since we are only doing 2’9 right now), but its really different. I ride lots and lots of different horses but only a few of his quality and the learning curve right now is immense.

[trakehners]

@dmveventer

My advice would be to stop trying to do everything. Your brain can only really focus on so many things at once, so pick one or two things to address in a ride and work on really committing those to muscle memory. As you practice they’ll start to become automatic and you won’t have to think about them as much, freeing up your brain to focus on new skills. This won’t be a linear process, so don’t get discouraged if you feel like you’re going backwards at times. That’s pretty much a requirement before you can make real progress.

Seconding this.

OP, I’ve ridden for most of the last two decades and I still basically had to relearn how to ride this time last year when I moved my horse to my trainer’s barn after nearly five years on my own and five years with a pretty poor trainer before that. A lot of my lessons those first few months were my trainer telling me things that I knew but couldn’t keep straight on my own while riding my (very green) horse because there was too much else going on. Those things aren’t what she says to me anymore because the muscle memory finally sank in again. A few times she also put me on the horse she earned her USDF bronze medal on, and boy did he call me out when I wasn’t doing it right.

As everyone else has said, it’s just time, general fitness, and being coachable. Some things will be more difficult than others, but it’ll come if you put the work in and are willing to learn. The more buttons the horse has, the more precise you have to be in your riding, because otherwise you get the thing you asked for when you were trying to ask for something else (or nothing at all, lol). It’s also worthwhile to watch other people ride those kinds of horses, especially if you can watch your trainer teach them, because you can pick things up that way too. I like to make my horse stand out of the way in the ring during other people’s lessons so that he learns to be patient when things are happening around him and I can learn from what my trainer is teaching them (and also improve my eye).

Just be patient with yourself. Learning is a constant process and you’ll get there as long as you keep trying and aren’t so hard on yourself that you get in your own way.

[chocolate_chip_in]

You’ll get there! I’m not riding that horse anymore (I bought something significantly more straightforward, she ain’t making it to the level my lease horse competed at in his glory days but then neither am I) so he’s onto teaching his next person. I can already see how much her riding has improved in the month they’ve been together, even if she’s still finding it really frustrating.

Nothing with horses is linear. Some days are really, really hard. But if you want to get better, you just keep showing up, and eventually it’s been six months or a year and you’re amazed at how much progress you’ve made. I’ll also heartily co-sign all the other advice you’ve gotten.

Finally, I just want to say…you seem like you have a positive, growth-oriented mindset, and you’re seeing riding this horse as an opportunity to learn even if it’s challenging. That attitude will go a long way. You can do this!

[foursocks]

@kenyarider

One time when I was doing a particularly dismal round, I looked over in desperation at my trainer who yelled, “you do have to ride the horse”. hahaha.

Hah- a few weeks ago I did the same “HALP” thing with my trainer, saying: “I’m riding so badly!” Her response: “Well, ride better!”

If you are given the tools, you CAN ride better, but very little about riding is intuitive, so you do need those tools to be given to you and explained so you can practice them. I’ve been riding all my life, very competitively as a junior in the hunters/eq., and I feel like my education had to start all over again when I switched to trainers for whom flatwork is dressage, about 12-13 years ago. I learned how to do the jumpers on my poor green horse- I had the tools to ride green, since I’d had those all my life, but was new to the jumper ring and new to riding in this different way. It took me years to feel like a “real” jumper rider who was at home in that ring and I still feel green there sometimes.

Riding correctly is hard, and it takes time to learn and then start to perfect all of those skills. It’s never finished- I will be learning and trying to do better as long as I’m in the saddle- but you do need good instruction so you can have a place to start. If you are struggling and feeling overwhelmed talk to your trainer and make sure you are understanding all of the buttons your horse has, and how to push them correctly.

My older guy has very good flatwork now, and if I put someone on him who doesn’t understand how to use their seat they will find themselves asking him for tempi changes by mistake, and having that same helpless feeling it seems like you are experiencing! It’s not uncommon, but you do need to understand the buttons yourself or you will keep feeling like you aren’t in tune with your horse.

[findeight]

You got a more “push button” type horse….now you need to find the buttons. And good for you, you followed the advice you got on here, thanks for updating us.

