I would second a Fine Romance and you may want to look at Titulus whose pedigree is comprised of both eventers and jumpers, he has a very sucessful jumper career going presently.
http://www.malletbarsalou.com/
Nancy
If I were you, I’d spend most of my time drooling over stallions on the EMCO site. Some of the Weldon and Catherston horses would add a lot to what you have going for you.
Along with them, I like Dutch Gold and Fleetwater Opposition. Opposition Buzz won best conditioned horse at Rolex this year and finished nicely. Plus, if you bred to Fleetwater Opposition, you could get a branded butt.
[QUOTE=Waterwitch;4104260]
Brandenburg’s Windstar
IDSH stallion by I’m a Star (TB) out of Kildalton Seabreeze (ID) by Sea Crest. I’m a Star is the sire of 4* eventers Star Appeal, Star Bright, Starbound, and Man of Stars
Windstar is the sire of CCI4* competitor Arthur (top 15 Rolex 08 and 09 with Alison Springer) and Polar Storm (CCI2*)[/QUOTE]
I second him as an excellant choice. I also liked the suggestion of Clover Cliste. I had an eventing mare by O’Learys Irish Diamond and I believe she had all the makings of a great horse - even being 1/2 ID, she was very TB in body type with an ID brain - he might be worth a look as well.
Deanes San Ciro Hit
Catherston Dazzler is just up the road from me. This horse but getting on a bit now. For eventing and alround wow factor I like the Catherston Stud horse
Deanes San Ciro Hit
he is Sandro Hit/ Dutch Courage foaled 2002 graded BWBS qualified for this years British Dressage National Winter finals in Advanced medium and Medium (so got a good trot) and is alos competing novice eveniting.
He is ayoung stallion and on a full TB mare I would hope for lots of power for both jumping and dressage but also quick enough for higher levels of eventing. They do have frozen accourding to the advert and ship world wide
catherston.stud@ukgateway.net email
video
http://s34.photobucket.com/albums/d149/Irishcobs/videos/?action=view¤t=stallionparadeWWEC08-02-08028.flv
advert from a british web site
http://www.horsedeals.co.uk/stallions_at_stud/stallions/Deanes_San_Ciro_Hit_2002__26-01-09-55180
Lots of links (and know I am not on commission 
)
But I think he is potentially a very specail young stallion
I really like the look of him too. (What a name though!)
Some more pics and info here:
http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthreaded.php/Cat/0/Number/3725295/an//page/8/vc/1
[QUOTE=vineyridge;4104459]
If I were you, I’d spend most of my time drooling over stallions on the EMCO site. Some of the Weldon and Catherston horses would add a lot to what you have going for you. [/QUOTE]
I’ve seen the current Welton stallions in the flesh and I’ve seen a few of one’s offspring. It’s puzzling to me as the Barrs have had such great stallions in the past – but IMO these two are just not stallion quality and their offspring are proof of that. And like I said, I’ve actually seen these guys.
Dutch Gold (who I also visited in person) was a lovely, very refined horse, much smaller than his half-brother Catherston Dazzler. He’s turned out to be an excellent 2nd-generation sire, meaning he’s granddaddy to some very nice horses. First gen aren’t as good as Dazzler’s. And even though he’s smaller than Dazzler, his offspring are often 17hh. Dazzler’s are 16.1-16.2hh.
Fleetwater Opposition, who I did not see in person, also has nice offspring. However, I think he crosses best with an Irish/TB mare. Opposition Buzz is out of a part-bred mare by the TB Java Tiger. Fleetwater Opposition’s most outstanding offspring, the stallion Summersong (competed to CCI**** for France, Olympics and everything, might be the most beautiful event horse ever) was also out of an Irish/TB mare – the same Welton mare as Catherston Dazzler. FO babies tend to be closer to 16hh. Not big horses, compact and athletic.
Two other horses on the EMCO site worth mentioning are Weston Justice, who was an Advanced eventer himself and has very nice, almost-all TB bloodlines, and the showjumping stallion Chairman, who was one of William Funnell’s showjumpers. He’s a catty, compact horse (a son of Cor de la Bryere) with unusually good manners. Blugal hacked him out with mares and said you’d never know he was a stallion. But I haven’t seen either of these horses myself or any of their offspring.
Don’t mean to bore anyone; I’ve just done a lot of research and a lot of traveling around looking at horses.
