Tongue Lolling is driving my instructor crazy

[BaileyTW]

My dressage instructor has it out for my Paint’s tongue. lol.

When he really gets working, he starts tongue lolling. Sometimes he sticks it out and lets it hang, other times he’s swishing it around and licking the sides of his face. He often gets his tongue over the bit. It doesn’t seem to affect his performance much, though I have noticed improvement since adding a flash band.
I do notice it mostly when working to the left, which is his better side.
He doesn’t do it if he’s being worked in a hackamore (previous owners used a mechanical “wetern” hackamore on him).
I think my instructor would disown me if I tried going bitless, I’ve already gotten coloured saddle pads, hehe. Is there anything I could do to help get rid of, or lessen the lolling?

Oh, I am just using a plain loose ring snaffle with the sleeves to prevent pinching. looks like this: http://www.rods.com/p/3195,124_Myler-Imported-Sleeve-Snaffle-Bit.html

I have also tried an eggbut french link with copper roller, a loose ring happy mouth snaffle (single-jointed), and noticed it got worse with the french link.

[FancyFree]

My former horse used to loll her tongue out. It drove me crazy. It wasn’t any problem with the bit, she just liked to stick it out. My trainer gave me what he called a “binky”. It’s actually called a Rubber Bit Port. You wrap it over the middle of the bit. It’s kind of like a tongue depressor. I rode with it for awhile with no more tongue problems. I eventually took it out and she never stuck her tongue out again. I don’t know if it works for everyone but it did the trick for us.

[BaileyTW]

hmm, thats interesting. how do they attach to the bit? I can’t figure out how they would work from the photos of them.

[FancyFree]

It’s weird. They loop around the middle of the bit and you pull the tongue part through the hole. The tongue part goes facing back in the mouth, pointing toward the head. I’d never seen one before. I felt bad putting that big piece of plastic in her mouth, but it worked. As I said, after awhile I never had to use it again. And she was a die hard tongue loller! :lol:

[Bravo]

One of our client’s horses did that. Turns out she had a significant injury to the bars in her mouth. We found that out by radiographs. After curretting out the bone spurs that had developed, we let her mouth heal for several weeks, then injected steriods at these points.
The tongue lolling improved, but she would still do it whenever she got a little nervous. Seems it quite a bad habit to break, even when you get rid of the pain that is sometimes the source of it.
Have you had a veterinary dentist do your horse’s teeth recently? Was anything noted on the exam or was this discussed at all? Blind wolf teeth can also cause a busy mouth. They are usually further ahead in the mouth and just feel like bumps under the skin, but to a horse I imagine it must feel like a pebble in your shoe. Shallow rooted, mobile, painful little pebble.
Just something else to consider.

[BaileyTW]

yes, he just had his teeth done this June, and the only thing the dentist noted was that he probably hadn’t been done for a while (not suprising, when I got him not much had been done to him for a while!). I did mention the lolling and he also had issues dropping his feed and coughing at feeding time (the coughing issues went away after his teeth were done, but he’s still a messy eater).

I will see if I can feel anything when I go down to see him tomorrow.

[goeslikestink]

if its a straight bar bit its easy for the horsr to get his tongue over
or if the bit is to large,
if i was your instructor i would check your bridle and the bit itself in the horses mouth

sounds more like the wrong size bit

so have a mastercraftmen saddle check your bridle and fitment, your instructor sounds like hes told you but you dont get it
or go back to the instructor and ask him/her to have a look to see what size bit your horse will need

[BaileyTW]

[QUOTE=goeslikestink;3414844]
if its a straight bar bit its easy for the horsr to get his tongue over
or if the bit is to large,
if i was your instructor i would check your bridle and the bit itself in the horses mouth

sounds more like the wrong size bit

so have a mastercraftmen saddle check your bridle and fitment, your instructor sounds like hes told you but you dont get it
or go back to the instructor and ask him/her to have a look to see what size bit your horse will need[/QUOTE]

The bit is a regular single-jointed O-ring snaffle, like the one in the link in the OP. My instructor has checked over the bit and bridle fit and says everything looks fine, though she’s talked me into adding the flash band. I’ve played around with different adjustments and sizes and styles with this horse too, as some horses seem to have odd preferences as to how they like the bit to sit in their mouths, but to no avail.

