UDJC.. a new forum for dressage showing.. THOUGHTS?

They could also just allow neck straps or bucking straps easily, right? Side reins seem like a really bad idea in a show environment. I do understand the use in training and teaching, but that is not what a show is for.

I also don’t like that there are no directives that I can see on the dressage tests…though I can’t say I have read a ton from the website. Maybe all these things will be sorted out as they do more shows and see what works. I hope so; I’d like to see some more types of shows and tests.

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Well regarding the side reins…. That’s an American thing… if somebody bothered to watch the video I posted you can see a dressagetest in side reins and the horse does not look tortured….so even if Americans cringe, it’s possible…

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Again, the assumption that the side reins would be used to force a frame. Is that what you saw from the grey horse in the video posted? Go to schooling shows and you will see horses is martingales in flat classes.

But following the logic here, why are martingales of any kind allowed in any recognized class because isn’t the horse supposed to be trained well enough to not need it?

As far as why use "extras in shows, sometimes the saintly school horse gets it’s own ideas at shows and maybe the side reins will help that. This discipline is meant to be friendly to those without access to premier horseflesh.

I went to a schooling show once and watched an otherwise saintly school horse consistently jump out of the dressage arena back to his friends. Just like bank left/right, over the chains and back to his buddies standing 20 ft away in the warm up area. They ended up parking the six or so friends around the dressage arena so the poor young (maybe 9 yo) rider finish her dressage test after 10+ attempts to keep him in the arena - and yes, he was running through her aids and making a 90 degree turn to pop over the chains.

So yeah, you can have a horse that’s otherwise a great match but maybe having a day or being a bit cheeky at a show. Or maybe that’s the best ride the person can get given their budget and location (and what’s available where they lesson but don’t own) and you have to make do.

If a horse needs side reins to keep the beginner rider safe, that’s not a beginner friendly horse and the horse needs more training or a new horse needs to be found that is safe for a beginner.

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I remember seeing a video here years ago, I think posted by @Manni01, of kids on ponies in a German riding school. The side reins were there to protect the ponies mouths if I remember correctly and only when the kids developed an independant seat and proper balance were they taught to ride on contact.

Am I remembering correctly @Manni01?

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I’m not anti side-reins in a school situation. It’s as much for the pony as the kid - the pony moves more correctly with a rider who can’t ask for it, thus preserving their body better. The kid gets a better feel of the gaits and a better spot to sit on the back.

That said, IMHO, it’s a tool for teaching riding - which is something competitive dressage never intended to do - at least in the competition sense. Even a rider doing training level is expected to be a competent rider and be bringing up the horse. Competitive dressage is a scheme for educating horses, not riders.

I’m not opposed to a system that provides competitive opportunities for beginner riders, but I don’t see how this is that.

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Yes, back during the school conversation, showing in them wasn’t discussed.
The fact that UDJClub is German made me think of the difference in attitude toward side reins in the U.S.

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The sidereins in Manni’s video were really really loose – hardly forcing a horse into a frame.

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Neither were the school ponies in the video I’m remembering.

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Agree! Sorry I wasn’t making that clear!

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How does this sound ?
Beginning drivers are still supposed to drive to the store of course, the earlier the better, but we don’t want them to mess with the steering wheel. :open_mouth:

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Why are beginners supposed to go to shows?

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The German system is different than the American. Different, yet very effective in producing competent riders.

I see nothing wrong with ensuring youngsters have an independent seat first, and progressing from there.

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Learning to ride a horse is a world away from learning to drive a car, to me anyway. Learning to drive was easy compared to learning how to ride.

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And that rider should NOT be in the show ring.

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Because they want to go. Mom & dad want them to go. Because trainers want to add to their fees for the show.

We live in an American culture where, in a great many sports, even beginners have a place in the competition, so they can gather participation and placing ribbons for their bedroom wall. Almost especially younger kids.

So, because this is common throughout school and independent sports, families expect it. They think they are missing out if there isn’t something for the beginner kids. Any sport. Riding, too.

Also because American riding culture often teaches steering & brakes first, proper seat second. There is kind of an Old West expectation of learning by doing. Rather than learning by progressive steps.

The European instructors have their students on the longe line for quite some time – weeks – before they are riding independently. Much American instruction (not all of it, but the more common lot) is aimed at a student who can steer and stop, make a sort-of circle, navigate cones, and ride around the ring, within a lesson or two. The rest is built later. And that is what parents want to see, because they know nothing about developing the seat. Steering and stopping look like progress, to them. Longeing looks like a waste of a lesson fee, to them.

Also many American parents with a riding background started that way. So that is how their expectations are set.

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There are directives on the one I did a screen shot of. It’s upthread in post 43.

It seems directives are on the tests starting at L1! I hadn’t opened many, just the first few. Thanks!

How I WISH I had learned the European way as a kid.

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Same!

The position, seat, aids, even developing the strength in the right body places to do it all, makes for a much, much better start. IMO.

It does take patience and the right mindset. The Americans tend to start with other expectations.

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