[QUOTE=Waterwitch;4104260]
Brandenburg’s Windstar
IDSH stallion by I’m a Star (TB) out of Kildalton Seabreeze (ID) by Sea Crest. I’m a Star is the sire of 4* eventers Star Appeal, Star Bright, Starbound, and Man of Stars
Windstar is the sire of CCI4* competitor Arthur (top 15 Rolex 08 and 09 with Alison Springer) and Polar Storm (CCI2*)[/QUOTE]
This is the stallion that came to mind when you said talent and that you didn’t mind a pro ride. He’s pretty amazing, but his get tend to take a good ride (from the one’s I’ve personally seen). They can move and they can jump.
Riverman at Hill Top Farm might also be a good cross.
Hope it does not cause an “infraction”
Hope this post is not does not cause a problem. I would like to suggest my stallion, Lotus T. The USEA magazine found him “the best young event sire in North America” in an article in 2004…primarily based on his movement, jumping ability (performance in the 100-day test) and breeding (70% TB).
Andras
www.prairiepinesfarm.com
If you want a **** eventer I’d stay well away from warmbloods. Despite the rules being changed to favour them the blood horses are still the very best when it comes to eventing. The majority of the “warmbloods” going round Badminton were in fact part bred TBs with a brand on their bottoms.
IMHO you have three choices. To go full TB using a proven eventing-producer TB stallion or go the other tried and tested route and use an Irish Draught Sports Horse (ID x TB) to give you the classic eventer: 3/4 TB/1/4 ID. Or use an Irish Draught to produce a half bred horse. A surprisingly big number of first cross ID x TB have gone on to compete and win at **** level.
Here’s a breakdown of the breeding of the Badminton horses this year. (Done by Ardamo from Saddle-Up)
Horse - Sire (Sire of Sire)
TB = 45
ISH/RID = 10
Warmblood = 7
Anglo Arab = 1
Selle Francais = 3
Drivetime - Rolls Royce (Westphalian by Rhinegold)
Boondoggle – Drums of Time (NZTB by Olden Times)
Little Tiger - Java Tiger (TB by Saritamer)
Shiver St George - Shaab (TB by Busted)
The Cointreau Challenge – Dunkerrin Grey Mist (RID by Carrabawn View)
Spring Along – Pallas Digion (TBxRID by TB Ceredigion)
Mayhem – Mayhill (TB by Auk)
Idalgo – Oredo de Paulstrahn (selle francais)
Macchiato – Octante (Argentine TB by Babor)
Bit of a Barney – Blaze O Gold (TB by Slew O Gold)
Birthday Night – Moot Point (TB by Sharpen Up)
Lenamore – Sea Crest (RID by Knock Boy)
SS Jet – unknown NZ TB
Kilfinnie – Tullibards Shakespeare (3/4 TB by Zhivago)
Ardfield Magic Star – Hallordri (TB by Honorius)
Brief Respite – Augermann (Hannovarian by Akzent I)
Valentina – Corofino (Holstein by Corrado)
Special Advocate – Criminal Law (TB by Law Society)
Black Andy – Stylish Century (NZTB by Double Century)
Balmoral Cavalier - Balmoral Boy (TB by Resolution)
Twinkle Bee – Taldi (TB by Cataldi)
Idaho D’Argaonne – Bamby des Forets (Selle Francais by Elf III)
Faere Vision – Ben Faerie (TB by Ben Hawke)
Kilpatrick River – Petardia (TB by Petong)
Midnight Dazzler – Catherston Dazzler (1/2 TB by Dutch Courage)
Diamant du Pontet – Sirio HN (Anglo Arab by Muscat)
Happy Times – Heraldik (TB by Caramel)
Cavort – Cavalier Royale (Holstein by Selle Francais Cor De La Bryere)
The Frog – Barrabas Outer (Selle Francais)
Political Trump – Political Merger (USA TB )
Zinzan – Tirana TB by Balios)
Wulstan Rock On – Rock King (TB by Just A Monarch)
High Times – Duca Di Busted (TB by Busted)
Comanche – I’m A Star (TB by Crowned Prince)
Horseware Bushman – Puissance ISH by Imperius
Ava – Aachan – Australian TB
The Biz – Zero Watt (TB by Little Current)
Political Mandate - Political Merger (USA TB)
Fortunesnight – Sportsnight (RID by Skippy)
Mr Dalby – Dalby Jaguar (TB by Sharp Edge)
Deltry Salute – Salute (Holstein by Sherry Netherland TB)
Vortex – Imperial Guard (TB by Brigadier Gerard)
Bold Action – Cricket Ball (TB by Olden Times)
Tankers Town – Diamond Clover (RID by Clover Hill)
Storm Stay – Quicksilver Bay TB
Super Rocky – Roi Normand (TB by Exclusive Native)
Master Blaster – Marwood Irish TB
Southway – Carrick Diamond Lad (ISH by Flagmount Diamond RiD)
Bonza Puzzle – Family Ties (Aus TB by Sir Ivor)
Ilot du Grand Val – Kalem (Anglo Arab by Majid Kahn)
Apache Sauce – Endoli – (TB by Assert)
