I wish they’d do a special on the people who take and retrain OTTBs…
I’m here Dick what are you looking for a fight again? Or maybe another of your bright statements like pro slaughter people are the same as those who have sex with 12 year olds. That one showed me just what a slime ball you really are.
And yes I’m pro slaughter but you already know that.
[QUOTE=LearnToFly;3219881]
I wish they’d do a special on the people who take and retrain OTTBs…[/QUOTE]
What a super idea! I would LOVE to be a part of that.
[QUOTE=county;3220186]
I’m here Dick what are you looking for a fight again? Or maybe another of your bright statements like pro slaughter people are the same as those who have sex with 12 year olds. That one showed me just what a slime ball you really are.
And yes I’m pro slaughter but you already know that.[/QUOTE]
No, no. I didn’t say if you were pro-slaughter, you were the same as those who have sex with 12 year old girls. I said people have crazy notions that they think is perfectly normal (even though the vast majority of sane people know it’s not normal). Please don’t take what I say or type out of context. Now, go buy a goat and feed it for a month so you can slaughter it next month for a $10 profit.
Don’t raise goats Dick once again you have no clue what your talking about. But " exactly " what are you talking about when you say " sane ’ people? Anyone that eats horse is not sane? Theres millons that do you know. If someone thinks differantly then you does that mean their not sane? What "exactly " were you talking about when you accused others of being like someone that has sex with 12 year old girls?
The millions that eat the meat aren’t in America, you tool.
Millions eat dogs too - a while back you said eating pets would be “werid”.
Not all animals are pets regardless of species I have a pet cow but I still eat beef. And why would what country people live in have to do with it? We export meat of many differant species horse being only one of them.
Hey There…
Hey Guys: As you ALL well know . I AM THE ONE… Who started the last thread on " Sugarcreek Slaughter" … I am sitting here just watched the first clip of that video and Broke Down Crying. i AM A MALE and this has me so upset. SO disgusted. that I wish we could take those Trainers/Owners and Meat Men to slaughter. This is horrible. I can NOT even watch the second part to this clip… What is wrong with us in America that we are allowing these great Animals to go out of country to be eaten…:mad:
YES I’m BACK…
Hey DickHertz & County… I AM BACK… I was away at a Horse SHow when this thread began but I have to say my piece now… I AM FLOORED, I AM APALLED, AND MOST OF ALL I AM HEART BROKEN AT HOW TRAINERS/OWNERS ARE MONEY GREEDY…YES I SAID IT… THEY ARE RUTHLESS GREEDY BASTARDS.:mad: MAY THEY ALL BURN IN HELL. :mad:
I take it you don’t eat meat because all livestock is run by the same system. And heres a clue, real common in this country for business people to make money even the slaughter industry. Without the profit theres no business.
slaughter
they should show slaughter on tv often so everyone can see what happens to race horses and backyard horses and especially “cowy” QHs. And they should show dogs and cats getting killed at pounds. Then maybe just maybe some people might quit breeding, duh!!!
I love horse racing but I don’t like the horses and trainers now…they should be responsible like Mrs. James Gallagher of Lexington, who bred my old girl “Kick and Howl” (Poker-Mother Hilda). The trainer of Big Brown is an admitted heavy drug abuser and alcoholic whose drug dealing wife dealt drugs while her 15 month old was in the house…the wife was murdered in that house and where was Big Brown’s trainer? I was astonished when I saw the trainer of 8 Bells claim that giving a horse bute was like giving him 2 aspirin!!!
take a bute sometime, dog strength, not horse strength, next time you break a bone or are in a car wreck…I took one of my dog’s butes after an 18 wheeler hit us, switched and gave her my morphine cause it was stronger, and I could have run a race and won…but when you have trainers lying, and not telling the truth about drugs, you get dead horses. So test out a bute, btw, they are supposed to be bad for humans but I had no side effects, guess they the drug companies don’t want us to know how they can make a horse run on a broken leg, and then tell me that a bute is just like taking 2 aspirin. guess 8 bells trainer keeps that cowboy hat on to prevent us from seeing the holes in his head…or those shifty little lying eyes of his.
