Rectal tears are one of the first things that Dr. Kubiak speaks about on the first morning of the course. You will learn about the different types of tears and hear about his experiences with them. The course is not designed to try to make you an expert over the span of a few days, but it will provide you with baseline knowledge and enough confidence for you to start practicing and doing it on your own. Relax, you can do it, and think about how awesome it will be to have this tool in your horse breeding tool box 
I attended Dr Kubiaks class and found it excellent. Yes, he was very emphatic about the risks of rectal tears. While I can understand that you might want to purchase and bring your own ultrasound to the class, you may want to wait and get more information during the class. Several companies sell used machines, and some can be found on bulletin boards such as the one at equine reproduction.com
I’m heading down to Kathy & Jos’s www.equine-reproduction.com in May to do a one on one ultrasound training, after much begging and pleading ;), and am really looking forward to it.
As far as I understand, www.equine-reproduction.com will start offering one on one training for ultrasounding to the public this year. So for those out in the Mid-West…now you’ve got another option to look into.
[QUOTE=Daventry;6165859]
I’m heading down to Kathy & Jos’s www.equine-reproduction.com in May to do a one on one ultrasound training, after much begging and pleading ;), and am really looking forward to it.
As far as I understand, www.equine-reproduction.com will start offering one on one training for ultrasounding to the public this year. So for those out in the Mid-West…now you’ve got another option to look into.[/QUOTE]
I e-mailed them a couple of weeks ago about their one-on-one training sessions, but I have not heard back from them as of yet. Hopefully I will hear something soon as it sounds like a wonderful learning opportunity!
Usually, Kathy is very prompt on returning emails. I would try and email her again, just in case it got lost in cyber space. I do know they have been away in England teaching repro courses for several weeks…so may only have limited access to email maybe.
I am also planning on taking a course and have contacted Kathy at Equine-Reproduction. I took her other course in breeding when she came to our area in the East. I already do all of my own breeding, fresh and frozen and have done lavages and infusions.Since I am or should say was a Molecular Biologist (took early retirement to run my own business full time), certified farrier specializing in corrective work (now only do consultations and my own herd) and have been breeding horses for almost 20 years (last 10+ warmbloods), I can honestly say that whatever you put your mind to is very possible. It shouldn’t matter if you have 1 or 20 mares to breed. If you want to be totally in charge of your program then this I feel is a natural next step and is why I plan to do it also. I also want to do my own cultures which are also very easy to do with the proper equipment and even though it’s been a few years since I played with petri dishes the concept is the same and as long as sterile technique is observed then go for it.
I do have a question for those who know about these tears. Last year, my mare NF Amayzing was included in a group of mares from many farms that was used to give a vet added experience on fetal sexing after she had completed a course that used TB herds in Kentucky (so there would be huge numbers for the veterinarians to learn on). Well, this mare is your more typical Warmblood type and would never be confused as a TB. She is also 16.3+h, very wide and has a very large vulva with PERFECT conformation in the exterior rectal/vula area, i.e. no wind sucking, anus not pushed back behind vulva (no chance or little chance for contamination due to her conformation back in that area). Mare has had several foals, never tore and never had placentitis and she is very young. Well, long story short, vet comes out at the appropiate time in her pregnancy to attempt to fetal sex. She onviously is having a very hard time and comments several times on how different warmbloods are than TBs and it’s harder to see fetus etc… etc…I’m holding mare and finally after quite some time and her really shoving into mare (where mare is pushed off balance into me a few times and she normally stands like a rock for palps, u/s’s and breeding) she says it’s a girl and begins to exit anus. When she pulls out her arm it is covered in blood!!! You can imagine my horror. She says uh oh and I quickly question what happened and she just replied,“nothing must of ruptured varicose vein and there’s nothing to worry about, just put her on TMS for a few days”. I did put her on antibiotics and I also put her on Regumate for a week.
Jump to latter part of above mare’s pregnancy. Mare began bagging very early, about 12 weeks before due date (and yes I know due dates don’t truly exist but I know this mare’s usual pattern and this was not it). She is immediately put on placentitis meds as per protocol and an ultrasound was done by my regular vet to check placenta thickness etc… It was very thick and soon after began having a discharge. Heavier duty meds used etc… etc… mare keeps foal inside her for a few weeks more but foals about 8 weeks from her usual foaling date. Foal formed okay but very small. Becomes very septic and allergic to mare’s milk. Intensive care begins and foal seperated from mom with IV in her and around the clock care but even with our best efforts she dies.
Okay, sorry I know this is a book but I want you to know everything that happened so you might be able to answer my question, was that blood a tear and foal basically exposed to intestinal"crap"? It was a great deal of blood trust me, I have a mare that typically gets “varicose like” tears at end of pregnancy, but they are just within the vulva and no where near cervix. And she never had placentitis. Mare that lost foal had the worst looking placenta I have ever seen and we have had a few placentitis cases over the years that were controled and ended well with some scarring found on placenta after they had foaled but most of their placentas were pretty normal (some were on the heavy side too). This mare’s placenta looked “rotten” for lack of a better term. It was scarrred (white plaques) all over it, color was dark and brownish and tissue had varying thicknesses throughout. Mare was flushed, “cleaned” inside and out with heavy duty antibiotics and allowed to go through a few cycles before she was checked again to see if she was breedable that year. She was found to be “fine” and she took with one breeding back to the stallion (sire of her lost foal), Red Wine. She is doing great and due to foal in just a couple weeks and appears to be shaping up very normal like she did before the horror year.