Coolgrange Merger – Political Merger (USA TB)
Black Drum – Drums of Time (NZTB by Olden Times)
Della Malaspina Irham de Vaiges – King’s Road (TB by Cadmus)
Instant Reaction – Frinton (TB by Orange Bay)
Park Pageboy – Kings Servant (ISH by King of Diamonds)
Regulus – Rimilis (TB by Indian King)
Big El – Strong Statement (TB by Czaravich)
Star Prospect – Prospect Pride (RID Pride of Shaunlara)
Barry’s Best – Tehran Missile (TB by Cruise Missile)
Rathmoyle King – Furistos Diamond (ISH by Furisto)
Stormhill Michael – Stormhill Miller (TB by Vouchsafe)
Muschamp Impala – Muschamp Maestro (TB by Matador)
Special Attorney – Criminal Law (TB by Law Society)
Shaabrak – Shaab (TB by Busted)
Running Brook – Meadowbrook (TB by Mill Reef)
Gazelle De La Brasserie – Karacondo (Belgium Warmblood by Lys de Darmen)
Flint Curtis – William Curtis (Sports horse by TB Garnered)
Another useful source of factual information about which stallions are producing successful eventers is here:
http://www.britisheventing.com/page.asp?section=0001000100020026&itemTitle=Breeding
You need to click on the links to the right of the page in the box labelled “Associated Documents”.
Of the stallions suggested that live in the US Brandenburg’s Windstar should be a stunning event horse producer when crossed with a TB, based on his pedigree. I’m a Star produced many many good eventers and Sea Crest is the sire of Cruising, international showjumper and producer of international showjumpers. Maybe worth a look?
Always remember that more than just a few horses who are listed by events as TBs are really only part TB. I would venture to say that very few of the Badminton “TBs” listed are 100% pure bred. But that’s just a guess.
And the name changes that almost always occur present problems. Mayhill, for example, is registered as Fair Oak.
[QUOTE=stolensilver;4105126]
Of the stallions suggested that live in the US Brandenburg’s Windstar should be a stunning event horse producer when crossed with a TB, based on his pedigree. I’m a Star produced many many good eventers and Sea Crest is the sire of Cruising, international showjumper and producer of international showjumpers. Maybe worth a look?[/QUOTE]
Bradenburg’s Windstar consistently – very consistently – produces horses with a MAJOR spook. Talk to someone who has one, like Hilary on this BB. best to know what you’re getting into going in. If you know you’ll probably be dealing with constant spooking, bucking and spinning from ages 3-7 and possibly beyond, you may have the fortitude to deal with it. Or you may decide life’s too short to go this route.
Arthur is not an easy ride in any way.
As for WBs, what matters most, IME, is how well they cross with a TB mare (which is what the OP has). What are the specific attributes of that cross that will make an Advanced eventer – that’s the question you need to ask.
With a horse like Fleetwater Opposition or Dutch Gold or Jumbo or Catherston Dazzler, you’ve got 20+ years of foals on the ground to see what they produce and how they produce it. You’ll have a very good idea of what you’ll get by breeding to any stallion with an established track record.
Also, Jumbo has a number of stallions sons. I’ve seen a few of them – Jetset, Pro-Set and Jigilo – and I think they’re all available through the Grafham Stud in the UK. Jigilo is an Advanced eventer, Jetset is young and eventing at Intermediate and Pro-Set is an FEI dressage horse. i don’t know what any of them produce.
I just bred my full sister to Courageous Comet to Denny Emerson’s young stallion, Formula One. I think Denny has one of the best eyes for good sport horse stallions in the US. If he believes in Formula One, I am listening to him.
What an interesting thread. For sure look for stallions that have proved themselves by producing eventers or come from eventing lines. The interior quality of courage is very necessary and to be coveted and nurtured. Along with soundness and the miriad of other qualities that produce the big time eventer.
JER doesn’t that show how you can’t judge a horse by their pedigree? On paper BW should be an outstanding cross with a TB for producing an eventer. Thinking aloud spooky horses are often very careful. Have any of his offspring been tried as showjumpers?