oh wait
before old county, who says it is ok to have feed lots full of horses for slaughter, jumps on me about $$$.
yes, you can raise horses for profit.
yes, you can depreciate your horses like you do your trucks and farm equipment.
yes you can write off expenses like food and vet costs.
so why the heck ( would use bigger badder word here but graduated from religious woman’s college in virginia years ago) can’t you “write off” as a business expense the price of ketamine and euthanol and burial???because you don’t care enough about the morality or ethics of keeping horses to give them a dignified death…and you can take that off of your taxes, burial, vet costs to put a horse down, etc…I can’t, but I put down and bury…it’s a matter of ethics.
so don’t tell me it’s money…you can deduct it all!
actually bobbybobby
actually altho I don’t want anything to happen to Big Brown, I too don’t want him to win the triple.
my reason is it should be for superhorses…I don’t think he is, just this is a year with a mediocre “crop” of 3 yr olds. I think if he had raced as a 2 yr old, he’d not be here today with those sheared heels that someone here so nicely sent us to the fran junga (sp) link…I think superhorses like Affirmed and Seattle Slew (grandson of Poker) were superhorses who not only raced w/o drugs and with their own hooves, but who lived into their mid 20s and sired good horses with good bone and hooves.
so I’d like to have a filly win the next triple crown, or a colt who has a bloodline of soundness. and there are 2 more full brothers to Barbaro coming, ouch, with those spindly legs, hope they live longer than he did…oh, and one of them was born in april, what’s with these late foals? makes it harder and harder for them to run as 2 and 3 yr olds, wasn’t Barbaro a may foal?
humane slaughter in usa?
well actually humane slaughter is not nice. I sometimes do eat mmeat, yes, but only a little beef, lots of chicken and turkey (shut my eyes passing the chicken trucks), but I do admire all who are vegetarians and vegans, wish I could do that, I’ve done veggie for a year or two at the time. need to switch to just fish and seafood. but then there’s the porpoise issue, if I eat tuna.
so no, we shouldn’t eat meat period but we do.
so we decide what is a “product” the poor dairy cows who cannot get pregnant anymore and become McDonald’s (no I don’t eat fast food or hamburger) and what is a “pet”. ethically in this country we don’t eat dogs and cats…and horses are as much pets to me as are my dogs and cats.
there was an article in the AHQA journal last year that advocated sending “non productive” horses to slaughter…now all horse breeders can write off their costs of putting down and burying their horses, but they choose, choose, to get a couple of hundred more dollars out of their horses when they are lame or barren, rather than maybe not have as much beer or wine or something they could do without and bury their horses. So why are they sooooooooooooooo defensive? because they know they are wrong ethically. and morally. but they want to fight about it rather than say ok, I don’t give one damn about my old horses, let them suffer and die in the slaughterhouse for what is it 275 dollars??? I wouldn’t respect them more, but it would mean that I wouldn’t have to keep protesting their cries of “I must pay my mortgage”. rats to them.
show the horse slaughter videos…I’m not PETA, but I think they have some good ideas…and like the civil rights movement, it takes the extremes to make people listen to reason like MLKing, so PETA will make people listen to moderates.
NO horse should be allowed to be exported from the USA for slaughter. period. it is an ethical and moral issue not a monetary one. but the slaughter people want to tell us it is better for a horse to die in terror and fear than be put down at home and buried,. what a crock.
Take some business classes - or try and run your own business.
You still have to make a profit - or demonstrate to the IRS that you are attempting to make a profit.
Horse businesses are big huge honking red alerts for IRS audits. They love to audit you and determine that you are a ‘hobby’. In fact - if you look at slaughter numbers - you’ll see a huge spike in the early 90’s.
That was due to a change in the IRS code and treatment of horse businesses.