Please, please tell me that this vet didn’t tear through and then failed to tell me. My goodness, if I could of prevented that nightmare if she had been honest, by putting and possibly keeping her on very strong antibiotics and possibly other supportive care I will want to starngle her. Not for making a mistake because as a farrier, I have made a mistake and quicked a horse especially when doing corrective work with little foot to work with or horse acts up etc… etc… but I never kept it to myself and would advise owners on how to treat the “quicked” area so it doesn’t abscess etc…If it meant losing a client so be it, I wanted the best for the horse. Thankfully this was a rare occurence and the owners were genuinely happy I was honest and helped them with treatment…
Again, please accept my apology and hi-jacking of thread, but if this supposedly well trained vet tore my “easy” mare should I consider doing my own ultrasounding. As with op the tearing is what has caused me to hold off until now.
Could someone PM me the information on attending courses in Alberta for U/S?
Very appreciated, thank-you
Kristine
I also am considering purchasing my own ultrasound for breeding. I do not have a large mareband - I breed between 4-8 mares a year. But, the vet costs keep rising (and price you get for foals/horses falling) I am looking for options to lower costs but be able to provide the quality of care for my horses. I already do my own inseminations and have been considering the ultrasound purchase for a few years. I was considering attending Dr. Kubiaks class in CA in April but, if Kathy is willing to offer it in the Midwest it would be fantastic 
Eowyn Brewer
Http://www.serendipitysporthorses.com
LJShorses, I am far from being a specialist and I hope Kathy will be more specific on your question. However I would be surprised a rectal tear could have affect the foal as this is very often fatal to the mare. It wouldn’t have taken weeks to have a reaction, it’s a matter of hours.
My vet came once with red gloves for a palpation and my first reaction was: What the heck is this, using red plastic gloves, you can’t see if there is any blood!!!
Now I provide my own transparent plastic gloves, just in case…
I think Kathy and Jos are either still in Ireland right now or maybe on a plane on the way back. I’m sure they’ll answer emails and post here soon as they are back.
I would think that your mare would have died if she only had TMS for a week after a rectal tear. I don’t know anyone who has entered enough mares rectally to be fetal sexing that couldn’t recognize a rectal tear and initiate appropriate “OMG” protocol. I’m very sorry for your loss.
It sounds like you were unlucky enough to have placentitis and neonatal isoerythrolysis. NI is not caused by “being exposed to crap” rather it is caused by antigens in the colostrum (which the foal then absorbs) attacking the foal’s red blood cells (which have inherited antibodies from the sire)
In my university course, we went over rectal tears, but were taught there are grades to rectal ranging from I (mucosa only) to IV (complete perforation). While grade IV’s have a low survival rate (25% based on the study we read), the grade I’s had over 93% survival rate with minimal treatment with the one horse that did die was due to unrelated circumstances.
We also had the opportunity to feel a rectal tear, grade 3a (serosa intact). It was in a cull dairy cow that was scheduled for slaughter. I felt bad for her, but the experience made it very apparent that one can tell quite easily feel when a serious rectal tear has occurred. When one swept a hand along the ventral surface of the colon, it was like a “handle” was there and your hand slipped into the tear. In dairy cattle, when AIing, one actually lifts and manipulates the cervix with your hand transrectally. It felt like someone was overly insistent when breeding this particular cow.
LSJ I am sorry to hear about your foal and mare. Ughhh 
Stargroom, the course is being put on by a friend and is full (there are only six spots). Perhaps he could be convinced to return if someone is able to host it? There seem to be a lot of Alberta breeders interested.
My apologies for not being on COTH much. As others noted, we were doing short courses across the pond with the last one in Ireland. We got home at 1 a.m. this morning, so I’m not fully functional but will do my best to answer a few questions here.
ljs, it would be highly unlikely that the rectal tear resulted in placentitis or any specific damage to the developing pregnancy. However, I would have been a bit more concerned about the vet doing nothing more. Hopefully she at least went back in to try and evaluate the tear? As noted, it is ALWAYS a possibility of a rectal tear whenever you go into the equine rectal and it may very well be due to no fault of the technician. But, we always, always, always teach no forcing, if the mare pushes against you, you don’t push back, etc. Gently, gently, gently!
We are doing one on one training with each training session tailored specifically to the individuals. We don’t take more than two people at once in order to insure that we “are” able to give sufficient one on one. We only do them at our farm in Oklahoma as we have everything needed right here - safe stocks, good quiet mares, and all the necessary equipment. Rates are $600/day per person with a $100/day discount currently being offered. We work with Universal Ultrasound so are able to chat with trainees prior to them coming down and can usually bring in an ultrasound within their price point to learn on and take home with them at the end. So, it works really well that way.
We’ve got several mares that we use for the training and switch them out often so that the trainees get the opportunity to try a variety of mares and so the mares remain calm and comfortable.
Dunamis, I’m not sure why we never received your email. Went back through our old emails and through the spam folder and no sign of it :(. Anyone interested can drop me an email at kathy@equine-reproduction.com
Agreed. In fact, there was a poster on COTH last year who was breeding her “heart” horse (a mare) as a replacement down the line.
First time breeding; dropped the mare off at the vet and next thing you know she was dead (the mare) from a rectal tear during palp.
So it most definitely happens. I make it a habit to trank ALL my mares the first few times they are palpated. Also my vet is a woman, so has smaller hands. And she makes sure she “gently” removes all the manure as she goes forward.
Donella,
Thanks tons. I am getting pretty decent but still need to figure out my own machine. If your friend is thinking of hosting another I would love to attend. Or perhaps we could host one at the farm in Edmonton in the future
Kristine