Regarding the Jumbo sons I think the jury is still out as to what they are like as sires. Pro-Set is an out and out dressage horse and can produce very hot offspring and will probably not get to GP himself. Not a sire I’d consider to produce an eventer.
Some sires that are rated over here for eventing are King’s Composer and Mill Law. Both TBs. A very good one in Ireland is Master Imp. Not sure if any of those do frozen or export to the US.
[QUOTE=JER;4105287]
Bradenburg’s Windstar consistently – very consistently – produces horses with a MAJOR spook. Talk to someone who has one, like Hilary on this BB. best to know what you’re getting into going in. If you know you’ll probably be dealing with constant spooking, bucking and spinning from ages 3-7 and possibly beyond, you may have the fortitude to deal with it. Or you may decide life’s too short to go this route.
Arthur is not an easy ride in any way.
As for WBs, what matters most, IME, is how well they cross with a TB mare (which is what the OP has). What are the specific attributes of that cross that will make an Advanced eventer – that’s the question you need to ask.
With a horse like Fleetwater Opposition or Dutch Gold or Jumbo or Catherston Dazzler, you’ve got 20+ years of foals on the ground to see what they produce and how they produce it. You’ll have a very good idea of what you’ll get by breeding to any stallion with an established track record.
Also, Jumbo has a number of stallions sons. I’ve seen a few of them – Jetset, Pro-Set and Jigilo – and I think they’re all available through the Grafham Stud in the UK. Jigilo is an Advanced eventer, Jetset is young and eventing at Intermediate and Pro-Set is an FEI dressage horse. i don’t know what any of them produce.[/QUOTE]
Here I am, what JER said is right on.
I would look for something that throws easier horses. Yes, they can jump and are very good movers, but the spook factor has not been an easy trip for us. I’ve spoken with several people who have his get (and know personally one other horse) and they are eerily simlar. Right down to having the same mannerisms in some cases.
I love my mare, but I watch with envy as my friends take their horses up the levels easily and don’t get bucked off nearly so often.
She left me in the dust once a week when she was 4, every other week when she was 5, when she was 7 I only came off 5 times. I lost count somewhere around 30. I think I’d come off 3 times in the previous 10 years of riding. She’d probably make a great cutting horse, she’s that quick.
She’s 9 now and we moved up to Training, finally. I would love to have another foal to raise, but I won’t breed her.
Stolensilver - she might well be a great SJ, or just dressage horse, but I’m too stubborn to give it up yet, and when she’s not spooking, she loves XC - loves the challenge of something like a coffin, or a bank once she figures it out. She’s got that ‘let me at it, mom, I figured it out’ attitude but it’s not always there.
Some other trakehner blood for eventing would be Windfall, Stiletto and Special Memories. (Some video clips of Special Memories eventing one season is at www.brullemail.com on his stallion page) As if you need anymore suggestions-it looks like you have a long enough list!
Pure TBs
Yes, alot of today’s top eventers are full TB - even over the short course. But the horses competing at top level today are 10 years old or more. When your 2010 foal reaches top level, I would be very surprised if there are too many full TBs left on the scene.
Don’t get me wrong, I am a passionate supporter of TBs - especially New Zealand bred ones, but realistically they will struggle to keep up in the dressage (and possible stadium) as the sport progresses. Like I said earlier, a BIT of warmblood is the key. And even then it had better be a proven producer of top level eventers. The future top event horse will still carry a majority of TB blood. Just my thoughts. :winkgrin:
What about Steurt Pittman’s fabulous stallion - Salutely? He’s a proven producer.
PennyG
OT but, Maryanne I am very jealous that you have a full sister to Courageous Comet…pics please!!!
[QUOTE=stolensilver;4105451]
JER doesn’t that show how you can’t judge a horse by their pedigree? On paper BW should be an outstanding cross with a TB for producing an eventer. [/QUOTE]
I’ve said this here a thousand times: The only thing that matters in breeding is what a stallion produces.
Like I said, I haven’t seen any offspring, just the stallions. All were nice looking. Jumbo is a bit of a cipher as a stallion. His offspring are all over the map in terms of looks and mostly take on the appearance of the mare but with a really great, trainable brain.
Mill Law (7/8 TB, 1/8 Arab) is a very nice stallion. But he’s produced exactly one Advanced eventer so far. And he’s not available by frozen.
King’s Composer has had most of his success as a sire of show horses (UK-style show horses). Has he produced any Advanced eventers yet?
Master Imp is a great stallion. So great you can’t find a photo of him anywhere. You want to breed to him, you bring your mare to him. I don’t think the OP is going to haul the mare to Slyguff Stud in County Carlow.