Ask your trainer about some flatwork only lessons in basic dressage ( not Zeee Dressaaage), BASICS.

You need to know extension and collection in all gaits ( including the walk), Shoulder in, shoulder out, haunches in, haunches out, turn on the forehand, turn on the haunch and transition from any gait to any other gait. And you need to really understand straightness. Now, you don’t have to do these perfectly but you need to understand how, why and when these skills can be used to really get with the horse, supple the horse and improve your mutual communication skills.

Remember jumps are just flatwork with fences in the way, flatwork shapes your track to get you to the center of the fence. Flatwork allows you to regulate stride length which creates your pace. Flatwork allows you to anticipate a spook or stop and correct it before it happens.

Hit the flatwork, I challenge you…no make that I dare you to concentrate on learning correct flatwork and practicing it at least a little every time you ride. You know, elite level riders do more flatwork then jumping. Really. Join them.

[IPEsq]

Flatwork and poles courses with your trainer will help you get the feel and work on your timing without jumps in the way. I like bending lines of poles. Work on how your pace, track, and stride length influences your distances and number of strides in between. Learn to master adjusting these things automatically to meet a stride goal or to set up for a turn or other element after. You can also do transitions in between. Canter in, halt, canter out for example.

And then set a course of poles or very low jumps around the ring and just jump and turn. Do bending lines and roll backs and odd approaches to jumps as singles. Best if you have an option to jump anything in the ring both ways. Pick up your rhythm, don’t think of a course beforehand just jump and turn. It is a good exercise to clear your mind of all the overthinking. When you think too much, you are too late to act, and that is where your timing gets off. You have to just do it. Make sure your reins are short enough and you aren’t getting jumped loose. It’s easier to do with poles and tiny jumps.

After you progress, you can do the above and throw in some things like counter canter and hand gallop and other tests. But first you must get out of your head and learn the feeling. And use the flat lessons and poles exercises to figure out the horse’s buttons.

I’m an overthinker and was very successful in the hunter ring but would get kind of paralyzed sometimes as the equitation got harder. When I finally had the opportunity to ride some more experienced equitation horses, my trainer had me do these exercises a lot (although maybe for me the jumps were bigger because I was very accurate to the jumps just struggled with smoothness or even remembering the eq courses when the pressure was on). He’d also do the course walk with me as if I was just riding a handy hunter course. Keep it simple…not too many details, but I was also a step ahead of you in that I’d been doing those poles exercises and flatwork for years already to improve the rideability in my hunters. You have more basics to work on but the good news is your horse already knows it. You just need to learn how to be the pilot.

This will be a great opportunity for you, and you can come out the other side of it knowing how to be more clear and precise and effective without having to think so much about it.

[Posting_Trot]

I’d also add, you might want to work for a while with a dedicated dressage trainer. If you want to find the holes in your riding and do the work to fix those holes, dressage training will help with that. Even if the horse isn’t trained in dressage (or maybe especially if the horse isn’t trained in dressage), it will force you to be more conscious about your position and the exact use of your aids in getting the horse more balanced, more forward, and more responsive to your “asks.”

[findeight]

Understand that dressage is the foundation of most riding styles. Dressage = a solid foundation of basic, correct flatwork which other discipline specific skills are then built upon. Not just jumping, everything. Including Western skills. It’s controlling the horses entire body and getting yourself in sync with it. Dressage just means training.

Good HJ trainers have a good understanding of basic dressage skills and most love it when students want to do more flatwork. Really. You don’t need to buy a new saddle and new clothes to learn it. Don’t need a different trainer with a German accent. Just open your mind and commit to really learning to ride and communicate with your horse.

[RAyers]

@findeight

You need to know extension and collection in all gaits ( including the walk), Shoulder in, shoulder out, haunches in, haunches out, turn on the forehand, turn on the haunch and transition from any gait to any other gait.

Uh, some of this is mid to upper level aspects of the training pyramid. Collection isn’t asked until 3rd level.

I understand your point. Just noting the irony as I move up the levels again in dressage.

I do say the ability to ride a quality 1st level ride seriously improves the jump of both horse and rider. The “simple” concept of being able to ride FORWARD (not fast) into the bridle and having a solid connection from elbow to fingers is huge.