So yes - depending on many factors, you can ‘deduct’ as you call it, the cost of euthanasia. However, your business must still attempt to produce some sort of income - even if some years all you can report are losses. You STILL have to eventually report a profit. This is true of all businesses, including farms.
Additionally, in certain types of legal proceedings, such as divorce, bankruptcy, and probate or trust administration, there is a fiduciary duty (in bankruptcy and estates) to protect the assets of the estate. The PR, or bankruptcy trustee MUST protect and maximize the value of the estate. In the case of bankruptcy - to pay creditors. In the case of estates/trusts, to pay beneficiaries. In either case - a horse or horses can be sold at private sale or at auction - whatever the trustee or PR decides is best. In the case of domestic disputes, the court can order the sale of marital or solely owned assets.
Assets includes horses.
There can be many reasons that a horse ends up at auction that have nothing to do with a poor breeding decision, or any poor practice in any horse sport/industry.
Additionally, believe it or not, there are not scores of veterinarians out there willing to come to your farm and kill perfectly sound healthy horses because the IRS determined you’re a hobby and not a business, or that your husband died, is ill, or has left you.
I’m not excusing anyone - I’m explaining how some things can come to pass despite our best intentions.
And of course - you know - none of this type of information EVER gets into these “documentaries”.
Why in the world would feedlot owners kill and bury their livestock regardless of species? I mean seriously does that make sense to anyone at all? Write it off on taxes? Try doing that if your a feedlot operator and see how far the IRS lets that one go. I have a feeling theres some here that have no clue how to operate a livestock business.
Here We Go AGAIN… Come on County… GIVE IT BREAK… noone here really cares to hear how you are trying to defend slaughter, or any of those Ingorant, backhanded, no good trainers/owners . They are just low life skum. and you know what … I really don’t care if they make a dime or a dollar. Those horses are being slaughtered for no apparent reason. And it is people like YOU that have a closed mind. You really need to just get off your high horse (so to speak) … and give this topic a rest. You will not win here. 
And Furthermore, I really think you should not try to defend any of that killing on here. It is unmoral, and it is not catagorized the same as Beef, or any other meat for consumption. Horses are NOT meant for that purpose. But I guess if they are not making enough money for a trainer. then they feel they have no choice but to send them to slaughter… WHATEVER, I am so over all that foolishness. And to be even more frank… I am over your beliefs.
Keep Them To Yourself… :o
Well - I think that it’s important to understand why a horse could end up at slaughter. It doesn’t matter whether or not you are pro or anti - the reasons are still there.
Part of overcoming objections is to understand the other person’s perspective. While there are undoubtedly cruel, uncaring people out there, it does not do any good to characterize all owners, trainers or breeders as devils.
One poster stated that euthanasia is “just a deduction”. Well, it’s not. No matter how much folks protest that this is all about greed - it’s a fact that the IRS places certain requirements upon businesses in order to still be treated as a business for tax purposes. It’s also a fact that there are not a lot of vets willing to come out and kill healthy, sound horses.
It is a fact - whether you like it or not.
It is a fact that the IRS will not consider your horse business a true business if you do not try and recoup losses or make a profit. That is called a hobby. Hobby’s are for people who do not need money in order to pay the light bill.
A person can acknowledge certain things as facts, and not be part of the problem, or one who makes excuses or condones illegal or unethical activity.
And this is where the anti-slaughter groups fail - miserably. Think of what could have been accomplished without all the rhetoric - without making enemies of the very people you seek to sway. If you walk up to someone and call them an evil horse murderer - exactly how do you expect that person to listen to anything else you have to say?
good wok Bryant Gumbel
I was never much of a fan of Bryant, but now he goes on my list of great people, since it is important to show exactly what happens to ex-race horses, everyone assumes haha they will be “put out to pasture” just like the lies about dogs “going to a farm”. everyone should be forced to watch all the killings, then maybe we will finally give up meat. I do know if I had to kill my own chickens, I wouldn’t eat chickfila again!!! so yes we are hypocrites but at least we put down and bury our own horses and dogs and cats and don’t send them to slaughter.