[webmistress32]

I have a new pony with this problem, too. Any photos / links to the “binky” ??

[goeslikestink]

post a piccy of his mouth front and side veiws with said bit if you can open his mouth even better

[Erika]

[QUOTE=webmistress32;3415253]
I have a new pony with this problem, too. Any photos / links to the “binky” ??[/QUOTE]

Here is a link to the tongue depressor: http://www.greenhawk.net/cgi-local/SoftCart.exe/scstore/p-BID1302.html?L+scstore+jhkf5487ffc643c6+1217976438

[atr]

Have you tried a mullen-mouth, just for the heck of it? Less to fiddle around with than a jointed or multi-jointed bit.

[ideayoda]

Sometimes one can just hang a snaffle in the horses mouth, and start over with contact on a sidepull/hackamore. Sometimes it works to raise or lower the bit. Certainly the solution is not to use a bit which puts more pressure on the tongue, or bars. Do some in hand work. Stand in front of the horse facting it and lift the bit (upward) toward the horses ears (toward the corners of the mouth), and relax. Teach the horse how to chew first. Then work on flipping the nuchal ligament (very little) while also getting the horse to mobilize the jaw. Horses start to hand the tongue to protect their (likely narrow) bars against pain (if the horse is too low/flexed all the pressure is on the bars and never the corners of the mouth, so some horses hide/overflex, others hand their tongue, etc). It does work, the mouth can be re-educated by a knowledgeable trainer.

[Graymaresrule]

I have a horse that does that. A Myler Low Port Comfort snaffle corrected the issue but the bit is not dressage legal. If I wanted to show him I would try a BAucher

[saltheart]

Since no one else has said it, I will: The vast majority of the time, if a horse is hanging its tongue out, the issue is not with the bit, the teeth or the horse’s mouth in general. The problem is in the hind end, as are so many problems that show up in your hands. If he’s hanging his tongue out to the right for instance, his left hind isn’t stepping under, and vice versa. If he hangs his tongue equally out both sides, then you need to see if it’s on the inside or outside when he does it. The hind end must be activated/refreshed. As my instructor once told me, re-read your Podhjasky! (tongue out is covered quite specifically.):yes:

Good luck!

[goeslikestink]

post a piccy of him and his bridle ta

[Karoline]

http://nicholnl.wcp.muohio.edu/DingosBreakfastClub/BioMech/BioMechonthebit.html

"…Faults with the tougue are traceable to the intimate linkages in the hyoid system. This site takes the position that a horse should have sufficient room in its bridle settings to keep its jaw mobile in order to relieve stresses normally encountered when moving in collection or extension. When making adjustments with tongue and jaw, horses may flick their tongues very briefly out the front of the mouth. If a horse sticks its tongue out of the side of its mouth, over the bit or withdraws its tongue from the bit, it is a sign that bitting, saddling, pressure from the seat combined with a pulling hand or perhaps an injury somewhere in the axial skeleton is a problem…"

If your horse does not do this with a hackamore, I would look at using one until you figure out what is going on with your horse. Maybe its just a bit that does not fit his palate configuration, or he is blocked through his back but you have to treat this very carefully because once the habit sets in, its practically impossible to fix.

[eurofoal]

[QUOTE=carolprudm;3417898]
I have a horse that does that. A Myler Low Port Comfort snaffle corrected the issue but the bit is not dressage legal. If I wanted to show him I would try a BAucher[/QUOTE]

The Myler’s are great for fussy mouths. Definitely worth your 75 bucks! The tongue depresser type bits are available on ebay, too. You don’t have to have the plastic thingy, because they do make bits in that shape, too. I got a nice alloy metal one there.